Originally Posted by
Clytemnestra
Basicly i will ask a lot of question so...wall of text inc.Hopefully you will have the patience to read and see what mistakes i make and correct me.Now you could send me and read some guides,but i already did,and in fact these questions are derived from those guides and form personal experience.Having played a lot of matches and still not knowing these makes me want to put a lot of questions,because i feel that i was doing some thing/builds wrong and that might have lost us the game because i wasn't able to get the maximum potential of my hero/items.
I will try to keep the questions structured and easy to read.
1.should each lane have a ring of the teacher?saying there is armadon toplane and bot we are against a nighthound,should the 2 supports from these lanes get each a ring,considering that later they will not stack in a teamfight?Also,what if mid we have valk and she also gets it?
It all depends. There's almost NEVER a sitatuon where you should always go X or Y item. Personally, it depends on what laning combo you have, what you are facing and what your other lanes do. It's worth it to have 1 or maybe 2 RotTs, but definitley not more. If you have a lane on which you are lacking armour, regen or base damage, RotT is always a viable option. Personally I don't like supports buying it as a carry generally has more direct use to it (due to the added base damage) and your support could spend his money on more important things. Also, your question somewhat suggests me that you are running a semi-carry mid, double carry+support top and bot. In most games, this never happens (as putting a semi-carry, support+carry bot and a somewhat strong killing/ganking lane (Pyro-Magmus, basic example) is better in the long run (seeing top lane from Legion vision, bot for Hellbourne) doesn't really get a lot of farm).
2.what heroes benefit from alchemist bones?or what heroes are mandatory to have them?
Alchemist Bones isn't core on any hero except for Wildsoul (in my opinion). Alchemist Bones is a great item if you are planning on taking the game to endgame, but note that you should only get it when you can either get it VERY quickly (<6 minutes in) or don't bother getting it at all, as it takes about 7 minutes (I believe) to get the 1900g investment back.
3.saying i go with bombardier mid,is bottle+chalice+powersupply a waste of money and inventory space?He needs a lot of mana for his spells and he will usually gank a lot so his power supply will get charged a lot.Chalice takes hp,but bottle gives that hp back.Is bottle enough?Is bottle + supply enough?
Since it's last nerf, Chalice is in my opinion not so viable anymore on lots of heroes. Chalice is worth it when you have abilities that trade mana for HP (dampeer, succubus etc.). If you're going Bombardier mid, preferably you should get a Mana Supply, Bottle (and very likely a Mystic Vestments) before you build any other items (expect for boots, ofc.)
4.is grave locket good on non-int heroes?i saw it a few times on gunblade but i don't think it is good for him.Also,is it good for supports(like demented,glacius) or carriez(like puppet)??or should it be made only on ganking/mid heroes like pyro,repulsor,hag etc.?
It's an early game item that has relative good use for the amount of gold it costs. I don't think it fits too well on carries (as they don't kill/gank that often, usually), but the mentioned heroes such as Hag and Pyro can greatly benefit from it. With non-int heroes, and keeping in mind that carries shouldn't really have much use of it, strength roamers (Magmus, Behemoth, perhaps even Geomancer) usually go for an early Ring of Sorcery or a Portal Key, and I don't think it's something they should be spending money on early game. Supports die too often to have any use to the 'enhanced' effect of the item, so it's a no-go for me (and they generally don't have money anyway).
5.if the enemy has a dw,am i obligated as support to go plated greaves?or should i just not show myself and get striders?(we are talking about glacius).What if i am pyro?Dw will target me and i don't find p.g. good boots on pyro.Since we are talking about pyro,should i get ghost marchers or steamboots?
Deadwood is an incedibly stronk nuker, but that doesn't mean you have to adapt too much on that. Wards counter Deadwood a looong way, and as your typical support you will have a tough time farming these boots, and when you finally have them it could very well be 20+ minutes in, making the item pretty void already. Striders are the boots you should usually get, unless you have an amazing start and can afford yourself some steamboots.
Pyromancer should never get Ghost Marchers in my opinion, as the HP/Mana gain from Steamboots benifit you a LOT more instead of the base damage (please note, Pyromancer is NOT a hardsupport like Glacius, DS, Myrm etc.) As you'll most likely be going Portal Key, you need some mana to be able to do your combo and especially against a Deadwood, STR steamboots usually give you enough Health to survive his ult+Q.
6.If i go mid with defiler,i heard that making nome's and astrolabe is a good idea.I also heard that nome's is good on torturer(with tablet and pkey w/e),but astro is not.Now,mainly the support should make these 2 items,but if your support barely has gold or barely makes an astrolabe,what other heroes benefit from nome's?I saw it on armadon guides.Is it viable?what other heroes.
Nomes doesn't have that much of use in my opinion, but I can't say it for others. It's a relatively expsensive item for an item that doesn't have that much direct use. It can help you win teamfight, but there's not really an hero where I would directly build Nome's on. It's pretty situational I guess. Astrolabe is a typical support item that only support heroes should go (simply because have more than 1 or 2 astrolabes is a waste) and semi-carries like Torturer have better options.
Defiler shouldn't get Nomes nor Astrolabe imho, simply because it doesn't fit her playstile that much (except for the fact that Astrolabe could maybe help pushing with healing creeps, but I don't think that's worth getting the item for). Defiler is what you could define as a tanky, push hero that benefits a lot of a Helm and a Mystic Vestments (almost impossible to get down early game after getting Helm).
7.why did s2 nerfed all these cc items?sheepstick/hf/tornado?I know they are for balance,but why?
CC is an incredibly strong way to counter your enemy heroes (especially the carry). A 3.5 second disable on a carry, meaning they can't do anything, is SO strong, that no matter how much money it would cost, 1 or 2 Sheepsticks are still game-breaking. This is pretty much the same for Stormspirit. CC spells are very strong, and making CC buyable should not be THAT rewarding that it can easily break the game.
8.is energizer viable on any hero?i see it in guides for valk/moa/blitz,but i find it a bit useless unless you have a pushing team and want to give your creeps a little boost.
I'm not so enthusiastic on the item either. I don't think it has a direct use, maybe others think of it differently but with the gold I usually buy other items.
9.when should i make puzzlebox?for example if i am succubus should it be my 1st item?What if i am tundra or parasite?
Puzzlebox is viable on two types of heroes: Heroes with lots of disables and pushing heroes.
Both Tundra and Succubus have very strong disable capabilities and greatly benefit from two monsters pounding in on an ulted enemy. I think there's never a situation where you have 'too many' Puzzleboxes. Parasite benefits more from Mana Ring, some boots and a Sheepstick/Codex (the last one especially in lower tier games). Puzzlebox is especially strong if you get it early. Building it as a Succubus 30 minutes in won't have such a strong impact compared to when you buy it at minute 15.
10.i usually start with 2 duck boots on rachna/valk.Should i sell those or get an iron shield?
Ranged heroes don't benefit from Iron Shields at all in my opinion, simply because the blocking values are so low for Ranged Heroes (and melee heroes shouldn't hit you that much). General builds for Arachna and Valk that I would consider are a Guardian's Ring (for RotT), HP pot, Blights and 3 minor totems (or 2 minor totems and 2 mana pots for Valk. Arachna doesn't really have any use to Mana potions). Buying items you will not use at all later on in the game (for a Mana Supply, RotT or a Soulscream Ring (which I don't think is a great item, unless you're having a rough start) is a waste of money and should be avoided.
11.codex,we all love it.What heroes really benefit from this item?I saw it mostly on parasite,but i tend to get pbox since i find very funny to see the enemy run from my infested mauler.
Codex is great if you're playing against squishy heroes (that are still easy kills even if they buy Mystic Vestments) and when you're a Hero that already has strong nuking abilities. Parasites turns into a oneshot machine, and it COULD be viable on heroes like Witch Slayer and Pyromancer, but if you have the money for those items you should rather get an item like Sheepstick)
12.Staff of the master?Any heroes that benefit from it and it is mandatory/often used/very good?I mean i disagree for it on pyro,but find it nice for pharaoh(but there could also be better items for pharaoh too,i guess?)
Pharoah has great use of the item, but going a bit more tanky (or get Puzzlebox) is also very viable on him. I dislike SotM on Pyro and WS, simply because the 200 (or something similair) damage is not worth the 4300g, not even for the stats. Bombardier, Chipper and Hag have great use to SotM because it makes their ultimates even more devastating.
13.spellshards.When,why and on who?
Heroes that are build around magic damage can use this item to counter items like Mystic Vestments. It removes any magic damage reduction effects and reduced cooldowns and overall decent stats, turn heroes like Pyromancer, Dampeer and Bombardier into heroes that are still a pain in the ass later on in the game.
14.riftshards.I sometimes make it on my carry if it doesn't have crit aka mm,scout etc.For example arachna?But i found recently that savage mace would be better,still i find arachna crits quite juicy.
Riftshards is a great item, but Savage Mace is stronger in my opinion (also because it counters Wingbow). Riftshards could be an item you get after your core items (and even after Savage) to make your carry hero an even more destructing hero. Also make sure to have some defensive items, because the 40 minute carries with 1300HP generally get focussed down really quickly, and no matter if you have Riftshards and Savage mace, you won't be of great use.
15.insanitarius.i see it only on maliken,but still don't know if it is a good pick on him too.Is it?any other heroes that may benefit from it?
It's a very strong item on Predator and Maliken, because they benefit from the extra damage and Attack Speed. Seeing they both have build-in heal effects, the HP drain isn't really something to be bothered by. Especially because both Heroes get really strong with High Attack Damage/Low HP, Insanatarius helps them with both.
16.charged hammer,thunderclaw.I see it good for ws,but i don't know why.May because it procs thanks to his big atk speed and allows him to clear stacked creeps?Should i upgrade it to charged hammer?Any other heroes that need/benefit?
Charged Hammer is a great item for heroes that have high attack speed and proc the item often. Valkyrie is a great example for this. Wild Soul could get the item, but you'll leave him very squishy if you get it as one of your first items. Usually when I jungle with Wildsoul, I go Alchemist Bones --> Thunderclaw --> Frostburn/Frostwolf/Geometer's --> Charged Hammer. So basicly you get it on heroes that have High Attackspeed.
17nullfire.This is my first item on tdl/moa/nh.Made it on valk or sand a few times.Also for gemini,but i don't really like gemini anymore.On flint or gunblade is also funny.Now talking serious,is this item good on any hero?I find it nice for nh since you can keep your target slowed in your smoke a bit longer so you can backstab it more times,and it also gives agility which boosts your 3rd.On tdl is nice because of her atk speed that drains tons of mana,and since the target is slowed she can damage it for a lot.But is it good to make it?
Nullfire is great on an hero like Valkyrie, because you A. benefit a lot of your attack speed B. it usually helps you hit arrows (with the slow) and makes it even easier to kill enemies. The purge effect is also really strong if it's used correctly.
I don't build it on either of your mentioned heroes because they have better items they can buy. TDL gets a Runed Axe and Shrunken Head, MoA could go Null Stone and Shieldbreaker. Night Hound is quite viable, because it makes you even deadlier with a slow+manadrain combo, but it leaves you VERY squishy and if they buy invisibility revelation items, you'll be chopped in no-time.
18.frostburn.I see it on most of the carries and i was wondering if it is viable to make frostburn or to just rush geometer and then go ftw.Are there heroes that benefit only from frostburn itself?(i saw tdl benefits but people told me to make fws and sell firebrand,so why get firebrand in the 1st place if you sell it later?)Are there heroes that need only fws or geometer?
If you build Frostburn it's generally because you'll be splitting it into a FWS+Geo combo later on. Personally I don't think the item ITSELF is worth building, because 4400g is a lot for an item that gives mediocre stats and effects. Shieldbreaker is an item I'd rather buy on heroes like Valkyrie and Silhoutte (on which you see Frostburn a LOT).
19.elder parasite?i think it is good on chronos if you only activate it while in your ult.I also make it on tdl,again activate it while i ult or on any other carry if we have a good tempest??Valk with ep is fun as hell,but if i want to win the game i don't do this stupid mistake lol.
Elder Parasite is a fun item to go, but it's not wise to pick it up. Whilst you benefit from the Attack Speed, it makes you an enormous Glass Cannon (high damage, low survivability). Going Whispering Helm/Abyssal Skull on heroes like Chronos, TDL and Madman is a lot better.
20whispering helm?what heroes will benefit from it?i see it on maliken mainly for obvious reasons.Also on puppet,but he farms so slow that shroud would be better on him.Any other suggestions?Any hero that could benefit from the control option (puppet for stacking ancients, you'll get shroud in no-time after) and heroes that don't neccesarily need any Attack Modifier to wreck the enemy team. I love building it on Heroes like Madman and TDL, as I can improve it to a Symbol of Rage later on in the game.
21.restoration stone?i find it good only on keeper or polly.any other suggestions or is it useless even for these 2?
At the very moment I don't think it's a good choice of item on ANY hero, because the effects aren't game-breaking and you should rather spend the money on an item like Sheepstick. A no-go for me.
22.Now regarding starting items
a.Support
Health pot
Runes
2xtotems
2xwards/Courier Upgrade
I usually go:
2wards/courier upgrade
HP Pot
1x blights (3)
2 Mana pots/1 Mana pot
2 Minor Totems/3 minor totems
(1x mana pot, 3x minor totem is only an option when you upgraded the courier due to inventory space).
Are these good?Should i get 1 more totem,or a claw and a crown so i can make a bracer and then upgrade it to astrolabe?
b.Int hero that doesn't go mid,aka pyro laning
H pot
Runes
Manapot
2xtotems->should i make power supply or sell them?
Wards ->me or my lane partner?
This is fine.
Considering i lane as pyro with hammer/behe,what items should hammer or behe have,since they will get the farm?(they need the pkey faster than me since they are initiators).I have seen that usually the initiator buys the wards and places them.
Depends on what role they and you are going to place in the game. Pyromancer is incredibly strong with Portal Key. If you are facing a tough lane, a melee hero will most likely have no opportunity to farm, meaning you'll have to take the creeps. Heroes like Magmus and Behemoth shouldn't really buy wards imho, that's a task for the hardsupport.
If going mid with pyro or any other int hero i get +3intx2 ,2xtotems,runes,h pot.As mid should i sell the totems or make power supply out of those?Should i sell one of the +3 int in order to make space for my bottle.
Going mid with heroes like Wretched Hag, Pyromancer and Chipper I build:
1x 3 int (if I want to go Mana Ring if I have very decent farm, otherwise I sell it (I still benefit a LOT from the extra mana I get)).
2 minor totems
1x Blights
This will leave you with enough regen and stats to get a very early bottle (<2 minutes) meaning you'll be able to dominate your lane a lot. Push the lane if you have a <2 minute bottle, harass the opponent with some spells, empty your bottle and get the rune (because you pushed the lane, the enemy can't afford it to leave the lane that early).
c.Melee carry-hatchet,shield,runes
Or shield/pot/runes/3xtotems
Which is better?the hatchet helps you last hit better(you can also activate it to get a last hit form a safe distance),while the other one is more survivability oriented.Since mostly you will have a ranged support aka glacius,doesn't that mean that you will get farm?So which of those should i get?
If you're in a lane where you'll be harassed a lot and you need the extra base damage, you get Shield, Loggers and blights. If you know you won't be harassed that much I prefer to go Loggers, HP pot, blights and 3x minor totems. The stats+loggers will guarentee you lasthits and you will have enough regen to get your lifetube. If you're an hero like Chronos, which has a quite high Base Damage, you could always go Shield+Hp+Blights+3 minor totems, as you'll be easily able to take the harass without getting pushed out of the lane.
d.Ranged carry
H pot
Runes
2x+3agil
2xtotems
Or 1 crown/3xtotems/runes/h pot
Ranged carry benefits a lot from RotT, so you could go Guardian's Ring, HP pot, Blights, 2 mana pots and 2 minor totems (RoTT+Powersupply+Boots early game). I dislike getting these stat items as I do not fancy Soulscream Rings on carries, it's an investment that won't make a big difference and you'll sell it later on anyway. Getting a quick steamboots (or atleast boots+6str item) helps a lot more.
Here,the same question.I think the 1st build is more last-hit oriented and for midlane,while the 2nd is more survival on sidelane.Am i right?
e.Melee strength mid
Runes
H pot
Manapot
Shield
2xtotems
Aka kraken,pebb or deadwood.They already have high basedamage so should i get this build or runes/hatchet/shield one?Also,if i will be matched against another melee,is that shield important or should i not take it?
On Pebbles I build 3 int, Loggers and blights. You can easily take the harassment and with your high base damage, you'll get all the lasthits, meaning you can get a quick bottle (the +3 int can always be build into a Ring of Sorcery, and you need it to get a combo off on level 3).
Deadwood same story, I build Loggers+Blights because you can take the harass, you get ALL the mobs with W+loggers, meaning you get a quick bottle. The blights are just there to counter the harass.
Kraken Shield+loggers+blights, because I don't think Kraken has a base attack that is as strong as the ones from Peb and DW, so the shield is there to counter harass (and you could always build it into a Helm of the Black Legion).
Fighting against other melee heroes as those heroes shouldn't be that big of a deal, seeing you have strong nukes and base attacks, especially if you're facing something like TDL or Magmus middle.
That concludes my questions about items and as soon as someone answers them(hopefully) i will also ask about heroes.Please don't troll and only answer if you are sure of what you say that it is viable.
Sorry for the tons of questions and if you want to write a wall of text i will still gladly read it.But at least answer with 1.answer 2.answer etc.
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