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I filed a report for that. It wasn't a case of someone that thought the game wasn't over, he just refused to pass the vote to annoy us. We had to play 15 more minutes to concede. All the while he kept getting out of the base and dying over and over. I filed a report, and it was rejected. I would like an explanation...
If that's not griefing, what is?
The funny thing is I might get a ban for that game myself, the guy said he would report me for "afk abuse"... but they had a rampage that was charging us as soon as we would get out, and with the farm they had, they could tower-dive into the base easily. I went out to counterward once while they were ganking on the other side, and of course it got counterwarded right away.
Last edited by KickAss; 07-31-2012 at 12:39 AM.
You cannot report someone for not ccing when they are actively taking part in the game. If they are afk and voting down the vote, now that is another story.
Actively as in dying over and over and raging? He even said that he would not concede unless I was kicked...
It doesn't matter what he says. If he actively takes part in the game he cannot be blamed.
That can't be right. It means I could make the game last 15 minutes more as a revenge and even be upfront about it, as long as it isn't too obvious that I'm intentionally feeding. I can't believe that so I'll wait for an answer from a GM.
It is true. The GM will say the same.
The thing is... I believe in common sense.
And btw... GD =======>
Man, I'm on the side of the guy who you reported. I also hate afk avoiders and cc cryers. In some mobas there isn't even a cc option.
This is correct, unfortunately. If you want to suggest a rulechange on the matter, this would be the place to do it. (Not sure if a new thread with the suggestion prefix would be more appropriate though, I'll let Macro answer that.)Originally Posted by KickAss
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#10
I'd have to look at the match. Every match is different; it is very difficult to tell you black-and-white what the decision should have been.
Basic rule of thumb for "spiteful downvote of concede":
-If he is AFK or otherwise violating a Rule of Conduct (intentionally feeding) then he is guilty
-If he is doing something productive (trying to slow down the enemy push, trying to get a few extra kills, unintentionally feeding) then he is innocent.
You said he died over and over. Perhaps the deaths were from attempts to get some kills? Perhaps if his team was helping him instead of sitting in well he would have been successful in that endeavor?
From the FAQ:
Q: What is "spiteful downvote of concede"?
Spiteful downvote of concede is a special type of Ability/Item Abuse. This applies to players who are no longer actively participating in the match and are downvoting concede for the sole purpose of holding their allies hostage (waste their time). Please note that players are entitled to vote down concede, even in certain defeat, as long as they are actively participating in the match. We will not fault players that may want to continue playing to get revenge on a nemesis, end an enemy immortal streak, or simply "play it out" for the fun of it. This is the reason why the concede vote threshold is lowered to 4 of 5 after only 30 minutes.
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Thanks for the answer. I could send you the match ID if you want. But TBH I don't really care about the 25 silver, but I think it's wrong that I didn't have any acceptable option at that point.
As for the game, first I didn't mention: it was a 3v3. They were collapsing on us (with rampage charge) AS SOON AS we got one foot out of the base. And we couldn't ward because we were trapped. And they were not pushing. So it was impossible to "try to get some kills".
I was basically kidnapped, and, apparently, forced to play for 15 minutes because some rager wanted me to.
If I left, for one thing he would have that satisfaction, and for the other, my leave % would go up.
According to your quote of the FAQ, I would really say that, if not a single productive action is done in a time span of over 10 minutes, you can't really say that the guy is "actively participating". And this part definitely applies: "downvoting concede for the sole purpose of holding their allies hostage (waste their time)".
Troll... We hadn't just lost. It was impossible to do anything else than feeding. Also, I don't play those "other MOBA games". But you're free to go back to them.
Last edited by KickAss; 08-01-2012 at 04:45 AM.
#12
No match numbers on this forum, please.
If it is clear that his intent was to hold you hostage then he is subject to punishment.
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^ why don't you allow match id on the forum? would it not be best to show the world the kind of person who did it so everyone can ban him?
RAP isn't just about punishment. It's about getting the person to NOT commit the same actions in the future. You also must understand that once a person has been found guilty, their punishment has been decided, and they receive it. There is no need to punish them further. By allowing people to post Match ID's, your giving the community the ability to troll and grief the person, which is no better than the original offender. It also creates a revolving-door scenario, where one person commits an offense, others grief them and whisper them ingame over and over again, then they report the people who griefed them. Again, RAP is about cleaning up the community, not just punishing people.
So basically, you cant RAP a player for dragging a game out for about 15 minutes just because he doesnt want to cc? Because i recently played with someone like that, and the enemy glacius said "cc" all the time, and because of that the player didnt want to cc. We were literally trapped in our base, hell even behind our fountain were we in danger of getting killed, all because of one guy. Is it seriously not bannable? That just seems really stupid to me why it wouldnt be bannable.
If the enemy team is fishing in the pool, and you respawn and die instantly, why the hell is it possible for one guy to neglect the cc vote? Thats even worse than griefing with spells, since griefing with spells loses you the game, where as cc neglection basically wastes 15 minutes or less of your life. Of course some reports will be incorrect, but thats just plain unfair for some players and so much in favor of griefers that grief that way. How are we supposed to handle that? Some people take care of their stats not to get a 0 / 20 score as a devo or something, and if youre 0 / 20 on devo not intentionally feeding while the enemy stands next to the well and insta gibs you then the game is effing over.
#16
Please read what I said above. "If it is clear that his intent was to hold you hostage then he is subject to punishment."
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But here is no section in the RAP thing in the game that allows you to report a player that didnt want to concede for unreal reasons. If it isnt there i guess its ment not to be there.
You would report this under Purposely Feeding or Avoiding AFK Detection - which ever the player is doing.
Side note: The most important thing is that you write out a good report with accurate time stamps. A GM can easily work around a bad category easier than a report with a bad description.
Actually, it'd go into the Ability/Item Abuse category, as stated in the stickied thread MacroHard referred to earlier.
Last edited by Inomares; 08-12-2012 at 03:21 PM.
S2 Games: Dedicated employees serving dedicated gamers. Continuous development. Never-ending improvement.
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Customer & Tech Support
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Eric S. | Remote Quality Assurance
The problem is that there's a contradiction with the rules on this subject.
"Voting down concede for the sole purpose of holding allies hostage while simultaneously not participating"
"If it is clear that his intent was to hold you hostage then he is subject to punishment."
If the player holds the team hostage but doesn't go AFK/avoid AFK detection, then it's not subject to punishment; according to the result of reporting players for this kind of behavior in the past and the GM answers. If the intent truly is that a player who holds his team hostage out of spite should be punishable, then I think a rules in the demystifying sticky should be updated to reflect this.
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