Dragon Dancer

[[IaF]Skyve]

Strength - 17 + 1.4
Agility - 16 + 1.2
Intelligence - 25 + 4

Range: 475
Damage: 45 - 51
Movementspeed - 300

Dragon's Tear - Target Enemy

The Dragon Dancer releases an Orb of Water to damage the target.
Deals 90/120/150/180 magic damage to the target.
Cast Time: 0.0 (instant, can be cast while walking)
Range: 700
Manacost: 75
Cooldown: 2.5

Dragon's Leap - Self Position

On her dragon's back, the Dragon Dancer moves forward in a swift motion and then moves more quickly for a short duration, while continuing the dance.
Leap 450 distance in the direction you are facing and increases your movementspeed by 60% for 1/1.5/2/2.5 seconds afterwards. May be cast while stunned, but not while silenced.
Manacost: 50
Cooldown: 9/7.5/6/4.5

Dragon Dance - Passive

Moving as one unit, the Dragon Dancer's pet dragon moves as she moves, and strikes where she strikes. When the Dragon Dancer deals magic damage to a unit, the dragon will send a jet of water towards it.
Whenever you deal magic damage deals another 60/80/100/120 magic damage to damaged units.

Dragon's Entanglement - Target Enemy

The Dragon Dancer sends her pet dragon to wrap around the target, severely hindering its movements.
Reduces the targets cast, movement and attack speed by 50% . Lasts for 7 seconds.
Range: 700
Manacost: 50
Cooldown: 30
Type: Superior Magic

Staff of the Master: Reduces Cooldown to 7 seconds.

Note that this is % based attackspeed reduction, not like the regular "-50" attack speed.
_________________________________________________

Alternative first skill:

Dragon's Tear
Deals 90/120/150/180 magic damage to the target and grants you one stack of Dragon's Tear, increasing its damage dealt and manacost by 25 per stack and reducing it’s cooldown by 0.5 seconds. Stacks up to 5 times.
Range: 700
Cooldown: 3.5
Manacost: 50


(Okay okay, this is actually an Arcane Mage from WoW and a really old hero concept I made around the same time I had my "Bring the Character to Life" contest, WoW edition.

Q is Arcane Barrage, W is blink with talents, E is Arcane Missiles (since Cataclysm they sorta work that way) and R is the Arcane "ultimate", Slow. Alternative for Q is Arcane Blast.)

[[LIE]B4NNH4MM3R]

Wow!
This is actually quite promising, one of the better hero suggestions i have seen in this part of the forum.
I am gonna contribute with some constructive comments, and the things that i frowned upon are these.

First i think the passive is gonna be too weak considering you only have one spell dealing damage.
Second i think dragon dance short cooldown is gonna make it way too OP (Use once when stunned and will almsot be ready again when your enemies catch up to you.)
First skill looks awesome and the ultimate looks amazing aswell.

How to fix it.
The quickes solution i could come up with is this.
Make the passive proc when spells are cast, and target closest/lowest hp hero. (Might be too similar to artesia)
Then increase the cooldown on first and second skill a bit to not make her burst too high.

This is if you want to stick with this passive. The best solution would probarly be to come up with a new passive.
Oh and btw if skill number one is gonna have 2.5 sec cd and low damage i think 75 manacost might be too high.
However if you use your alternate first spell i think it would be quite fine (A magic version of armadons spine burst.) Maybe it should be AoE CONE based.

So to sum it all up my opinion would be this.

Use alternate first spell, make it AoE CONE based.
Increase cooldown on Dragons dance (If it is still going to work through stun, if not low cooldown could still be balanced)
Rework or replace passive.
Ultimate is perfect.

Something to think about.
-If she is constantly going to have high MS due to dragons dance, her base MS cant be too high.
-Her annimation needs to be good since her early game (lvl1,2,3,4) is not quite that strong, but after that she really shines (Like a hag,dr,polly type hero. Weak first few levels then takes off. This would probarly turn out as a midgame carry like hag/polly.) I think if your going to look into my sugestion, she needs atleast 550 range and a decent animation to compete with heroes that have the same role.
-Her stat values. I cant really comment on this without playing the hero, but i can say that if her dragons dance is a good of a escape mechanism as i think she cant have a very big strength gain(+1.4 is pretty good actually, just adding the train of thought). Int gain looks good (+4 maybe a bit too high?) and so does agi.


Looks like a very promising hero please dont take my thoughts on it as a offensive reply. Personally i like what this hero could bring to the table.

[[LIE]B4NNH4MM3R]

Her first skill might seem a bit too much like ellonia, but quite frankly i think ellonia is a trash hero. They should just replace ellonia with a refined version of this hero.

[[IaF]Skyve]

First i think the passive is gonna be too weak considering you only have one spell dealing damage.

Yes, BUT: That makes this hero somewhat item dependant. Be it FFP, Charged Hammer, Harkon's Blade - this hero makes great use of all of these, for pretty devastating results (basically the passive pushes FFP to 420 magic damage, from 300, Charged Hammer proccs for 320 damage instead of 200).
The whole idea is for her to not be able to horribly abuse the passive before she farms up a bit.

Second i think dragon dance short cooldown is gonna make it way too OP (Use once when stunned and will almsot be ready again when your enemies catch up to you.)

It's only 450 range though, and it doesn't dispell the stun, it only moves you while you are stunned (meaning it's possible you won't be able to use the bonus MS). For the CD: It's 1.5 seconds shorter than Hags, but travels 800 distance shorter. 450 range isn't too much to be too concerned about tbh, most heroes have more attack range than that

Int gain is really high to be able to spam her Q in lane and outharass her enemies - that's why her attack range is comparatively low. Your Q has 700 range and can be used to harass/lasthit with.

Her first skill might seem a bit too much like ellonia, but quite frankly i think ellonia is a trash hero. They should just replace ellonia with a refined version of this hero.

It's single targeted, and works much more like Thunderbringers Chain Lightning, minus the chaining, really

[[LIE]B4NNH4MM3R]

Yes, BUT: That makes this hero somewhat item dependant. Be it FFP, Charged Hammer, Harkon's Blade - this hero makes great use of all of these, for pretty devastating results (basically the passive pushes FFP to 420 magic damage, from 300, Charged Hammer proccs for 320 damage instead of 200).
The whole idea is for her to not be able to horribly abuse the passive before she farms up a bit.

Will be extremely hard to gather the farm needed for such items, compared to lets say a pyromancer/midas/silhouette/hag/doctor/polly (the list goes on). She has no ability which helps her farm scale, thats why i thought it would be a good idea to rethink her first spell to alow easier farm, or rethink her passiv to make her less item dependant.

Lets face it, all heroes that have the same role as this ( Seems to me it is midgame int carry like hag/polly/doctor ish ) are gonna have such an easy time gather farm compared to Dragon dancer and she will therefore be picked up less.

So thats why i was suggesting to rework some of her abilities to either help her farm (Make first ability cone based with stacks like your alternate first skill for example.)

[[IaF]Skyve]

Her Q does help her farm though. On lvl9 it's a 2.5 seconds CD Sonar Scream equivalent in terms of damage. It is single target, but that doesn't change the fact that you can use it to farm, especially in non-stacked jungles, and you can't really farm a lane faster than creeps spawn anyways, plus Thunderclaw is only 2900 gold, helps you farm AND is a significant dps boost. Plus her early game is really good compared to a hag, since she has better/easier lane dominance.
I'd rather focus on what's special about her. I could see E releasing a salvo of magic damage in a small AoE around her (maybe), but that's pretty much it.

Edit: Better solution is probably to grant E higher damage against non-hero units.

[g0dAr1es]

Hello

So the only thing that I have a problem with is your concept of your passive. Why create a passive that only works with one skill? I know its on a low CD but still. Also creating a ability that in your own words relies on certain items is a bad concept as it restricts the user. Also I am having trouble with the 300 dmg every 2.5 sec with a int gain of 4. Seems pretty strong. So if I can I would like to suggest some things.

I understand you want a low attack range and rely on the first skill to harass, which is fine but your first skill is like Art but you get guaranteed damage (target enemy) with half the cooldown. That is really powerful considering at lvl 2 you are able to spam (high int + high int gain) 150 damage guaranteed hit nuke. Just to give you a perspective on what I am saying. At lvl 2, your hero would have 377 mana, If you level you first and third skill that would net you 150 magic damage for 75 mana. Allowing you to shot 5 times before running out of mana which nets you 750 damage at lvl 2. There is no hero that can do that much guaranteed damage with their own mana pool at lvl 2. If you compare to Artesia she has a mana pool of 388 and if you put 1 point in her first and third skill that will net her 150 damage for 90 mana = 4 shots = 646 damage. This however is NOT guaranteed as you can miss the first skill as well as not be close enough for the third.

So in all I think you really need to re-look at your stat gains and numbers.



If I may, I would like to suggest a alternative to your second skill so it synergiez with your third a lot better.
Dragon's Leap - Target Entity

Leap 450/475/500/525 units to a target Allie or enemy unit. If the unit is an enemy, mini stuns the unit for .1 sec and deals 40/60/80/100 damage. If the unit targeted is an Allie, increases movement speed by 60% for 1/1.5/2/2.5 seconds afterwards.
Manacost: 50
Cooldown: 9/7.5/6/4.5


Hope this helps

[[RAYP]Pixeltic]

WOW. That concept are it beautiful o.o So what I was thinking is I really like the overall concept of your hero. Balanced, but very basic. Maybe have the "Dragon's Leap" carry allied heroes with you if you pass through them? Could be nice to escape, and help out a low hp team mate. The ultimate is pretty dull too. Just a seven second slow seems pretty boring. I personally like charge bases spells and "give and take" spells. So lets say you throw your dragon on them and it gives you a max of seven seconds, or lets say five. When she gets off the dragon she could get slowed, but the hero casted on would take large amounts of damage while the dragon is on them. The bigger the damage is to their hero the bigger the slow to yours. Then you could call back your dragon at any time. When the dragon is recalled it could stun for .5 maybe 1 second. Giving you time to phase boot next to them and throw your ulti again. Because you have 5 or 6 seconds of the ultimate to use before it goes on cooldown. It would almost be like a charge based spell, but you could use as much or as little at a time as you want. Just an idea.. it's your hero :P

[[IaF]Skyve]

You could just try and compare her first skill + passive to Thunderbringer. His Chain Lightning does 85 damage on lvl1, hits 6 targets (ie, an entire creepwave + hero), and costs 65 mana, and is also on a 2.5 second cooldown. His passive also provides bonus damage to his skill.
His W costs 75 mana, has a ministun and does 110 magic damage (plus clearvision and reveal).
And Artesia has AoE, more range, clearvision and a slow on her Q and can hit invisible units with it
Artesia's passive has the same range as this heroes Q has regular casting range, just fyi.
The main disparity here is that the bonus damage from Thunderbringer's E is MUCH lower until the later stages of the game, but on the other hand he gets to harass while lasthitting.
I could change the scaling on the passive to 30/60/90/120 though, but the point was that the hero has a good early game to even get items, since he doesn't farm as well as others (no AoE at all, unlike both, TB or Artesia).

And at this point, we still haven't accounted for the weaker teamfights this hero has without items compared to the other two mentioned above. But that fact too, should allow for her to have advantages at some areas.

And even then, with the alternative for the first skill spamming it becomes a bit more expensive.

Also creating a ability that in your own words relies on certain items is a bad concept as it restricts the user.

There are more than enough heroes in the game already that have everything they could need in their skills so they don't need any items and can just freely go for whatever is best, but there are also heroes that rely on getting certain items to be more effective, like the majority of heroes that get a Portal Key, or most carries. Why is it a "bad concept" for a hero to work better with some items than others?

[g0dAr1es]

You could just try and compare her first skill + passive to Thunderbringer. His Chain Lightning does 85 damage on lvl1, hits 6 targets (ie, an entire creepwave + hero), and costs 65 mana, and is also on a 2.5 second cooldown. His passive also provides bonus damage to his skill.
His W costs 75 mana, has a ministun and does 110 magic damage (plus clearvision and reveal).
And Artesia has AoE, more range, clearvision and a slow on her Q and can hit invisible units with it
Artesia's passive has the same range as this heroes Q has regular casting range, just fyi.
The main disparity here is that the bonus damage from Thunderbringer's E is MUCH lower until the later stages of the game, but on the other hand he gets to harass while lasthitting.
I could change the scaling on the passive to 30/60/90/120 though, but the point was that the hero has a good early game to even get items, since he doesn't farm as well as others (no AoE at all, unlike both, TB or Artesia).

And at this point, we still haven't accounted for the weaker teamfights this hero has without items compared to the other two mentioned above. But that fact too, should allow for her to have advantages at some areas.

And even then, with the alternative for the first skill spamming it becomes a bit more expensive.



There are more than enough heroes in the game already that have everything they could need in their skills so they don't need any items and can just freely go for whatever is best, but there are also heroes that rely on getting certain items to be more effective, like the majority of heroes that get a Portal Key, or most carries. Why is it a "bad concept" for a hero to work better with some items than others?

Thunder does not have a base Int of 25 with a int gain of 4. Also his first skill lvl 1 hits 5 targets not 6. (nit picking I know). Before I go into more detail. Can you better describe to me what you want this hero to be? A ganker, carry, support ect? And you want the hero to be item dependent (in other words needs a farming tool)?

[[IaF]Skyve]

Also his first skill lvl 1 hits 5 targets not 6. (nit picking I know)

It's 6.

http://forums.heroesofnewerth.com/sh...-2-Patch-Notes

Thunder does not have a base Int of 25 with a int gain of 4.

Yes, but he also isn't a hero with 1.4 strength gain.

And you want the hero to be item dependent (in other words needs a farming tool)?

He doesn't need a farming tool just because he's item dependant. Look at Wildsoul, TDL, Magebane.

Also what this hero is:

She's a semi item independant single target ganker that can increase its viability via a Hellflower primarily (reduces possibilities for enemies to counter her attacks), that can also work as a semi-carry by building a completely different set of items.

[ChillyWater]

Hey Skyve!

It makes me very happy to see you putting some effort into formatting (e.g pictures!). I also really like her simplicity though I feel that she is very Artesia-esque/Behemoth-esque ... Which is not necessarily a bad thing. I have been wondering about Behemoths design for a while and I have decided I really like the simplicity... I'm kinda babling atm so I will hurry up...


At first I did not like the lack of disables pre lvl 6, however, with a 50% uptime on a 50% slow is kinda imba, I am ok with the concept of a low cd strong ultimate cc. I notice that she does not have any way to disable channels. Her 2nd skill is fine along with her 1st....

I assume you want her to be a sort of semi carry / semi item dependent. I notice that there is not a secondary effect on her 3rd skill.

The only thing that I really think you need to change is that you probably need to increase the cd on the ult just by a little bit... maybe 5 seconds :/


Edit: just to be clear... I think this hero

[g0dAr1es]

It's 6.

http://forums.heroesofnewerth.com/sh...-2-Patch-Notes



Yes, but he also isn't a hero with 1.4 strength gain.



He doesn't need a farming tool just because he's item dependant. Look at Wildsoul, TDL, Magebane.

Also what this hero is:

She's a semi item independant single target ganker that can increase its viability via a Hellflower primarily (reduces possibilities for enemies to counter her attacks), that can also work as a semi-carry by building a completely different set of items.

Well slap my knee. I hardly play thunder so opps.

But on the point of other heros. At lvl 2 thunder can spam a 65 mana 85 + passive (1-10 more damage) nuke. Your hero can spam almost the same amount except 150 damage nuke. Thunder may be better farmer, but yours is a extremely better single target nuker.

All I am saying is tone down the numbers a bit 30/60/90/120 would be fine on the passive like you have stated.

Btw you did not comment on the change I made to your 2nd skill. Thoughts?

[[ROOK]N0srac]

Since people seem to not like that her passive only buffs her first ability and shes item dependent, what if where her dragon's leap lands her does 30/45/60/75 in a 200 unit radius? I dont know if this would be good or not, but I thougt i'd make the suggestion. Feel free to change any numbers if you do incorporate this, I dont know wether or not this would be balanced enough or whatever.

I also feel like her ult could use something more special, how about some thing like this, "with every step the Dragon Master completes, the dragon further entwines its victim, leaving them hopelessly entangled." You cast it upon someone to reduce attack, cast, and movement speed by 25%, increasing by 5% for every spell cast.

[[EFL]Grangerer]

I am kind of bothered that the third skill only works with her first AND:

Items like codex, thunderclaw and charged hammer.


This is kind of odd, because it favors a stupid item route, especially with a 1.4 strength gain.

Question is about Harcons Blade. It is simply OP if it works wiht harcons

[[DWFI]Corticarte]

Interesting character!~

[[TTFR]Chime]

Looks way to strong for me. Also, sorry to say it, but i hate boring ults that just slow or do nothing else in particular. Can i ask why you put that ulti in? Because it has 0 synergy between her other skills and is IMO just another ability that is extremely boring, and ultis shouldnt be boring. I mean, cmon, a slow as ulti?

[[SBT]Renegateor]

Water based heroes i love a lot and looks good

[[PatB]SEnergy]

duuude, u can't be serious... leap 4.5 sec CD with 60% movement speed for 2.5sec ?, his passive + Q, srsly? 300 magic damage every 2.5 sec that cost 70fckin mana for int hero, midgame it won't drain his mana since he will have ~25mana/sec, which is 62.5 mana between casts, worst balanced hero I've ever seen..

[[TTFR]Chime]

duuude, u can't be serious... leap 4.5 sec CD with 60% movement speed for 2.5sec ?, his passive + Q, srsly? 300 magic damage every 2.5 sec that cost 70fckin mana for int hero, midgame it won't drain his mana since he will have ~25mana/sec, which is 62.5 mana between casts, worst balanced hero I've ever seen..

Skyves known for broken heroes.