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Just a suggestion here, seeing as you can't reset the stats on the website anymore for $20 (Which I personally think is extortionate) can't you lower the gold price or even make it purchasable with silver coins? Makes it more as an incentive for players to play more. Even more important now as you guys are no longer going to make a new season. Many thanks

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3 hours ago, ElementUser said:

No, HoN smurfs are way too prevalent. This reduces smurfs on accounts where people care about their avatars and such. 

 

You can keep wishing though ?

Yeah but the people doing that are clearly the hardcore gamers who have been loyal to the game for a significant amount of time. It's not like you're bringing in brand new players who've never played before. It just seems like the company is trying to milk every single drop out of the consumers before the game completely dies. How about giving back to the community that still play? 

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43 minutes ago, diabetis said:

I agree that the smurfing is unfair most of the times. But 2500 gold coins for a sub account or a stat reset? That's way too much, should be like 1000.

If people want to smurf, they will just create the throwaway account over and over again and it just makes FB lose some bit of money.

Also in some regions when you reach a certain rank, you will have to wait for 20-30 minutes to find a game.

Now imagine that half of those 9 other players you get in our game after those 20-30 minutes are playing on new smurf-accounts instead. That will probably make you wait for an hour or more.

I personally will rather wait for 2 hours to get a decent game than get games instantly with 5 players buying boots twice (because lack of knowledge) and the remaining ones getting 30/0 by killing those poor guys.
Granted that's a bit over-exaggerated, but you get my point. I want Quality over Quantity and having sub-accounts and stats-resets be that expensive is helping that a lot. And I believe that having this game-balance-quality is more beneficial for HoN than whatever additional money they could get from smurfs.

If people think that throwaway-accounts are good enough, they wouldn't pay 1000 GC either. So they would do that anyways.
Only people that care about their avatars and still want to smurf will complain about the increased price and they now have to make that decision, if they are willing to pay those 40$ to use their avatars on a new sub-account, play on their real rating or use a throwaway account.
Either way, if they decide to smurf, it will hurt, which is exactly what this price-increase was intended for.

Edited by manu311
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3 minutes ago, diabetis said:

For me personally - I have 15+ sub accounts, almost all of them are around diamond 2 with 80% winrate. And that's ok, but I want to play with my friends who are from US, I need a lower account because otherwise queue times sometimes takes 30 mins, or we don't find a game at all. And since most of my accounts are stuck, I would need to make a throw away account to play with them. Since my other accounts won't reset because there are no new seasons.

So I propose that the price for sub accounts and stat reset is atleast set to 1000 gold.

I get that. I got friends with around 6 ranks below me too. But I can still play with them with the same account I always do.

One option is to just only play one of your sub-accounts with those friends and keep it a bit lower that way. That's even easier if they have a sub-account only for you too ;-).

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2 hours ago, Silenso said:

Yeah but the people doing that are clearly the hardcore gamers who have been loyal to the game for a significant amount of time. It's not like you're bringing in brand new players who've never played before. It just seems like the company is trying to milk every single drop out of the consumers before the game completely dies. How about giving back to the community that still play? 

That's a pessimistic mindset. A more objective way to view it is that these players who keep on cycling through getting an account while also wanting to keep their account value while also outside of their actual skill bracket is making games less fun for everyone else in the games they are playing on their brand new subaccount.

1 hour ago, diabetis said:

I agree that the smurfing is unfair most of the times. But 2500 gold coins for a sub account or a stat reset? That's way too much, should be like 1000.

If people want to smurf, they will just create the throwaway account over and over again and it just makes FB lose some bit of money.

Also in some regions when you reach a certain rank, you will have to wait for 20-30 minutes to find a game.

I don't think anyone here has been in the shoes of someone who has managed a game before, so let me share some nuggets of wisdom from my experience while I was at the Frostburn Studios office in person:

Right now, it's not about maximizing profits or anything of the sort. It's about maintaining the player base. Limiting subaccounts for players who want to smurf but have their cake & eat it too (the account value of their cosmetics & avatars) is the correct move because it forces them to pay a premium for that service.

The core of the issue lies elsewhere, in that HoN's account value instrinsically does not have a good value, coupled with the fact that HoN is a free-to-play game. In other words, players who really want to smurf but don't want to pay money can do just that, by creating new accounts. Granted, there are some limiters, but despite that, HoN players don't feel like they lose much if they want to smurf & go to another one of their accounts.

There are only a few viable ways to properly resolve the issue & those take a lot of time as they are system-based solutions:
 

  • Make heroes have to be purchased again (but would need some kind of algorithm to make sure the older players retain the heroes)
  • Force new accounts to have to play through enough bot matches to deter smurfing

 

We will likely choose the second option, but these types of solutions to combat smurfing are in the works. However, any system-related work has an unknown ETA due to their level of complexity on different parts of the tech stack.

Edited by ElementUser
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For my 10 years of playing HoN, mostly MW now, I've never bought sub or reset. And I play game casually, but when someone new or my friends want to play, I have another acc, which I made maybe 2 years ago, without some stats or avatars. So, I don't really care much about those stuff, no need to flex with my avatars or whatsoever, just enjoy playing with friends.

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8 hours ago, ElementUser said:
  • Force new accounts to have to play through enough bot matches to deter smurfing

That would include sub-accounts too, yes? Not a terrible idea if so.

I'd also suggest:

  • Limit new accounts and sub-accounts to a set number of public matches before allowing ranked/matchmaking games.
  • Add an indicator in the pre-game team population interface which denotes when an account is a sub-account (hovering over this indicator would display the name of the parent account and a link to its profile).
  • Display the parent account (as link to the corresponding profile) of sub-accounts on the sub-account's profile.
  • Add new public game creation option to "Allow sub-accounts", along with a corresponding public game list filter "Sub-accounts: Allowed/Denied/All".

Although the above may be a bit 'draconian', it would enable other players to decide if they wish to have smurfs in their public games (nothing could be done about this in matchmaking).

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14 hours ago, T0x said:

I'd also suggest:

  • Limit new accounts and sub-accounts to a set number of public matches before allowing ranked/matchmaking games.
  • Add an indicator in the pre-game team population interface which denotes when an account is a sub-account (hovering over this indicator would display the name of the parent account and a link to its profile).
  • Display the parent account (as link to the corresponding profile) of sub-accounts on the sub-account's profile.
  • Add new public game creation option to "Allow sub-accounts", along with a corresponding public game list filter "Sub-accounts: Allowed/Denied/All".

Although the above may be a bit 'draconian', it would enable other players to decide if they wish to have smurfs in their public games (nothing could be done about this in matchmaking).

Your first suggestion is basically to bring back Unranked Games. That kinda works to reduce smurfing. But it also throws truly new players to the most cancerous games possible with a huge queue-time.
So you basically get the benefits of bot-matches but also problems I just mentioned.

The second and third suggestion does nothing since it's already pretty easy to detect a smurfing player by their stats if you care about it.

And the last suggestion is basically forcing an entirely different queue onto people once they have at least one smurf in their team. Which would increase queue-times for everyone by more than the current system.

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On 4/20/2020 at 4:05 AM, T0x said:
  • Limit new accounts and sub-accounts to a set number of public matches before allowing ranked/matchmaking games.
  • Add an indicator in the pre-game team population interface which denotes when an account is a sub-account (hovering over this indicator would display the name of the parent account and a link to its profile).
  • Display the parent account (as link to the corresponding profile) of sub-accounts on the sub-account's profile.
  • Add new public game creation option to "Allow sub-accounts", along with a corresponding public game list filter "Sub-accounts: Allowed/Denied/All".

You're basically suggesting to delete sub-accounts and stat resets, because everything you said is basically the reason we buy subaccounts

I have 17 subs, want to know why I buy them? I'll give you the reasons

1. Reduced queueing time - When I queue on legendary, some times it takes 30 minutes to find a game. Gold 1-4 has never taken me more than 10 minutes

2. Tryhard games - 90% of games on diamond 1+ are tryhard games. Same heroes, constant stress and strong early-mid game heroes abuse (there's basically magmus and geomancer every game). When we queue on a lower account, we have a chance to play a hero like magebane, for example.

3. Not being recognized - more than half of the games I play on this account have berserker banned. It's my favorite hero and I'm pretty good at it, and since people know they have better odds if I don't play it, they just ban it when they see me on the enemy team. I'm pretty sure this happens to more people. Also, it hasn't happenned to me for a few months now cause I always try to be nice to everyone, but sometimes you have that one guy who HATES you and, when you're on his team, just straight up plays terriblely.

4. Fresh start - Sometimes I still want to go to high MMR again, but your stats show 300 games with 50% win rate. So, to show you have improved over time, you reset your stats and become diamond/legendary again, showing 60 to 70% win rate and better KD

5. Different accounts for different roles/type of play - I have an account for each style of play I have. One account for solo queue, one for 2-3 queue only and even one where I only play as a short farming carry, or one where you only play as support, or mid... you get the idea. That helps me a lot on checking how good I am at each of the roles and how much of a difference it makes to solo queue or to queue in 2-3

The princess is always in another castle

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