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Is there a way to play against? Or do you just have to repick ?
1.FlurryOriginally Posted by MindBender
Is there a way to play against
2.Continue playing normally.
Vindicator is THE counter to Panda. His aura will rape you senseless.Is there a way to play against
The only counter for him mid game would be to muscle it out until you have your Shrunken Head, because while it's activated the aura will not affect you. However, his ult still does.
Honestly, either ban Vindicator, or just save yourself the trouble and not get Panda.
No, it still does damage.
Lots and lots of damage.
For the love of god, can we get someone in this thread who knows absolutely what they're talking about to clarify on all this base damage nonsense and how it affects Flurry.
ACTUALLY, I just tried this. Flurry DOES NOT increase in damage. What you're seeing is just Flurry doing Panda's NORMAL autoattack.
The debate is over, go home.
Last edited by who8myrice; 03-19-2010 at 10:52 AM.
Well of course he does, the point I'm trying to make is that the +45% damage from Flurry does not amplify the damage from direct +damage sources (ie, Doombringers).
Examples: Let's say Panda has a base damage of 100 (strength is already factored into this). You buy a Doombringer which gives +250 damage. 1 Flurry hit (with Flurry at level 4) will deal 100*1.45 + 250 = 145 + 250 = 395 damage.
Now let's suppose that there's a fictitious item which gives +250 strength; this adds onto Panda's base damage, so it would be amplified by the +45% Flurry damage, which gives (100 + 250) * 1.45 = 350 * 1.45 = 507.5 damage.
In general, Pandamonium's Flurry deals:
Total Damage + (0.45 * BaseDamage)
(Just like the tooltip implies)
I was thinking something similar too, but I did this with an allied Pharaoh & not an enemy one, so the knockback radius doesn't apply. Also unitwalking has no influence on this, I tried getting into the Wall of Mummies when Panda had unitwalking (so the space Pharaoh took up inside the wall wouldn't have mattered)
It almost seems as though the Mummies have a property that blocks entries from outside & doesn't have that property on the inside portion of the mummy (for allied units) for triggered movement similar to Panda's Flurry.
Last edited by ElementUser; 03-19-2010 at 01:29 PM.
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Look for my highlighted text (important information) and grey text (interesting but not required information).
Added clarification into the guide on Flurry, hope you don't mind I used your calculations and put it into the guide Element :P
Yeah, I know that's how it works Element, just the way I read it I thought you said +damage doesn't help flurries at all.
If you're going purely for damage on flurries, damage items are more than twice as cheap as strength so cost wise it's a better choice. Nonetheless, this doesn't really change his core at all.
There's no reason really to deviate from
Enhanced Marchers
2x Bracer
1x Power Supply
Shrunken Head
Teleport
I suppose it's just a debate on what would be his best luxury, I've actually found that getting a Mock of Brilliance can be a nice luxury, or a Behemoth's Heart.
Isanitarius can work pretty well but my main problem with it is you always leave fights with little health, so if you kill 3-4 in a fight you can't push towers down.
I have returned
shut the hell up sargo no you're bad and always will be
I would never mock on panda. Sometimes I follow what you listed, perhaps one less bracer for a faster shruken.
Why don't you consider bottle? He is a great ganker, and though you don't have long ranged stun (magmus/pyro), you could use the mana inbetween ganks and is a decent roamer.
Great guide.
Nice guide, now I have questions =D
I believe attack modifiers work with flurry, so I was thinking which life steal item would best fit him. Whispering helm to symbol of rage sounds great but only once upgraded to rage for the strength bonus, which would be a luxury. As the alternative, there is abyssal skull. The item says it increases base damage by 15%- would this increase also be part of the 45% increase to a max flurry? If so I think abyssal would be the low cost standard especially if your carry is ancient stacking. What do you think?
Last edited by darksart; 03-19-2010 at 11:58 PM.
Lifesteal is NOT needed. Actually, never get it. What's the point? You disable everyone you hit, so you take no damage. If you're really hellbent on taking a lifesteal, make a Symbol of Rage.
So, question: how much +strength do you have to get in order to do the +60 damage on flurry you would get from a Runed Axe? Just seems like the straight damage items are less expensive. Right now the only reason I don't get Runed Axe is because Shrunken Head is so absurdly core on Panda.
If you're smart with your mana you only need a Power Supply, if mana is a real problem then a bottle is a much cheaper choice than Runed Axe. The cleave aspect is useless, so you might as well compare it to shieldbraker.
Shieldbraker will make you hit harder than a Runed Axe would, and the only thing it lacks is the bad regen (It's based off your int which is pretty low as Panda).
I have returned
To much math for me to handle, but I will tell you an Insanitarius will give you much more damage using Flurry.
In fact, Behemoth's Heart's 35 strength makes you do as much damage as a Runed Axe.
Last edited by who8myrice; 03-20-2010 at 12:29 AM.
Flurry
1 strength = 1.45 damage
Face Smash
1 strength = 2.3 damage
I have returned
Ah, thank you for that. I'll add that into the guide too. Kudos for the helpful info.
Solving the equation 60 = 1.45*Strength will give you ≈ 41.4 Strength required.
@RogerDodger1 I'm not going to get into cost efficiency (gold/damage ratios) calculations since this is strategy & more than pure mathcraft applies. I suppose I did mis-word it a little bit, so I'll change the wording slightly.
Attack modifiers don't work with Flurry.
S2 Games: Dedicated employees serving dedicated gamers. Continuous development. Never-ending improvement.
-----------------------------
Tech Support and Customer Support: https://www.heroesofnewerth.com/support/
Look for my highlighted text (important information) and grey text (interesting but not required information).
Added some of Ele and Rodger's input into the guide.
Bump.
For Face Smash, it should be 2.2 & not 2.3; I think RogerDodger1 just made a typo there
S2 Games: Dedicated employees serving dedicated gamers. Continuous development. Never-ending improvement.
-----------------------------
Tech Support and Customer Support: https://www.heroesofnewerth.com/support/
Look for my highlighted text (important information) and grey text (interesting but not required information).
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