Wild Soul - Fast mock or Alch Bones?

[[EoN]DuFFzJR]

Looking for some peoples opinion on Wild Soul.

If you're getting pretty much free farm in the jungle without being ganked etc, is it a better idea to go Alchemist Bones, or get around a 14 minute mock?

I know Mock can be devastating early game. With getting Alch bones I usually get around a 18-22 minute mock depending, but without the alch bones 14 min mock is pretty easy to get.

What do you think is better?

[leka`_]

I'd go for mock, its really, really good early, you can melt squishys in a couple of seconds, and a kill is like Transmuting a Tier 3 creep

[[YARG]Rosgath]

It depends on the game really. If you're going for a push strat, generally speaking mock will be better. If you anticipate the game going long, Alchemists is better. Wildsoul is a unique hero in that he has a VERY versatile item acquisition process.

[gwefix]

uuuhm if you go alch bones u can get a 14-15min mock easily

[haddon]

I was in a game earlier today, our tempest did nothing but farm for 20, 25 minutes. He wasn't ganked, nor did he gank, but what really surprised me was the amount of gold he came out with - 9000 gold AND a mana ring.

-___________________________________________-

is there some kind of hidden gold pocket in the jungle i'm not aware of? Everybody talking about 10 minute mocks and then I see this ridiculous tempest.

[Chronish]

You ALWAYS go alch bones

You will get your mock 2 minuters later

Boobo really needs that 30+ atk speed when you have your mock. Its simply a must.

+ the alch bones will pay off 2 minuters after your mock.

[[IMMS]Harakesh]

99% of the time I got for a Alchemist bones first on Wildsoul, I use my own guide for ease of use: http://www.heroesofnewerth.com/heroe...php?gid=156052

[[S2]Dawnbringer]

If you can grab mock before the 20 minute mark then it is a great asset, you can nab kills or farm 2 places at once with it which makes it really useful. However, builds aren't set in stone and each situation should assessed on a case by case basis.

[Apostate]

If you maintain 200 GPM for the first 9.5 minutes of the game, you have Alchemist Bones. From there let's say you have 340 GPM, which means that you will get your Mock in 16.9 minutes, meaning that you have your Mock and Alch Bones at 26.4 minutes.

If you rush Mock first, you probably will have about 250 GPM, meaning that you get it at the 19 minute mark. So Alchemist Bones delays Mock by 7.4 minutes, using this model. If you get kills, die, or your team gets an early tower this all changes.

Personally, I say get Alch first. Alchemist Bones is often MORE helpful in early ganks than Mock is, because the AS on your bear makes entangle procs more likely to occur, which is usually more important than the magic damage ever is. It increases your GPM in the long term, and really you should be keeping ganking to a minimum with Wildsoul until after you have more items either way.

I was in a game earlier today, our tempest did nothing but farm for 20, 25 minutes. He wasn't ganked, nor did he gank, but what really surprised me was the amount of gold he came out with - 9000 gold AND a mana ring.

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is there some kind of hidden gold pocket in the jungle i'm not aware of? Everybody talking about 10 minute mocks and then I see this ridiculous tempest.

This may not be true now that we have Parasite, but Tempest is one of the fastest jungling heroes in the game, in terms of how much gold he can make in 20 minutes if he jungles from level 1.

[[Pra]SolarFlare22]

Alch bones, almost always.

While it might delay your mock by a couple minutes, it will vastly increase your farm into late game as well as providing a pretty big boost to your bears atk speed.

[[2TBH]PodiumBound]

when u grow as a player and jungler, u will understand that 20 minutes of farm without any capability of gank will be loosing for ur solo. so get normal items instead of raising like a retard to benefit ur team,

see the connection to why warbeast is useless ?

[tailSPACE]

just rush that mock, get steamboots on both heroes, pop your ult and push down all the towers. wildsoul isn't a carry until lategame, while being an extreme pusher early/mid.

[[SHZZ]Shalaw]

when u grow as a player and jungler, u will understand that 20 minutes of farm without any capability of gank will be loosing for ur solo. so get normal items instead of raising like a retard to benefit ur team,

see the connection to why warbeast is useless ?

If your solo lane is decent , he will outlevel the other team, win!

[Diablo``]

as some ppl mentioned, alchemists will delay your mock only by 1-3 minutes, as long as you don't get ganked in this time.
I haven't played WS in quite some time now, but like 8 min alchemists, 20 min mock should easily be doable, while mock first will also need around 18min.

So you should get alchemists first usually

[[HB2]Bobx2]

Mock is dogshit. Never get mock.

[PrestonLee]

Looking for some peoples opinion on Wild Soul.

If you're getting pretty much free farm in the jungle without being ganked etc, is it a better idea to go Alchemist Bones, or get around a 14 minute mock?

I know Mock can be devastating early game. With getting Alch bones I usually get around a 18-22 minute mock depending, but without the alch bones 14 min mock is pretty easy to get.

What do you think is better?

neither, just get an early and push with Booboo for a free win at 25 minutes.

No, but seriously. Wildsoul's one of the strongest pushers/BD'ers in the game, I want to smack people in the face whenever people afk-farm with him (and don't gank at level 3). If they are dumb enough to let you free farm then you could literally just go end the game early with Wildsoul by pushing with Booboo really early and most people won't even know how to stop it.

Mock is ****ing stupid, maybe it's funny to kill retards with it but it's too easy to stop now that Booboo can't just port out when he's getting focused. Alch bones is dumb, I'd rather get a Phase boots for Booboo with that money and gank like a monster and again end it early.

But if you HAD to pick one, go Alch bones. You can put it on Booboo and increase his attack speed for more ganking power when it's off cooldown.

[Antimodus]

Mock is not stupid. Mock gives +60 damage to the bear, which is no joking matter - especially vs towers.

[PrestonLee]

Mock is not stupid. Mock gives +60 damage to the bear, which is no joking matter - especially vs towers.

Alch bones + Abyssal + Sol's gives more damage vs towers than Mock does. Mock takes way too damn long to "afk-farm" before doing anything. There are times when I will get a mock, but that's only after I've already pushed down 3+ towers and ganked 5+ kills with Booboo's root.

Mock is a luxury you get when you're already doing well, not something you should sit in the jungle watching creeps die for 15 minutes to rush before you think about doing something. If you got a mock in 14 min and your team's already winning then it honestly doesn't matter what the hell you go, you probably already won the game already because the other team is too stupid to do anything. if you got a mock in 14 min but your team lost the 4v5 and things are going downhill, you're bad and need to learn your hero.

point is: it doesn't matter what you go if you're doing it right, as long as you're pushing and ganking with wildsoul anything is viable. yes, anything. This is not a joke, I go Energizer+Tablet(+Steamboots for Wild+Ghosts for Booboo)on Wildsoul all the time and get free wins, why? because i pushed/ganked with booboo so hard that it really didn't matter what i went. Abyssal+Sol's will help you push faster, and if you're not dumb you'll end up with them on Booboo late game anyway. might as well just grab it early.

again, if you're gonna pick one or the other to rush and not do jack **** til then, go alch bones. Those alch bones will be picked up REALLY EARLY (6-7 min in if you're doing it right) and help you gank better and push towers faster early when they are on Booboo, and they allow you to do work for your team (push and gank) earlier without compromising your gpm early on. You can buy that scrubby mock anyway shortly after if you gank/push correctly with Wildsoul, and yeah it's gonna make booboo do even more damage when you have both alch+mock on him.