Thread: Dream Patch Notes 3.X.X (as of Oct. 22, 2013)

View Poll Results: What do you think about the proposed changes

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  • I like all/most of the changes

    3 13.04%
  • I like some of them, while others need tweaks

    9 39.13%
  • No comment.

    4 17.39%
  • I dislike some of them, so these need to be tweaked

    1 4.35%
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  1. #1
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    Dream Patch Notes 3.X.X (as of Oct. 22, 2013)

    Dream Patch 3.X.X (as of Oct. 22, 2013)
    (by The_CarRan)


    Highlights of the patch:

    -Artesia, Blood Hunter, Flint, Soulstealer, and Vindicator changes (among many others)
    -Codex rework
    -A large pool of new items (with the help of the introduction of Expermental Mode)
    -Much-awaited nerf on Logger's Hatchet
    -An attempt to reduce power creeping


    Changelog:
    Oct. 21, 2013: Introduction of the Dream Patch Notes, along with following tweaks shortly after.
    Oct. 22, 2013: Added Experimental Mode details. Various tweaks to the proposals, as well as new proposals such as SR, WH, Def, Slith, Pyro, etc. Added details on new items, as well as cancelling some of them.




    General:
    -Added Experimental Mode option to Matchmaking (unranked only)


    • Experimental Mode is a new mode which uses Forests of Caldavar to test some proposed changes on a wider scale.
    • Since items need more amounts of testing compared to heroes because of their ability to introduce a massive shift in metagames, Experimental Mode focuses on proposals of new items. By having a larger pool of testers, as well as a larger number of games to be analyzed, we can have various amounts of feedback in order to properly tweak items.
    • Do not worry about your stats here, since games here do not affect stats in any way
    • Still gives out coins (12 silver for wins, 8 silver for losses)


    Lane Creeps v.s. Neutrals:
    -Melee Creeps now deal 125% damage to Neutrals (from 150%)
    -Ranged Creeps now deal 125% damage to Neutrals (from 150%)

    Jungle:
    -Pull Camp now spawns either a Medium Camp or an Easy Camp



    Heroes:

    Accursed:
    *These changes are towards lessening Accursed's level dependencies, while also making him a more fluid hero to play as.
    -Cauterize cast time reduced from 1 to 0.7.
    -Fire Shield mana cost rescaled from 100/110/120/130 to 85/100/115/130
    -Fire Shield damage block/explosion damage increased from 110/140/170/200 to 100/140/180/220.
    -Fire Shield cooldown rescaled from 18/15/12/9 to 15/13/11/9


    Aluna:
    *Aluna's Power Throw is quite powerful in the early game, which lets Aluna have a cheap, reliable long-ranged damage output. These changes are towards toning down Power Throw's early game damage
    -Power Throw damage rescaled from 140/210/280/350 to 125/200/275/350


    Amun-Ra:
    *Small changes which point towards better early game survivability for Ra in exchange for decreased starting damage.
    -Starting STR increased from 21 to 22
    -Starting Damage reduced from 54-60 to 51-57


    Andromeda:
    *Andromeda usually sacrifices herself in place of an ally, making her aura useless during her respawn timer. This points towards Andromeda having the capacity to sacrifice herself without making her aura useless.
    -Dimensional Link now leaves an invulnerable shadow of Andromeda when she dies, letting her propagate her aura. The shadow is silenced, perplexed, and disarmed, and it lasts until Andromeda respawns or uses a buyback.
    -Void Rip cast range rescaled from 750/975/1200 to 800/1000/1200


    Arachna:
    *More or less an outdated hero, these changes now let Arachna have the chance to survive the initial burst when she gets caught out of position.
    -Webbed Shot cooldown reduced from 2/2/0/0 to 2/1/0/0
    -Harden Carapace can now be activated while Arachna is stunned.


    Armadon:
    *Armadon quickly disappeared from the scene after a series of nerfs. These changes are partially reverting those nerfs, along with a mild buff to Restless.
    -Armordillo extra Spine Burst release damage requirement reduced from 250 to 225.
    -Restless charges duration increased from 10 to 10/11/12.


    Artesia:
    *A forgotten hero with a lot of flaws and problems in the game. These changes increases Artesia's power, efficiency, and ease of use.
    -Increased starting armor by 1.75
    -Arcane Missile cast time reduced from 0.5 to 0.25
    -Arcane Missile projectile speed increased by 50.
    -Arcane Missile mana cost decreased from 90/95/100/105 to 95 for all levels
    -Arcane Missile damage increased from 100/140/180/220 to 100/145/190/235
    -Arcane Missile can now be casted while Dance of Death is channeling
    -Dance of Death mana cost reduced from 100/110/120/130 to 80/90/100/110
    -Arcane Bolts seeking range increased from 700 to 1000.
    -Arcane Bolts bolt release reduced from every 0.8 seconds to 0.5 seconds.
    -Arcane Bolts damage reduced from 25/40/55/70 to 20/35/50/65
    -Essense Projection mana cost rescaled from 200/300/400 to 180/290/400.
    -Essense Projection can now be cast while Dance of Death is channeling.


    Balphagore:
    *Added a Staff of the Master effect for 100 charges.
    -Added Staff of the Master on Hell on Newerth:
    *For all charges: Doubled the radius of Hell on Newerth
    *100 charges bonus - Spawns an additonal Volatile Minion beside each enemy hero hit.


    Blacksmith:
    *Increased Blacksmith's damage reliability, even without multicasts.Also aims to further reduce Blacksmith's item dependence
    -INT Gain increased from 2.1 to 2.3
    -Fireball damage increased from 100/150/200/275 to 100/160/220/280.
    -Flaming Hammer total damage decreased from 75/150/225/300 to 90/150/210/270
    -Chaotic Flames now passively increases the damage Flaming Hammer deals by 20/35/50.


    Blood Hunter:
    *Made him more reliable as a hero, while also making Hemorrhage more useful when the target decides to stand still.
    -Blood Crazy cast range increased from 650 to 800.
    -Blood Sense movement speed buff now lingers for 1.5 seconds after an affected unit dies or has its HP increased above the threshold.
    -Blood Sense radius increased from 1500/3000/4500/6000 to 2500/4000/5500/7000.
    -Hemorrhage now deals 20/30/40 superior magic damage per second when the affected unit decides to stand still instead of moving.
    -Hemorrhage now works with Tablet of Command.
    -Hemorrhage cooldown reduced from 70 to 70/60/50


    Bombardier:
    *These changes point to Bombardier's Sticky Bombs getting its maximum effect faster to make plays faster.
    -Sticky Bomb ticks reduced from 8 to 6.
    -Sticky Bomb incremental ticks time reduced from 2 to 1.5
    -Movement Speed increased from 300 to 305


    Bramble:
    *Bramble needed some reliablity in chasing down enemies and stunning them.
    -Spore Breath can now be re-activated to release its stun early, but this stun has a reduced duration of 1/1.2/1.4/1.6 seconds
    -Spore Breath normal stun duration increased from 1.75 to 1.75/1.90/2.05/2.2 seconds.
    -Combat Vigor applies its buff to Bramble whenever he casts an ability.

    Bubbles:
    *Reduced his utility a bit, as well as his overall damage.
    -Shell Surf damage reduced from 70/140/210/280 to 70/130/190/250
    -Song of the Sea silence reduced from 0.1/1/2/3 to 0.5/1/1.5/2
    -Song of the Sea damage slightly increased from 60/120/180/240 to 70/130/190/250

    Bushwack:
    *Bushwack seems to be too soft, especially in the early game, while letting Crippling Dart propagate to Splinter Shot gives him more firepower in clashes.
    -Starting Strength increased from 16 to 18
    -STR Gain increased from 1.6 to 1.7
    -Splinter Shot now propates to Crippling Dart, dealing 30/40/50/60% of its effects to all other enemy units within the cone of Splinter Shot.

    Defiler:
    *Just normalization, nothing to see here.
    -Wave of Death damage normalized from 100/175/250/300 to 105/170/235/300

    Electrician:
    *He was overnerfed, making him disappear from the scene. This changes aim to increase his early game presence, making him a deadlier roamer.
    -Static Grip damage per second rescaled from 20/40/60/80 to 35/50/65/80
    -Energy Absorption mana cost decreased from 75/100/125/150 to 75/95/115/135


    Emerald Warden:
    *These changes shifts his design focus to becoming a support hero with reliable damage sources from Wolves and Gawain.
    -Silencing Shot damage changed from 25/50/75/100 + Attack Damage to static 100/155/210/265
    -Hunter's Command mana cost decreased from 80/100/120/140 to 80/95/110/125
    -Hunter's Command damage decreased from 60/120/180/240 to 65/120/175/230
    -Overgrowth cast range increased from 400 to 500
    -Overgrowth hold duration increased from 1/2/3/4 to 1.75/2.5/3.25/4


    Flint Beastwood:
    *As a long-range carry who uses his range to his advantage, the increased number of gap closers made him obsolete. With these changes, he will gain an edge in fighting by having a tool to reposition himself or to increase his chances of escape in sticky situations. Money Shot also somewhat contradicts his "attack from long range safely" concept, since he needs to stop and channel this ability for great early damage but is mediocre in later stages of the game, so channeling time is reduced in later stages of the game in order to reduce Flint's downtime in attacking continuously
    -Explosive Flare initial damage rescaled from 25/50/75/100 to 40/60/80/100
    -Dead Eye now has an active component which can be activated to grant Flint Tree Walking for 2/2.5/3/3.5 seconds (no mana cost; cooldown of 18 sec.).
    -Money Shot channeling time reduced from 1.7 to 1.7/1.35/1
    -Money Shot mini-stun increased from 0.2 to 0.2/0.35/0.5
    -Money Shot now grants 50% experience when Flint kills the target outside exp. range through this ability


    Forsaken Archer:
    *Made her early game better for easier transition in the later stages of the game
    -Crippling Volley immobilize rescaled from 1/1.5/2/2.5 to 1.3/1.7/2.1/2.5
    -Crippling Volley mana cost reduced from 95/110/125/140 to 100/110/120/130
    -Agi Gain increased from 2.5 to 2.7


    Gauntlet:
    *This change encourages players to decide whether they go for earlier points in hook or in Enfeeble. Before, Enfeeble usually outshines Hook, making his hook a one-point wonder most of the time
    -Enfeeble charge gain decreased from 0.8/0.6/0.4/0.2 to 0.5/0.4/0.3/0.2


    Gravekeeper:
    *Made him a more reliable hero to use through a number of changes
    -Corpse Toss now has 2 charges by default for all levels.
    -Corpse Toss cast range increased from 500 to 600.
    -Corpse Toss stun per cast rescaled from 1 to 0.6/0.8/1/1.2
    -Corpse Toss damage per cast rescaled from 60/100/100/140 to 50/80/110/140
    -Corpse Explosion damage from 60 + 20/40/60/80 per corpse to 60/90/120/150 + 20/35/50/65 per corpse.
    -Defiling Touch slow duration increased from 1 to 1.5
    -Defiling Touch corpse collecton radius increased from 100 to 200


    Grinnex:
    *Grinnex's shadows are usually outrun by heroes after the 1st strike, so this change makes it harder to outrun the shadows
    -Illusory Assault shadows now have 750 speed during the whole duration. Shadows still attacks once per second.
    -Staff of the Master:
    *Shadows now have their attack damage equal to 65% of Grinnex' attack damage


    Gunblade:
    *Gunblade's problem is that he risks his positioning in order to increase his damage, especially with his Grappling Shot, so these changes aim to resolve that.
    -Grappling Shot now pulls the target towards you instead of Gunblade being pulled to the target.
    -Grappling Shot stun duration increased from 1 to 1/1.25/1.5. Attach and Restrain durations increased to 4/4.25/4.5 (no actual effect to actual duration of attach and restrain)


    Kinesis:
    *Made Kinesis a more reliable hero to use by slightly increasing the power of his abilities, as well as his movement speed
    -Movement Speed increased from 300 to 310
    -Stasis Smash damage increased from 60/120/180/240 to 100/150/200/250
    -Stasis Smash now does not reduce the damage done on enemies (previously 50%)
    -Stasis Smash cast range increased from 550 to 650
    -Telekinetic Control slow increased from 10/15/20/25% to 15/20/25/30%
    -Mass Control throw radius limit removed.


    Magebane:
    *With everyone being buffed for better early game, he simply cannot be left behind, but changes are small enough to not make him too powerful.
    -Mana Combustion rescaled from 16/32/48/64 to 22/36/50/64
    -Mana Rift cooldown rescaled from 120/100/80 to 110/95/80


    Martyr:
    *This change grants Martyr something to farm with, which partly solves his item dependency through increased farming capability
    -Retribution now deals half the damage to all enemy units that are 200 units around the target enemy. Slow is not applied.

    Magmus:
    *Slightly reduced his damage output, especially to creeps.
    -Lava Surge damage reduced from 100/160/220/280 to 100/155/210/265
    -Volcanic Touch now deals 75% of its damage to creeps. (Still deals full damage to heroes)

    Monarch:
    *Crippling Pollen is quite weak in its 1st level because its duration was too short, so its early levels were slightly increased to make it more useful. Added the
    ability to remove Chrysalis prematurely to make her more reliable and fluid
    -Crippling Pollen immobilize and silence duration rescaled from 1/1.5/2/2.5 to 1.3/1.7/2.1/2.5
    -Crippling Pollen cast range increased from 500 to 600.
    -Chrysalis can now be re-activated to dispel it.


    Myrmidon:
    *His early game is simply hampered by his slow attack swing, low armor, and low attack range, rendering him incapable of harassing enemies through attacks. These changes lets him attack at a safer range while also having increased physical resistance
    -Starting Armor increased from 1 to 1.35
    -Attack Range increased from 450 to 500
    -Agi Gain increased from 1.2 to 1.5


    Night Hound:
    *Made Night Hound's specialty of stealth more special by giving him the ability to bypass revelation
    -Invisibility now has a secondary active placed on the 'E' hotkey, which lets Night Hound have superior invisibility for 3/4/5 seconds. Units with Superior Invisibility cannot be revealed in any way. Cooldown: 30


    Nymphora:
    *Made Nymphora less level dependent by increasing her early game prowess and reducing some of her high mana costs
    -Volatile Pod damage/heal increased from 60/120/180/240 to 80/140/200/260
    -Grace of the Nymph mana restoration rescaled from 75/150/225/300 to 105/170/235/300
    -Nymphora's Zeal mana cost decreased from 120/135/150/165 to 105/120/135/150


    Pharaoh:
    *Slightly increased Pharaoh's efficiency by reducing his downtime and slightly increasing his damage
    -Hellfire cooldown reduced from 32/28/24/20 to 28/25/22/19
    -Tormented Soul damage increased from 80/120/160/200 to 80/125/170/215


    Prophet:
    *Gave him a small farming tool to use in order to farm up some items for his survival and utility, especially when he is heavily pressured in the early game
    -Shared Fate now propagates attacks enemy creeps within the Propagation Field.


    Pyromancer:
    *Reduced the power of his nukes in order to reduce power creeping. Made other changes to compensate
    -Phoenix Wave damage reduced from 100/170/240/310 to 100/160/220/280
    -Dragon Fire damage reduced from 90/150/210/280 to 95/155/215/275
    -Fervor now adds 3 charges to enemies hit by Pyro's spells instead of 1.
    -Blazing Strike cooldown decreased from 150/90/55 to 115/85/55


    Rampage:
    *Made Rampage more reliable after the previous nerf to his Stampede
    -Stampede cooldown reduced from 30 to 20
    -Stampede damage increased from 100/140/180/220 to 100/150/200/250
    -The Chains That Bind cast range increased from 200 to 275.

    Rally:
    *Reduced his power for all stages of the game, since he simply deals too much damage.
    -Compel damage reduced from 70/130/190/250 to 70/125/180/235.
    -Compel stun reduced from 1.25/1.5/1.75/2.0 to 1.2/1.4/1.6/1.8
    -Seismic Slam damage reduced from 400/650/900 to 350/625/900

    Salomon:
    *In the late game, his ultimate simply takes too long to cooldown. His ultimate is his way of bringing fights towards his team's favor, because his normal form brings close to nothing in teamfights
    -Wish for Revenge cooldown reduced from 150 to 150/135/120


    Shadowblade:
    *Fixed his flaw of not being able to freely switch forms, since switching forms also means removing the benefits the previous form had
    -Essence Shift now lets Shadowblade keep the bonuses its last form had for the remaining duration.
    -Essence Shift cast range now global (creates a visual on the casted target when cast).

    Slither:
    *Made some some buffs to his Q in order to increase his aggressiveness.
    -Poison Spray initial damage rescaled from 50/70/70/100 to 40/60/80/100
    -Poison Spray damage per tick rescaled from 10/20/40/50 to 14/26/38/50
    -Poison Spray cooldown reduced from 22/22/22/22 to 21/20/19/18

    Soul Reaper:
    *Slightly reduced his power-creeping capabilities, but added some changes to compensate.
    -Judgement damage reduced from 70/140/210/280 to 70/135/200/265
    -Demonic Execution damage increased from 40/60/90% of target's missing health to 50/70/90% of target's missing health

    Soulstealer:
    *These changes shifts his focus into a cast-heavy skillshot carry which brings heavy damage through his nukes by giving him some form of cast speed increase. This change needed Dread to be reworked, since Dread simply did not jive well with his skill set.
    -Dread reworked
    *Now passively increases Soulstealer's cast speed by 15/30/45/60
    *Every spell cast by Soulstealer applies a stacking -0.75/1/1.25/1.5 armor debuff to all enemies that are 900 units around Soulstealer for 4 seconds. Duration of charges refresh whenever charges are re-applied.


    Succubus:
    *Gave Succubus more anti-carrying capabilities, reducing the power of those pesky carries
    -In addition to Smitten reducing the damage output of the target, the affected unit also has a 15/20/25/30% chance to miss its attacks


    The Chipper:
    *Made The Chipper more fluid to use by increasing the speed of his Tar Toss. I believe he does not need much changes.
    -Tar Toss impact speed increased


    The Gladiator:
    *Reduced Call to Arms downtime, while also increasing the reward it brings when used properly
    -Call to Arms stun increased from 1 to 1/1.2/1.4
    -Call to Arms cooldown reduced from 100 to 90/85/80


    Tremble
    *Made Tremble more powerful in the early game since he relies too much on auto-attacks and close range to bring down foes
    -Terrorform mana cost reduced from 150/140/130/120 to 135/130/125/120.
    -Terrorform cooldown reduced from 60/50/40/30 to 45/40/35/30.
    -Impalers movement speed slow rescaled from 10/20/30/40% to 13/22/31/40%
    -Impalers Heal per attack now applied for every attack. (Bonus Magic Damage still is applied when the attack target isn't affected by Impalers within 2 seconds.)


    Tundra:
    *Slightly buffed Tundra's early game by reducing the cooldown of Cold Shoulder in the early game
    -Cold Shoulder cooldown rescaled from 24/20/16/12 to 21/18/15/12
    -Avalanche main target damage increased from 200/250/300 to 250/325/400.


    Vindicator:
    *Tweaked the flaws found in Vindicator in order to lessen his item dependency, while also making him a more powerful silencing hero
    -Brain Drain mana cost reduced from 70/90/110/130 to 80/90/100/110
    -Brain Drain damage increased from 50/100/150/200 to 70/120/170/220
    -Brain Drain passively grants Vindicator with +1 INT every time an enemy hero dies within 1000 units around him.
    -Final Chapter is now a global-scale radius silence, which bypasses Nullstone activations.
    -Final Chapter now also applies Brain Drain to all enemies globally, dealing damage and applying the debuff equal to Brain Drain's current level.

    Wrethched Hag:
    *Reduced her ability to farm creeps through Sonar Scream, and shifted some of the reduced damage to Haunt.
    -Haunt initial damage rescaled from 50/70/70/100 to 55/70/85/100
    -Haunt Haunted damage per tick tweaked from 10/20/40/50 to 10/25/40/55
    -Sonar Scream damage reduced from 85/165/225/300 to 80/140/200/260
    -Sonar Scream radius reduced from 425/450/475/500 to 450/450/450/450
    -Sonar Scream mana cost reduced from 140 to 135

    Witch Slayer
    *Slight adjustments to his power for the whole game
    -Graveyard damage normallized from 60/130/200/260 to 65/130/195/260.
    -Miniaturization mana cost reduced from 110/140/170/200 to 120/140/160/180
    -Silver Bullet cooldown reduced from 150/90/55 to 130/90/50





    Items:


    Returning Item:
    -Halberd (Decommissioned until further notice, but check this thread out for more details)


    New Items:
    -Tree Husk (STR): 1800
    -Encyclopedia (INT): 1800
    -Propeller (AGI): 1800
    -Crazy Light (+Atk Speed): 1400 -> Upgrades are still being evaluated (may be scrapped as well)
    -Pile Driver (SCRAPPED)
    -Book of Knowledge (SCRAPPED)
    -Monsoon Blades (SCRAPPED)
    -Tri-Force (uses Tree Husk+Encyclopedia+Propeller)
    -Gold Digger (uses Fleetfeet + Broadsword)
    -Nether Spear (Decommissioned until further notice)
    -Door Knocker (Decommissioned until further notice)

    Tree Husk:
    -Belongs to Accessories
    -Grants +17 STR
    -Cost: 1800

    Encyclopedia:
    -Belongs to Accessories
    -Grants +17 INT
    -Cost: 1800

    Propeller:
    -Belongs to Accessories
    -Grants +17 AGI
    -Cost: 1800

    Crazy Light:
    -Belongs to Relics
    -Grants +35 Attack Speed
    -Cost: 1400

    Tri-Force:
    *Do you have attribute points which you simply do not benefit much from? Wait no more, for this will instantly let you benefit from those seemingly wasted attribute points.
    -Belongs to Modified Attack
    -Grants +20 to all attributes
    -Passively increases the wielder's damage by 25% of the sum of his attributes (Contains an attack modifier)
    -Components: Tree Husk (1800) + Encyclopedia (1800) + Propeller (1800) + Recipe (700) = Tri-Force (6100)
    -Cost: 6100

    Gold Digger:
    *The purpose of this item is to let Agility carries who solely depends on attack to farm get his/her farm faster, as well as have a reliable, early item which provides good damage output. This may be used by other carries, but the main customers of this item are AGI Carries who do not have an innate farming capability.
    -Grants +8 AGI, + 20 Damage
    -Passively increases gold gain from 1 per second to 1.5 per second.
    -Components: Fleetfeet (450) + Broadsword (1200) + Recipe (350) = Gold Digger (2000)
    -Cost: 2000

    __________________________________


    Codex
    *By reducing the unskillful burst damage Codex brings in order to quickly take down enemies, enemies now have the capability to retaliate before they die off. Made some improvements as well to compensate for the changes.
    -Made damage from 400/500/600/700/800 instant to 200/250/300/350/400 instant + 200/250/300/350/400 damage spread over 5 seconds.
    -Mana Cost reducred from 180/160/140/120/100 to 160/145/130/115/100
    -Recipe Cost reduced from 1000 to 850


    Energizer
    *Energizer just seems too good for its cost and buildup, so we made some changes, as well as putting abusing multiple Energizers for big speed boosts within the team.
    -Reverted recipe from Soulscream Ring + Pretender's Crown (2x) + Recipe to Soulscream Ring + Major Totem + Recipe
    -Increased given stats by 1 (Now 11 Agi, 8 Int, 8 Str)
    -Reduced Recipe Cost from 600 to 500
    -When activated, all units affected by Energizer cannot be affected by Energizer again for 15 seconds.


    Logger's Hatchet
    *Logger's Hatchet usually skews last hits in favor of Melee heroes, making it harder for Ranged heroes to take some creeps. These changes aim to partly resolve that
    -Melee atatck damage increase decreased from 32% to 25%
    -Ranged attack damage increase increased from 12% to 15%
    -Added Short Range version, which applies to heroes that have attack ranges from above 128 to below 400 (128 < short range version < 400). Short Range attack damage increase is 20%
    -While this ability is on cooldown, it no longer increases the attack damage of the wielder.
    -Decreased cooldown of tree-cutting from 15 to 10
    -Decreased cooldown of throw-attack from 30 to 20
    -No longer works on denies.

    Mystic Vestments
    *A cost-effective item which reduces a chunk of magic damage all game, even when it is used alone. A small increase in price wouldn't hurt much, I think...
    -Increased cost from 500 to 550
    Last edited by The_CarRan; 10-22-2013 at 02:52 AM. Reason: Made a number of changes for Oct. 22 Version

  2. #2
    /rant

    Vestments nerfed a bit more - suddenly, lifetube + vestments isn't standard but alternative choices!

    32% extra damage on hatchet not working on denies - many long forgotten ranged and int heroes in particular now viable in lane because they aren't being made unviable because of a 225 gold item during the laning phase.

    Still no pulling revert/changes - because they make suicide heroes virtually godlike.

    There, a chunk of the hero pool opens up again.

    /rant

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by khaz View Post
    /rant

    Vestments nerfed a bit more - suddenly, lifetube + vestments isn't standard but alternative choices!

    32% extra damage on hatchet not working on denies - many long forgotten ranged and int heroes in particular now viable in lane because they aren't being made unviable because of a 225 gold item during the laning phase.

    Still no pulling revert/changes - because they make suicide heroes virtually godlike.

    There, a chunk of the hero pool opens up again.

    /rant
    For Vestments, I'll think about it, since nerfing Vestments too much would skew the game in favor of nukers.

    For Hatchet, I think I'll put that in, along with the other changes.

    For Pulling, I still do not know what to change there, but it may come a bit later in the General section.

    EDIT: Added in the Vestments nerf and Hatchet nerf

  4. #4

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clytemnestra View Post
    You really buff cd?
    Well, the changes are quite small, I think

  6. #6
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    Small changes make the difference.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clytemnestra View Post
    Small changes make the difference.
    So, is it a good change or a bad change?

  8. #8
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    Define good.

    The hero is fine as he is, but quite strong atm., why would you buff him even more?

  9. #9
    Those changes make CD go from good to broken. I'd recommend taking CD out of this patch entirely. He is currently in a very good place and doesn't need to be tinkered with. He has all the strengths and weaknesses a hero of his role needs.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clytemnestra View Post
    Define good.

    The hero is fine as he is, but quite strong atm., why would you buff him even more?
    Quote Originally Posted by khaz View Post
    Those changes make CD go from good to broken. I'd recommend taking CD out of this patch entirely. He is currently in a very good place and doesn't need to be tinkered with. He has all the strengths and weaknesses a hero of his role needs.
    Alright, removed the buff to CD entirely

    EDIT: Also, I made small changes (nerfs) to changes proposed for Myrmidon, Night Hound, Andromeda, and Soulstealer.

    EDIT 2: Added two new General changes, Lane Creeps V.S. Neutrals and Pull Camp

  11. #11
    Taking away the ability instagib people with my codex? No way.

    Thumbs down on everything.
    /join collude in game if you want to queue together and work together in prophets

    Accepting applications for my clan. /join Clan Im Scout IRL
    You must have at minimum 1 prior suspension for something trolling related to join :)

    CJXander cannot be stopped

  12. #12
    Make a billion suggestions, no one can respond to them all. Ah well, I'll try anyways:

    Aluna - It's already losing 14 damage per unit struck, so pushing it through an early creepwave = 56 less damage dealt for 94, which is acceptable for an AoE skillshot that does nothing else at rank 1. Nerfing the damage to 110 results in 44 less dealt for a measly 60 damage nuke. While yes, it is possible to hit an opponent without hitting any creeps, that's where positioning is supposed to reward the aluna player/punish the opponent.

    Artesia - This fixes effectively nothing. Can cast while using Dance of Death and some number juggling is meaningless when the hero is still pigeonholed into going exactly one skill build or fail. Doesn't address the subpar farming efficiency compared to other AoE magic casters or the horrendous mana efficiency which is so bad that the hero cannot complete a single combo even at full mana at 6.

    Balphagore - Meaningless change that would result in no one picking up SotM. While I would like to see Balph get more effect per charge after 80, I doubt doubling up the AoE at the low price of 4400 gold is the right way to go at it.

    Blacksmith - The hero already gets 6.8 stats per level, do you really want to add another 0.4 int per level on top of having a strength gain most heroes envy?

    Gravekeeper - There's a very good reason why he doesn't get two stuns at level 1. Most of it lies in letting escape heroes survive GK + 1 stun early game.

    Kinesis - Doesn't fix Stasis Smash. Nobody picks up Kinesis because Stasis Smash is worthless. It:
    -Prevents damage to the enemy (increases survivability, cannot be chained with other disables without reducing their damage in most cases)
    -Cannot be deactivated while disabled (Cannot be used on yourself for anything less than full duration, if an enemy stuns you while you try to juggle disables, your team can no longer burst down their designated target)
    -Does meaningless damage and a minor stun in a position enemies are warned about for up to 2.5 seconds.

    If it absorbed 50% of damage, then dealt the remaining 50% + a little on impact, Kinesis would be much more viable. As it is? No amount of endpoint damage will counteract the damage loss Kinesis applies to his team.

    Prophet - Do you really want to see how much of a pushing god Prophet would be if his heal applied to all minions/creeps? As it is, that heal + propagation is enough to knock over multiple towers + raxes on a single genocide. I'd hate to see what happens when a push squad got cheap healing + 3 free attacks in the place of 1.

    Vindicator - Reintroducing the snowballing concept may seem like a good idea, but I'd rather keep away from that if at all possible. I've made suggestions to fix Brain Drain so it drained multiplicatively rather than a set amount for hitting multiple heroes. I believe those suggestions fix the hero while keeping it skillful. A passive int gain on kill is lacking as far as player skill goes.

    The rest of the hero suggestions ranged from "unnecessary but I guess the meaningless tweak might get them some screentime" to "pretty decent." Nothing I'd actually get behind, mind you, but yeah.

    As to the item changes:
    -For the love of all that's holy don't suggest like 10 new items.
    -Codex change seems appropriate to me.
    -Vestments doesn't need another cost increase. It only hurts the support.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beroya View Post
    -Vestments doesn't need another cost increase. It only hurts the support.
    I disagree, supports need hp before making vestments efficient and you still have lex tal. to give you ma.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beroya View Post
    Make a billion suggestions, no one can respond to them all. Ah well, I'll try anyways:

    Aluna - It's already losing 14 damage per unit struck, so pushing it through an early creepwave = 56 less damage dealt for 94, which is acceptable for an AoE skillshot that does nothing else at rank 1. Nerfing the damage to 110 results in 44 less dealt for a measly 60 damage nuke. While yes, it is possible to hit an opponent without hitting any creeps, that's where positioning is supposed to reward the aluna player/punish the opponent.

    Artesia - This fixes effectively nothing. Can cast while using Dance of Death and some number juggling is meaningless when the hero is still pigeonholed into going exactly one skill build or fail. Doesn't address the subpar farming efficiency compared to other AoE magic casters or the horrendous mana efficiency which is so bad that the hero cannot complete a single combo even at full mana at 6.

    Balphagore - Meaningless change that would result in no one picking up SotM. While I would like to see Balph get more effect per charge after 80, I doubt doubling up the AoE at the low price of 4400 gold is the right way to go at it.

    Blacksmith - The hero already gets 6.8 stats per level, do you really want to add another 0.4 int per level on top of having a strength gain most heroes envy?

    Gravekeeper - There's a very good reason why he doesn't get two stuns at level 1. Most of it lies in letting escape heroes survive GK + 1 stun early game.

    Kinesis - Doesn't fix Stasis Smash. Nobody picks up Kinesis because Stasis Smash is worthless. It:
    -Prevents damage to the enemy (increases survivability, cannot be chained with other disables without reducing their damage in most cases)
    -Cannot be deactivated while disabled (Cannot be used on yourself for anything less than full duration, if an enemy stuns you while you try to juggle disables, your team can no longer burst down their designated target)
    -Does meaningless damage and a minor stun in a position enemies are warned about for up to 2.5 seconds.

    If it absorbed 50% of damage, then dealt the remaining 50% + a little on impact, Kinesis would be much more viable. As it is? No amount of endpoint damage will counteract the damage loss Kinesis applies to his team.

    Prophet - Do you really want to see how much of a pushing god Prophet would be if his heal applied to all minions/creeps? As it is, that heal + propagation is enough to knock over multiple towers + raxes on a single genocide. I'd hate to see what happens when a push squad got cheap healing + 3 free attacks in the place of 1.

    Vindicator - Reintroducing the snowballing concept may seem like a good idea, but I'd rather keep away from that if at all possible. I've made suggestions to fix Brain Drain so it drained multiplicatively rather than a set amount for hitting multiple heroes. I believe those suggestions fix the hero while keeping it skillful. A passive int gain on kill is lacking as far as player skill goes.

    The rest of the hero suggestions ranged from "unnecessary but I guess the meaningless tweak might get them some screentime" to "pretty decent." Nothing I'd actually get behind, mind you, but yeah.

    As to the item changes:
    -For the love of all that's holy don't suggest like 10 new items.
    -Codex change seems appropriate to me.
    -Vestments doesn't need another cost increase. It only hurts the support.
    Points taken. I'll try to integrate some, if not all of them, into the upcoming overhaul of the Dream Patch Notes.

    EDIT: Updated the Dream Patch Notes (as of Oct. 22, 2013). Made some changes to the proposals, as well as new proposals. Also, check out the details about the new items included in the patch (can only be used in Experimental Mode).

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