Jump to content

You are again stuck on a deserted island...  

33 members have voted

  1. 1. You are again stuck on a deserted island...

    • Eat Foot
      17
    • Eat Spouse
      16


Recommended Posts

It's like I said before, it took some time for people to figure out where to lane Nitro & how to abuse her, so some nerfs are justifiable, balance-wise. Design-wise, she's still fine.

Let's see how she does next patch - you always have the option of banning her if you feel that she's oppressive.

Edited by ElementUser
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 262
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

The same poll.... Oh dear.   Oh yeah, the regular Balance/Design subforum rules don't apply in this thread (but the global forum rules still do). You can chat about almost anything you want

I'd love to. I think the main frustration factor with Adrenaline was mitigated when the change to his Q cooldown occurred. He is no longer able to create large one-sided fights with a 3>2.25&g

Let's rock and roll with Adrenaline. I've suffered enough testing that previous design, time to reap the rewards. Just so it isn't lost on Discord, can we please let Adrenaline cast his W outside

Most of the ban from SEA is Sil / Dark lady - peb - bubles - DR - Vindi/pesti. ( and nighthound by me)

In my game, the orther team always ban King Klout, Blitz/Engi cause i and my friend abuse those hero too much, lol ?

I rare see nitro get banned, she's not a problem for me even when she is picked 

HoN SEA Player

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 4 weeks later...

It saddens me the Staff of the Master's alternative naming is no longer a thing, doesn't it? If it was problematic to name all the boosted abilities, perhaps the community could lend their hand to propose a name on this thread: 

It's not like that thread implements the suggestions there, yet. Though, I admit the previous suggestion from the old forum got their implementation (if I correctly recall, the Kane's Staff was proposed there).

Well, I just share my thought because the forum is less active lately. Cheers.

Edit: I just realized the alternative name actually is still there but it only applies to sub-ability Staff of the Master gives.

Edited by datfizh

If anyone wonders about my intelligence regarding this game, then consider yourself visiting this thread:

Alternatively, visit this blog below to see the compiled version of the threads/posts I made on this Official HoN Forum:
newerthbrainstorm.blogspot.com

Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the trend is adding names back.

I definitely support this idea and I try to add them where applicable.

  • Thanks 1

I need to know something, Newerth. The way we used to be together... I... I don't mean lately, but before... It was real, wasn't it?

Link to post
Share on other sites

I'll try providing more info on the wiki for some unlisted heroes that already have their Staff effect in foreseeable future, probably after 1st December.

https://hon.gamepedia.com/Staff_of_the_Master

______________________________________________________________________

New Topic:

Spoiler

Sand Wraith proposed ability rework, replacing Enkindle:

Deserted

If there are more or equal Sand Wraith's illusion than enemy heroes in 500 radius to Sand Wraith, this passive deals 15/25/35/45 True Damage to enemy hero he hits.

Sand Wraith's illusion propagates this passive by 33% of the effectiveness.

Notes:

  • The illusions count their owner in their own radius detection as if their owner counts them.
  • The reduced effectiveness includes the True Damage on attack, the damage the illusion reflects and the amount of reflected damage.

Thought Process:

  • IMO, Sand Wraith's current passive only serves as a filler ability.
  • This suggestion pretty much brings back old passive with the mechanic supported by the current abilities.
  • This suggestion possibly encourages some of item builds he used to have.

 

Edited by datfizh
Sand Wraith raw idea

If anyone wonders about my intelligence regarding this game, then consider yourself visiting this thread:

Alternatively, visit this blog below to see the compiled version of the threads/posts I made on this Official HoN Forum:
newerthbrainstorm.blogspot.com

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 2 weeks later...

Nomad Rework (Written so it doesn't get lost)

"It's not the mountain that will stop you, but the grains of sand in your shoes."

Most of Nomad's problems revolve around the fact that he is hugely 1-dimensional and that there are no choices to how to use Mirage and True Strike (it's generally more effective to Mirage and then swing in while Invisible to get 2 full charged Wanderers).

This rework aims to alleviate those issues by granting him more options, more feints, without increasing his damage output.

Q - Sandstorm

[Same functionality as before plus the following]

People caught in the Sandstorm take some physical damage while they remain inside.

Sandstorm AoE increased, slow and speed buff increased, and duration increased.

Additionally, when a Sandstorm is created and a Mirage Strike is used, the Sandstorm attaches to and follows the Mirage to the target and then lingers at the location with whatever duration remains.

W - Mirage and True Strike

The skills now have 2 charges that are shared between the two of them. This allows a combination of Mirage + Mirage, True + True, Mirage + True, and True + Mirage.

Mirage Strike damage no longer deals Nomad's full damage and consumes the Wanderer charges to gain a critical effect.

True Strike no longer grants bonus attack speed on impact.

Neither skill is reset on kill but has a slightly lower charge cooldown than before.

 E - Wanderer

No functional changes. Damage bonus adjusted to function better with Mirage and True Strike.

 R - Edge Counter

No changes.

 

Reasoning: Basically this keeps the core idea of the hero while making Nomad a feinting trickster, a shadow moving through a desert. By adding interactions between Sandstorm and Mirage/True, Nomad can now gain additional versatility and spell usage. 

Picture this:

  • A Sandstorm is coming in then all of a sudden it rushes in quickly; you Stun expecting Nomad but bam he slices you up from behind.
  • Nomad sends his Sandstorm out attached to his Mirage. He hops from the location he started at to his lingering Sandstorm, buying some cover and granting him more effective range on his next True Strike.
  • Nomad sends out an illusion. Another Mirage. Gone.
  • Nomad uses his Sandstorm to travel in with the new duration, expecting just a Nomad he sends out the Storm only to reveal him and his allies and you being outnumbered.
  • Nomad, feeling emboldened by the tide of the fight, True Strikes a target, finds a further target and True Strikes again to build up Wanderer charges as he runs there.

The uses of Mirage and True in conjunction with the new Sandstorm allows for many more possibilities as well as an overall increase in skill. This plays into Edge Counter as well as the mobility he has and the movement that he needs to build to maximize Wanderer.

You might be asking, why even bother? The reason is that Mirage + an Invisible autoattack generally does more work than True Strike almost always. You very rarely cash in on the added attack speed due to Wanderer, effectively making the Mirage the Go-To option, which really doesn't fit the identity of the hero.

I've always found Nomad to be a hero with huge potential, and I would love to see this potential through.

Edited by Hubaris

I need to know something, Newerth. The way we used to be together... I... I don't mean lately, but before... It was real, wasn't it?

Link to post
Share on other sites

I mean I guess. The problem is that his skills are so 1 dimensional and that True Strike basically doesn't exist as a skill.

I need to know something, Newerth. The way we used to be together... I... I don't mean lately, but before... It was real, wasn't it?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Was thinking more about Cthulhuphant (a problem I have). I was going to post this in the Cthul thread but that thread is more for Balance than for possible fixes for it.

Quote

 

Cthuluphant - E
Shed Horrors

When taking physical damage, Cthuluphant deals physical damage back to attackers equal to 15 / 30 / 45 / 60 % of his Strength; or double for non-hero units.

Upon taking [VAL] physical damage a Sycophant is created at the location and puts E on a fast cooldown (think like 0.25-0.5 seconds like a Legio Spin). A Sycophant is an uncontrollable, immobolized tentacle Minion that attacks in melee range for [VAL] damage and lasts [VAL]seconds with [VAL] hit points. Sycophants can be Launched with Trample just like Creeps and take Area Damage like Minions.

Activate E to cause all Sycophants to pull a nearby enemy in, apply a Restrain and deal some minor damage; putting E on cooldown for [VAL] seconds.

 

Something like this can have some very unique utility when mixed with Dreams of Madness to draw people in, create launch targets, and then keep them tied up in a horror of eldritch slaps. It would also grant him a strange way of battlefield control with counterplay. He loses hard to magic and area damage but does very well against physical dealers and single target compositions.

Additionally, make it when people are Mad from Dreams of Madness they take -Armor as they let their guard down. This synergizes heavily with E and makes it better without really making it too good in normal circumstances.

Hero has so much design room and it makes me so upset that his potential is always lost.

I need to know something, Newerth. The way we used to be together... I... I don't mean lately, but before... It was real, wasn't it?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Can we get a DR nerf again. The hero is incredibly frustrating given how badly he invalidates positioning. It's impossible to position safely and out of initiation range, even if you have PK, because he will always get you; while Pharaoh can do this too DR can actually escape after killing you. Plus DR bursts for a lot more than Pharaoh. It's especially nonsense when he's got a regen rune and can ulti THROUGH your team to do damage while invulnerable.

The bugger's at 57% win rate, #1 among all heroes in Garena, FWIW.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Are you finally at least even a little bit happy that Pebbles got "a nerf"?

 

For DR, how do you suggest we "nerf him" without removing the flavour that makes the hero unique (i.e. practically a 0 second cooldown blink gated by mana)?

 

Also, Adrenaline.

Edited by ElementUser
Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, ElementUser said:

Are you finally at least even a little bit happy that Pebbles got "a nerf"?

 

For DR, how do you suggest we "nerf him" without removing the flavour that makes the hero unique (i.e. practically a 0 second cooldown blink gated by mana)?

 

Also, Adrenaline.

I'm happy.

But then again, I think that you've been on the right track with a lot of this despite the mass hysteria.

I need to know something, Newerth. The way we used to be together... I... I don't mean lately, but before... It was real, wasn't it?

Link to post
Share on other sites
47 minutes ago, ElementUser said:

I mean, some competitors who play Pebbles a lot complained that it was too much of a nerf. So....who can tell what's "right" these days anyway?

Yeah but people who play heroes will always find a reason to complain. There is inherent bias.

Death's Halo on Adrenaline is a little wack, I don't think it needed the 20% damage for 1 second duration aspect to it.

I need to know something, Newerth. The way we used to be together... I... I don't mean lately, but before... It was real, wasn't it?

Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, ElementUser said:

I mean, some competitors who play Pebbles a lot complained that it was too much of a nerf. So....who can tell what's "right" these days anyway?

Merge the servers and problem solved. After all, Zlapped is on record for saying he only learned how broken DR was after he moved to Garena.

How to fix DR, ideas:

- Make the amount of mana drained proportional to the distance travelled. Make the mana drain especially heavy If he travels more than the standard PK distance.
- Could also make it so that the amount of mana drained scales with how many times his ult is cast in unit time. I suspect this is less good than the above.
- Make his ult do damage in an AoE around the point where he arrives. Right now he damages everything he moves through.

Reactions to the patch notes in another post, although I will stress that 1) I'm playing significantly less HoN these days and 2) patch is not live on Garena yet.

Edited by Sorais
Link to post
Share on other sites

Kneejerk Adrenaline Thoughts:

Hero requires so many different stats for so many different things (which is fine), but the rewards are currently a little low. He needs Health to sustain Death's Halo and his initiation role, he needs regen to sustain massive Q spam and his low mana pool, and of course Agility so he can wail on people and make Q scale a little.

One of these needs to be eased a little, not by much mind you. Q costs way too much currently so a minor buff to it's mana cost would help. After that, something minor like Halo's duration being less shoddy or some kind of extra Agility Scaling on W or E would help a lot (I vote for extra magical Cleave damage based on his Agility). That's really it from a first few day's perspective.

His laning is abysmal, but the payoffs are not high enough just yet. He is kind of on the precipice of being really solid but needs a push to justify the incredible amounts of farm in a sidelane (as obviously midlane Adrenaline doesn't work with how Q is designed). While he can do some damage with a partner like Glacius or someone (with a pull combo), he doesn't really justify the gold sink.

At a minimum he needs a Portal Key, Boots (Sorcery or Steams) and some kind of Regeneration Item (Sunder, Nome's, etc). Items that fill multiple parts of his objective (Dawnbringer, Icon) are more valued than ones that don't (Geo's, Bola, Wingbow).

Anyway, tl;dr:

He needs minor buffs to make his gold load a little more appealing or less burdensome. 

I need to know something, Newerth. The way we used to be together... I... I don't mean lately, but before... It was real, wasn't it?

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 12/1/2020 at 10:32 PM, ElementUser said:

 

For DR, how do you suggest we "nerf him" without removing the flavour that makes the hero unique (i.e. practically a 0 second cooldown blink gated by mana)?

The broken thing on DR ain't his Ult and travel abilitys, it's actually the E doing way to much DMG for literally nothing. You can literally kill any non STR hero at Mid at lvl 7 and there is nothing they can do about it. E does way to much DMG and that's his issue.

Link to post
Share on other sites

About pebbles

Should we increase mana cost of W when he learned ultimate?

I mean, peb's ultimate increase damage of W with no cost, and the mana cost of Q W didn't change in mid/late game, make peb too easy to play with just a small stat or max mana increase with bottle or level up

Link to post
Share on other sites

Just a random ideal come out when I seeing Apex:

What if we rework Apex skill similar to the old Draconic

 - Skill 1: A nuke skill with slow

 - Skill 2: Burning Ground (Buff ms speed and leave burning ground behind when move)

 - Skill 3: Burning Hand (attack or cast skill leave a burning ground which is slowed enemies stand on it)

 - Skill 4: Current Ultimate with some change?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi. I'll be brief. xemplar items: Barrier Idol 3650, Geometry's Bane 5200, Staff of the Master 4200(all 13050) VS Arcane Bomb 1650, kills all illusions(80%+any mass skill). Please change the cost of Arcane bomb to this cost(13050 golds). Or 5000-6000 golds. 1650 is not funny. Arcane Bomb control all items on Xemplar. This hero is useless

Link to post
Share on other sites

DR is bull****. I hate the hero so much, even in MW. I suppose he wouldn't be so ridiculous if he could not buy Nullstone/Shrunken Head, but of course he can, and then some heroes just have literally no way to fight him anymore. Like, say you're Forsaken Archer and that guy ults next to you. What are you supposed to do, press Shrunken? He ults away, waits out your Shrunken, then comes back. You are realistically not hitting your Q on him either. So fun.

Here's another idea to solve the issues with DR: make his ult cooldown dependent on the distance travelled. Up to, say, 600 distance it can have effectively no cooldown. Beyond the standard PK distance, it should be at least two seconds long, possibly more.

Link to post
Share on other sites

You are painting DR like he has infinite mana that can jump away from your SH then jump back on you and do whatever he wants on you...

if a SH FA is getting picked off by a DR it means that he's playing in dangerous positions and deserves to be punished

Link to post
Share on other sites

Buy Nullfire Blade.

DR doesn't have infinite mana. I can agree he's strong but he needs so much farm for that payoff.

I need to know something, Newerth. The way we used to be together... I... I don't mean lately, but before... It was real, wasn't it?

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 3 weeks later...

Posting this here before I forget, going to make a formal thread soon-ish.

Regarding Kane and Balance of Power (Mostly).

Quote

 

Balance of Power is hardly balanced and the hero is basically a walking Creep when his short range Ultimate is on cooldown. Waylay is his only real skill, and for a hero with two stances only one really scales well as the other basically just grants armor.

Offensive
Critical chance that scales geometrically as the game goes on. Mana Regen which is harder to buy, and also allows for people with heals to sustain the heals that Defense can offer.

Defensive
Armor that scales logarithmically as more armor is worse and worse, and armor in general becomes gained as people gain levels, auras, items, and Agility. Health regeneration is alright outside of combat when laning but is an easier stat to gain (as most people need Strength or Regeneration of some kind anyway).

If you really wanted to gain more survivability, Offensive aura grants good lifesteal opportunities as well as the virtue of killing your opponent faster. Kane does not want to be fighting longer than he has to because all he offers is Waylay, additionally BoP-D only offers armor (half of what could possibly be killing you) while BoP-O helps kill the one stat that needs to hit 0.

Basically, the Hero does nothing when R is down, Waylay doesn't justify enough power in his kit to give him effectively 2 passives (one of which basically never swaps late game). Balance of Power is two skills in one, but it really isn't as one's scaling is actually so bad that it falls off naturally as the game progresses as the other continues to improve. A hero who wants to switch Stances midfight... But doesn't really gain benefit from doing so. It also takes so long for BoP to switch over, by the time you need to vanguard for your team you've lost 5s of possible critical damage, there's 0 interesting way to use BoP in it's current iteration.

None of this even takes into account Steel Resolve, which really prefers you to have more Attack Damage and Critical as opposed to some Paltry Armor. Like, why do I want +8 Armor when they're already doing -80% damage to me? When the other option is to Critical them in the face with their own damage?

 

I need to clean this up, but yeah, Kane needs some work.

I need to know something, Newerth. The way we used to be together... I... I don't mean lately, but before... It was real, wasn't it?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...