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Hey guys,
I'm a bit unsure as to how I should go about jungling with wildsoul and tempest, so I have a few questions:
1. should i be stacking?
2. should i be pulling?
3. are there any creeps i should be avoiding early on?
4. with tempest, should i be using elementals when i'm ganking, or just my stun?
thanks (:
Stack easy & medium camps and just kill hard camps.
Pull when lane gets pushed so your tower does not take much damage.
So..
1. Easy & Medium, yes, on wildsoul, even hardcamp.
2. When lane gets pushed, you stack and then pull. Never pull a non-stacked camp
3. Catmens and vultures are usually bad 'coz they hit hard. On lvl 3 they become easy
4. Elementals with you of course, preferably max amount of them
Being a Tempest player myself, I can tell you a few things;
1. Start with the easiest camp...that means the yellow camp. Do ur 2nd ability on the toughest creep in the yellow camp, that means it's gotta be either the blue wolf dude, the healer, snotter boss.
2. I've seen alot of people just cast elementals and then leave them to attack whatever the heck they want to attack..so don't do that. Select all ur elementals and have them focus down one creep at a time. Tempest does not have the best mana pool early on so you really can't spam elementals, you gotta micro them carefullly
3. Definetly avoid minotaurs. Their stun wastes precious seconds of ur elementals which is just plain bad.
4. Meteor i tend to take one level of this skill early on as it can clear trees. Elementals are dreadfully slow so clearing trees allow them to get around quicker
5. Keep the jungle entrance warded and ward through out the game. Farming is not very hard for Tempest and he can very easily manage his pkey within the first few minutes esp with a few ganks in the short lane.
6. I prefer not getting striders for Tempest. Plated are better since they give armor to ur elementals which is very useful when you are pushing towers. Otherwise Steamboots do the job well.
7. Ur stun is awesome. Many people forget that it's a multi-stuns...esp panda players. You cast it...they get stunned, they ulti and they get stunned againit's hilarious
That's all for him what I could think of....if i remember some more then I'll add.
Ur ultimate is awesome IF and only IF your team follows your intiation AND no one interrupts you...so never ever cast ur ultimate to kill a single hero. It has a very long cooldown and you need it for teamfights. Best to cast elementals before you do ur ultimate cuz then it means potentially six more creeps attacking the enemy heroes...but if you can't, it is understanble.
Tempest gives the team a small window of oppurtunity to blow everything they got on enemies so you need giant AoE follow up. Ideal partners are Artesia, VJ, Polly, Magmus, Behemoth, Kraken and maybe even Riftwalker.
Besides Pkey and Shrunken, the only items I would recommend getting are Astrolabe and Tablet of Command. If the game goes on longer, consider getting Shards. Even longer than bring out that Nullstone and Kuldra. I've even once gone Deamonic on him tbh.....it's a good pick up but there are better items to get on him.
One last thing if you are attacking the neuts outside their camp area and do not have the sight of the camp they originally are from, they WILL stack. This works esp well if the easy came starts of with snotters. You attack them at bout xx:53 and pull them out, then cast elementals. Now focus all ur elementals to hit one snotter at a time and soon the easiest camp respawns and once you've wiped off the snotters you get ur elementals to attack them. Even level 1 elementals can take on them very very very easily and you easily come up to level 3 in a matter of no time.
ALWAYS stack. both wildsoul and tempest have the means to kill stacks with ease (just pull them out and attack them while they run back and forth between camps). Stacking = more gpm, snowball faster, ready to be active/pusher faster, easier win. Don't play wildsoul nor tempest if you do not stack with them. Booboo has root to just trap hard creeps while pulling making it easy to kill, and tempest elemwntals are easy to keep alive if you just pull the creeps out before attacking them. The only exception is if you lane with them, which is under-rated but also quite strong on both heroes.
And yes, you should be using elementals when you gank; if you max it first and you have decent micro tempest elementals have THE most damage potential of all heroes at that point in the game (well bar a tb ult with everyone clumped up near him
It's like this, if your micro (or item build) sucks ass then level stun over elementals to make up for your deficiencies, but if your micro is decent 100% max elementals and rush a plated greaves, the damage output is unreal, and it allows you to push and kill stacked camps MUCH faster. Lastly, if you are rushing portal key first item before boots/stats you are horrible and I think you deserve to lose
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FOR ALL THAT IS HOLY~!
Don't worry guys, Lodestone won't be getting picked up in competitive, your balance forum regulars have assured it in this Lodestone balance thread ;)
http://forums.heroesofnewerth.com/showthread.php?470528-Lodestone-First-Impressions&p=15618341&viewfull=1#post15618341
Jungling tempest used to be fine and easy until those damn catman warriors with those ridiculous aoe spams -.- lol
for wildsoul, on the legion woods, stack the 2 furthest East camps at the same time by NOMing a tree of the last one that faces the 4th one along to provoke both camps for steeping into their hood
Last edited by Naked_Ghost; 05-17-2012 at 11:16 AM.
I tell you abit how I jungle and play tempest. I tell how I start in legion jungle
1.start off with pretenders crown, +3 int item (w/e the name is), ward and mana pots. Go into mid tower and deny melee creep, send your minions to hard camp but dont block it and go get full mana.
2.Start killing the big creep with your minions, usually they expire very soon so just spawn new minions from the small guy and finish hard camp. Then kill easy camp.
3.Check if your block is blocked, if its not stack both medium camps(ward rune also), upper one by attacking and the pull camp by hugging the trees so creeps will aggro you. Then spawn minions into top spawn and take the stack, leave upgraded minions to fight the stack when you pull. If pull is blocked just kill hard and medium camps, possibly stack medium right before killing it.
4.Remember to sit bot rune always and try to gank whenever possible. With upgraded minions and ult you will most likely solo double kill, so its pretty easy with a friend.
5.I hate ppl rushing pk... tempest is alot more than ult, but you still want it at some point, so your enemies need to re-position. I rush mana ring and remember to sometimes go and give your solo mana when your close. Then steamboots/armor boots and I even usually get tablet before pk. If you know your mid wont get bottle you can start with rott and mana pots (maybe only guardian ring so you get wards if needed) + rush fast bottle and get those runes. Items after pk are pretty situational, tablet and nomes wont never be bad, hex and hellflower works if you have alot gold, bulwark if none in your team gets one etc...
6.Remember that the threat of tempest ultimate is alot huger than your ult actually.
Last edited by Ackwell1; 05-17-2012 at 04:51 PM.
awesome, thanks for the help guys (:
Lots of BAD in this thread. Seriously... But biggest is the point about ulti for single kills. It is worth using on single kills so often early game and even midgame. When you can secure kill or two with the ultimate and score a tower it is always worth it. Kill or two for the solo lane, assist money for you, levels and having the guys down for a while instead of letting him survive. When you are confident with it you know when you can use them for kills.
The point about Portal Key depends a lot but I often look to get it after Plated+RoS. I like having the initiation range even for just the simple Stun->Elementals combo. Tempest has been my most played hero since beta so I got a ton of games with him and at times I build something silly like Sacstone->Hellflower without ever getting Portal Key and even the Barrier/Astro build that Enigma players like to go for but Portal Key at around 14-20min time depending on ganks and towers is what I primarily aim at.
As for the farming early the micro is really important. Pull the creeps out and then convert a creep so that they don't get killed by the big creep or get trapped in the camp and micro away the targeted elemental and focus creeps down one by one. If your elementals are low on time you'll want to focus down the big creep when moving ot the camp to make sure that you have something to convert or to make sure the camp is faster to clear with the next set. Stacked camps are also easy to take down if you pick up the elementals from the camp nearby so yes stack when able. Even hard-camps.
Your level 4 elementals are actually quite tanky...so one thing you can do is actually when u convert a creep into elementals use one of the 3 to stack a near by camp...2 elementals which would become 4 soon enough can easily take care of neuts along with you...later on then you can clear the stacked camp...this is how i think tempest can stack effectively without wasting mana...but like i said, it requires ALOT of microing n u gotta be aware of enemy ganks...i got ganked by opposite mk and sil really bad as i was tunnel-visioning my stacking elemental and totally forgot about Tempest
maybe someone here has said it before but w/e...just thought of mentioning it as this is how i will be stacking with Tempest from now on...and potentially if u get really good at microing...u can stack 3 camps at once
With tempest you can pull non-stacked camps and deny one of your friendly creeps.
A tip if your playing WS, He is a lot stronger lane. Should almost never be put in forest, because when you reach lvl 3 and get entangle you will be able to win your lane with ease.
so why not forest until level 3 and gank at that level?Originally Posted by jevelen
I would always try to stack the easy and the medium camps right from the beginning. If your laned is pushed you stack and pull, but if the lane situation is fine you don't need to. I usually skill him 2-4-0-1 at level 7 and then max out stun before I go any points in meteor. If your lane is having trouble and need help you can max the stun instead of the minions. You can still jungle with lvl 2 minions, you just won't do it as fast.
Also try to push towers early on when the enemies are leaving the lane and don't rush the pk. If you get armor boots, mana ring and ring of the teacher before the pk you can farm the jungle much faster and push towers much easier. This will ensure that you get your pk att the same time as if you would have rushed it, only difference being you now have other useful items as well.
As Rkey pointed out, you can pull non-stacked camps with tempest. Then deny (your W) a friendly, don't attack neutrals and deny (attack) friendly whenever their HP drops low enough.
Tempest Can Do Medium Camps at level 1. It is a quick level 2. And if you do a camp close to the lane, a quick bloodlust. Shame on the person who said he should start at the easy camp.
Granted it is hard if it is a minotaur or Vulture spawn and impossible if its a Catman or Wild Hunter, but the rewards more than make up for the risks.
Second, it is completely fine to use your ult on a single enemy in the laning phase. A guarenteed kill on the enemies mid or carry is huge.
^Tempest could take any camp at lvl 1, but dunno about the new minions. If I remember right they were only nerfed in higher lvls.
With 6 elementals he can take out any camp. However, he can not take Wild Hunters right at the start since he can not convert them into elementals. Also in my experience, it is not worth trying to kill catmen because you will lose at the minimum 1 out of the 3 original elementals (between the slow and the Catmen's high attack damage, you can not micro the initial attacked elemental to move out of harms way fast enough.) Moreover, if you make a small mistake with your micro of the elementals, you can lose all of them.
Just checked the patch notes. The average damage at level 1 and 2 of elementals is the same, so it should not impact any level 1-3 ganking.
It's also often you manage to lose one elemental to vulture lord if you convert from that camp. Even with micro you might lose one as it takes longer for them to split when you are constantly interrupting them to move but it's doable. Taking them as secondary is easy though as is any other camp.
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