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Nomad Buff


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1 hour ago, Yuffie said:

"He’s week in week out top 10 highest loss percentage."

Google

(week in, week out)

every week without exception.

The question is, why did you choose Nomad over the other 10 highest loss percentage heroes?

I think the loss percentage isn't enough to be a reason.

If anyone wonders about my intelligence regarding this game, then consider yourself visiting this thread:

 

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Because he is consistently top 10 highest loss. Unlike the other 9 heroes.

Loss percentage isn't enough of a reason for a hero to be changed? Nitro was the lowest win percentage hero for months before he was changed. Should we revert him back to the Mauser days?

Why do heroes like Predator deserve a staff buff but heroes like Nomad are getting nerfed stats per level when he has consistently lowest win percentage.

Edited by Yuffie
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29 minutes ago, Yuffie said:

Because he is consistently top 10 highest loss. Unlike the other 9 heroes.

Loss percentage isn't enough of a reason for a hero to be changed? Nitro was the lowest win percentage hero for months before he was changed. Should we revert him back to the Mauser days?

Why do heroes like Predator deserve a staff buff but heroes like Nomad are getting nerfed stats per level when he has consistently lowest win percentage.

It's about priorities. Nitro was sitting at the very bottom for ages and got changed after a long time. Nomad is still a viable hero - he wasn't changed too much and despite his win rate still a good hero. There is no urgent need to change him and I haven't seen any requests to do so (besides yours). If his stats stay low he might get buffed in the future. Feel free to make proposals to a decent staff effect but staff alone won't bring him up with regards of win ratio (and heroes should not be balanced around a possible staff effect)..

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Hopefully he gets a buff in the near future. Obviously he wouldn't get all of these; but just ideas that will make him more effective late game against other carries. A hero having the staff effect does bring up their win percentage. Take Moon Queen for example her previous staff buff was overpowered and quickly changed.

Staff Ideas

1st Ability - Sandstorm will have a non-targetable effect when activated.

2nd Ability - True Strike Increased Damage and Attack Speed. // Mirage Strike sends to multiple units creating multiple illusions

3rd Ability - He doesn't need to charge the skill before getting the 2.2x Critical Strike

4th Ability (Ultimate) - Counter attack sends a shockwave AOE in all directions 1000 range.

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Nomad doesn't need anything extra like a SOTM or a rework. He's a hit and run style hero, and his kit lets whoever plays him do exactly that. If anything, unnerfing his ult to how it originally was (30 sec CD at lvl 3) may make him more consistent.

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On 11/11/2020 at 1:11 AM, Yuffie said:

Because he is consistently top 10 highest loss. Unlike the other 9 heroes.

Loss percentage isn't enough of a reason for a hero to be changed? Nitro was the lowest win percentage hero for months before he was changed. Should we revert him back to the Mauser days?

Why do heroes like Predator deserve a staff buff but heroes like Nomad are getting nerfed stats per level when he has consistently lowest win percentage.

Okay, I stand corrected. Though, he's pretty much hard to get any buff without making him too powerful. At least you could share your problems when playing Nomad or against him so probably you could suggest what kind of buffs he really needs, assuming he's weaker at moment based on win rate.

If anyone wonders about my intelligence regarding this game, then consider yourself visiting this thread:

 

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I agree nomad is underperforming atm but i would rather have him in this stage he is now than before the nerf he got when he was a snowballing machine.

Maby its just we are still used to him being overpowered so now he feels weak.

 

 

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On 11/10/2020 at 7:44 PM, hegelsohn said:

It's about priorities. Nitro was sitting at the very bottom for ages and got changed after a long time. Nomad is still a viable hero - he wasn't changed too much and despite his win rate still a good hero. There is no urgent need to change him and I haven't seen any requests to do so (besides yours). If his stats stay low he might get buffed in the future. Feel free to make proposals to a decent staff effect but staff alone won't bring him up with regards of win ratio (and heroes should not be balanced around a possible staff effect)..

 

On 11/10/2020 at 7:11 PM, Yuffie said:

Because he is consistently top 10 highest loss. Unlike the other 9 heroes.

Loss percentage isn't enough of a reason for a hero to be changed? Nitro was the lowest win percentage hero for months before he was changed. Should we revert him back to the Mauser days?

Why do heroes like Predator deserve a staff buff but heroes like Nomad are getting nerfed stats per level when he has consistently lowest win percentage.

both of you are forgetting that Nitro wasn't changed because of her low Winrate. In fact I seem to recall it being mentioned just about perfect for her.
She was reworked because the Mechanics she had were effectively not only absolute overkill but also gamebreaking.
A hero that FACTUALLY consisted of two heroes, was able to melee you with increased damage while her ranged counterpart was lasthitting and dealing damage to you too, albait out of even your own attackrange as a ranged hero, being able to harass opponents she had literally no vision on, outrun them, slow them, deal burst damage on insane range, deal aoe damage on EVERY autoattack and have physical evasion additionally... oh and lets not forget Mausers insane attackspeed early game.
The hero was as broken as they come and the only reason for it's low winrate was that for the majority of playerbase she wasn't rightclicky enough  on lower brackets (see flint being picked every other game or so) and on the actual higher brackets people knew how to efficiently shut her down.
her ONLY winrate came from stomping lower brackets, otherwise she might have sat at 0% even.
They tried to fix her last patch and I was actually quite interested to see if it worked, but now she has different issues that pull the exact same frustrational factors at the end.

So don't confuse that they mare share a thing or two as their position within the game and heropool, for the reason of why they were or should be remade.

in case of nomad, people that go mid way too often rush shroud or build a 30 minute cleaver and then get shroud and maybe lifesteal or frostburn or shieldbreaker... that is part of why they dont accelerate their lategame and lose.
in case of shortlane nomads sadly enough its usually the same mistake.
the hero has two invisibility spells...
you wouldnt build shroud on a nighthound every game, nor on valk or scout...
so why do it on nomad?
pk + damage do the same and while you may not be able to oneshot supports with a pk, you most certainly have better odds of a succesful gank with pk + veiled rot on any decent bracket, than with a shroud.
shieldbreaker being an absolut ass item that has to be upgraded 3 times to be "okay" in midgame when it is ment to be replaced in mid or lategame is another thing that contributes to nomads demise, thus, get some raw damage and harkons. makes you less effective during immunity times but more effective in total.

the hero DOES need a little push, i absolutely agree, i even made my own suggestions.
i just wanted to respond particularly to something that was said and point out that you are under a misconception there, and also provide some additional food for thought^^

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If I remember correctly Nitro couldn't shoot if Mauser was disabled/silenced so he is not "Factually" two heroes and if Mauser was too far away she couldn't recall him.

The reason why people get Shroud on Nomad is because when he comes out of invisibility, he hits the critical (2.2x) with the 125 Bonus dmg from Shroud for 3200 Gold. 

Valkyrie and Night Hound do not have such properties as a Critical for Shroud to be effective on them. Scouts cooldown on his Vanish is 6 seconds. This is a reason why you wouldn't get Shroud on Scout. If you use Shroud it has a 20 second cool down, you stay in invisibility for 11 seconds. Which means Shroud essentially has a 9 second cooldown. Scout can almost go invisible 2x before 1 Shroud instance.

When you say "pk + damage" does the same thing, PK is 2250. Which damage item that costs 1000 Gold would you be able to purchase will provide 30 damage and +10 attack speed along with 125 Bonus damage? Shroud and PK give similar ganking potential so the invisibility on the Shroud is irrelevant.

Also veiled rot is 100 Gold; and after you purchase 5 in a row it's a 3 minute cooldown for each veil. Not to mention that you are sharing those veils with your team.

 

The only reason why Nomad wouldn't be buffed in my opinion is that he isn't considered a carry. Nomad is a hero that cannot thrive well in long lane or mid. Therefore he needs to take short farm to possibly "snowball". This hero is not made to fight other carries well. Maybe theres a misconception that Nomad is a carry resulting in this hero to suffer in win percentage week in week out.

Right now Nomad is a hero thats constantly played. Nomads play-rate will go down once people realize his ineffectiveness on a team.

Nomad currently sitting at 5th lowest win percentage. 11/18/2020

 

(If Nomad is not considered a carry then please ignore this post.)

I believe that every hero is made specifically for their role. It would be silly if I was asking for Empath to have carry potential.

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On top of what we are talking about he feels stale and often underperforms when coming out of the short lane if the enemy carry is equally farmed. 

I would love to see Sandstorm being reworked. Maybe Sandstorm would stun for 1.5 seconds if an enemy has been in the sand for 2 seconds. Something like that, so he gains a bit more "catch" and maybe a bit more lane presence. 

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  • 3 weeks later...

Sorry I haven’t played in a while but isn’t Nomad the number 1 hero for smurfs to play to go mid and stomp? As far as I can see he is stronger now than he was say 2017 and 2018 with increased damage, stun, reduced cool down on his ult, as well as higher crit?
I still have bad memories of shieldbreaker nomads in normal mode wrecking teams early on and getting immortals? And isn’t he like the best last hitter with his nonsense extra damage on creeps such that can’t even deny him? Let’s see what was it, almost 100 auto attack damage against creeps at level 1?
 

So how the heck that this Nomad that we have now that has stronger skills back then has a bad win rate when back then he was 50.4%? I always believe the hero was overpowered, so what changed?

His sandstorm didn’t slow before, his true strike and mirage strike do more damage. All his skills are stronger than before so how is it the hero is ‘crap’ now?

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4 hours ago, JohnDang55 said:

Sorry I haven’t played in a while but isn’t Nomad the number 1 hero for smurfs to play to go mid and stomp? As far as I can see he is stronger now than he was say 2017 and 2018 with increased damage, stun, reduced cool down on his ult, as well as higher crit?
I still have bad memories of shieldbreaker nomads in normal mode wrecking teams early on and getting immortals? And isn’t he like the best last hitter with his nonsense extra damage on creeps such that can’t even deny him? Let’s see what was it, almost 100 auto attack damage against creeps at level 1?
 

So how the heck that this Nomad that we have now that has stronger skills back then has a bad win rate when back then he was 50.4%? I always believe the hero was overpowered, so what changed?

His sandstorm didn’t slow before, his true strike and mirage strike do more damage. All his skills are stronger than before so how is it the hero is ‘crap’ now?

His Sandstorm pretty much always slowed, his Mirage/True Strike used to be better because Wanderer wasn't ass like it is now. 

Additionally, the revelation that Plated Greaves are good, that there are tankier heroes in general (as an example, Pharaoh went from 2.2 Strength per level to 3.2), and because one of his main winning points (move speed to get to Runes) was mitigated by the fact that there are multiple Runes now. There's a lot more, like Shieldbreaker being really strong when he was at his prime, and a completely different metagame of popular heroes.

Nomad is a hero with only 2 actual skills (Mirage Strike and Ultimate), using anything else is suboptimal. Invisibility isn't really that great in mid to higher tier games, and being only 1 damage type (Physical) with an Ultimate that requires play/counterplay to get value on is worse as players inevitably get better at the game.

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I need to know something, Newerth. The way we used to be together... I... I don't mean lately, but before... It was real, wasn't it?

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Sandstorm - Has been the same 

Truestrike/Mirage Strike - The damage on these skills have been lowered.

Wanderer - I could be wrong on this one - but I believe he used to have 2.4x instead of 2.2x

Edge Counter - Increased CD and Lower damage. (I believe the stun duration for his ultimate was higher before also)

 

On top of that they lowered Nomad's stats per level gain on INT/AGI/STR

 

Yes back in the day Nomad was strong, but considering all the changes with each hero and Nomad himself; he is no longer that hero you remember.

Compared to other mid-lane options Nomad is not viable for mid. A rev ward essentially cancels Sandstorm and the invisibility from Mirage Strike.

A decent mid will set that rev ward regardless if it's Nomad or not for the mid lane-ward that is placed usually on top of the hill.

Edited by Yuffie
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Nomad is a binary hero.

He either kills you instantly or doesn't do enough to be a threat.

Edge Counter either blows you up or does nothing.

Either he's invisible or not.

Here was a post I threw up in Balance Dump about how there is a lot of room to give him some oomph. A little self back patting but I'm very happy with the first draft.

I need to know something, Newerth. The way we used to be together... I... I don't mean lately, but before... It was real, wasn't it?

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After reading that - In my humble opinion

I believe that the Sandstorm would be too overpowered if it was larger, longer and gave Nomad more increased movement speed/slow. (The movement speed given is essentially a wind whistle - the slow is almost as much as a Frostwolf Skull 30% vs 35%)

I'm not really understanding how the True Strike/Mirage Strike would work based on the explanation. But Mirage Strike doesn't deal Nomads full damage. Mirage strike does the damage that it says along with the critical. If Nomad has 6 Doom Bringers his Mirage Strike would still do low damage.

 

Nomad struggles going into late game if he doesn't have an exponential lead against the other team. If he's going against a different carry with the same GPM as him he will have difficulties. 

He needs a push into late game if he is considered a real carry. The push would be a staff effect on his skills.  "Staff effects should not fix heroes."

This would not be "fixing" Nomad but it would be balancing him into the new meta days of HoN.

 

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How about giving him synergy between Q and E. Like while under Sandstorm effect charges will grow faster. Gain a charge for every 10/8/6/5 distance travelled. Since most of the time Sandstorm learned the last, it will shine at lvl 14 aka semiboost for mid to late game.

 

On 11/11/2020 at 6:33 AM, Yuffie said:

3rd Ability - He doesn't need to charge the skill before getting the 2.2x Critical Strike

It was 2.6x Crit damage.
 

 

6 hours ago, Yuffie said:

But Mirage Strike doesn't deal Nomads full damage. Mirage strike does the damage that it says along with the critical. If Nomad has 6 Doom Bringers his Mirage Strike would still do low damage.

It's more of an utility skill rather than damage.

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