What does it mean to be a caster? What does it require?
The only ones who are genuinely professionals at this area, are the ones working for S2 - at least for the moment.
It is a known fact that BreakyCPK is, by all means, the most famous one among all of us. But is that in regards to him being the best, or is it simply because he came first, and was well received by S2?
Let's look into this a bit..
The rumour has it, that the loudest voice will always be negative, and that is true - you will always see negative and non-constructive flamers and trolls posting on the forums way more frequently than others. So whenever someone brings a cast, people will naturally start complaining about what is missing- instead of appreciating what they are getting.
For instance, last night i had a near flawless experience from the CSN Semi-Finals, tDM vs Fnatic- casted by Zyori and Breaky. Even though the cast was great, the games went smoothly and the drafts were interested- the only thing i actually mentioned about the cast, was that "I don't like the combination of the two."
Looking in the mirror, i actually feel miserable admitting that i am a negative person. Imagine if i had simply leaned back and said: "Wauw, that was great." - I didn't.
So now, all they got from me was complaining. Sad, isn't it? - I'm not trying to bash anyone here, but i just want to get a few words out there.
For all of those who are trying to do something for the community: Stop taking hits from the general public. The loudest voice will always be negative- and that is simply a fact. If 13K people sits tight and watches Honcast, but 50 of them bashes for small issues- then i guess the game was great for those other 12.950 viewers.
> Stop being negative. Start being constructive.
The perfect duo
There is a reason as to why the perfect partners have always been different from eachother. Looking at Batman and Robin, Pinky and the Brain, Sherlock Holmes and Watson,- or in a language us gamers can understand: Tasteless and Artosis.
In every scenario- we will mostly see a big difference between the characters involved in a perfect duet.
But where does that leave us?
Well, to put it into context of Hon, we now have the most popular duo of casters being Zyori and BreakyCPK.
What i like about Breaky:
His voice is excellent- so we pretty much just hear that, and whatever personallity he had, was hidden away.
He has a great way of doing play-by-plays in languages we can all understand, seeing as he is very inexperienced with Heroes of Newerth himself, he breaks it down to a level where even the slowest minds can follow.
He talks fast, he doesn't make jokes and he sticks to the basics of the game.
In other words, we have a caster that is genuinely only providing us what we need to know.
> What i wish he'd bring: Competitive insight, news about competitors and their habbits, putting personality to the players.
What i like about Zyori:
He has a cool-ass voice, and he doesn't stand out as a caster with a personality. He usually sticks to the game, whenever breaky is not talking- leaving all the personality and joking, he had while casting for iG, gone.
Again, really good play-by-plays, and we all know exactly what he's saying. He doesn't really have any high tier experience, but again- we make the assumptions and high tier thinking ourselves.
His way of talking is fast, easy to understand and you're able to follow exactly what he says, even while talking quickly.
Edit on request: He is pretty analytical and also has a good strategic mind. He's not afraid to show it, and but it tends to "fade away" as he is not the maincaster. He's the cocaster of breaky.
> What i wish he'd bring: Competitive insight, news about competitors and their habbits, putting personality to the players.
--- Wait, what just happened here? Did you just wish they'd both bring the same?
Yeah, strange isn't it? - They are both amazing casters, don't get me wrong. I'd love to see them cast this game for years, decades.
Am i glad they paired up? - I'm really glad that Zyori is now getting the paycheck he deserves, but am i glad that he's now paired up with Breaky? NO!
They do not compliment eachother. They don't give eachother anything, which either of them couldn't provide alone.
Imagine these duos:
BreakyCPK + Swindlemelonzz
Zyori + Jah
Now we're looking at two duos, who are all very clean for the ears, and will provide us with both competitive insight, as well as the radiovoice from Breaky/Zyori which we enjoy. I'm not saying things should be perfect, but we can at least strive for it.
"Why do you care? Why aren't you just happy that you're getting something?"
- I care a lot about hon. I love the game.
Seeing as S2 is supporting Honcast- i will naturally do my best to improve what can be improved. When HC is being supported by S2, then we should obviously be expecting the best.
Dealing with it
Now, how do we deal with this scenario? Breaky and Zyori aren't simply going to split up... Are they?
There is no doubt in my mind that both of them are amazing maincasters- they just don't compliment eachother as cocasters.
We already know, from the information we have about Hontour, that there will be a lot of matches to be played, and a lot of games to be covered/casted.
This is why i want to bring my voice out there: Split up. You'd be able to cover two games at once, and then you can possibly pair up at finals, even though i don't see the point.
Find cocasters who compliment you, who can bring the viewers all the insight they are hungry for. Yes, i realize that both Swindlemelonzz and Jah are currently in teams, and involved with the competitive scene- but there are others out there who could possibly help you out. AngryTestie- or any of the swedish leftovers.
Sweden has so many hidden talents, being overshined by the likes of Era, Loda, Akke, Fittske -- and so on. You get the jest.
You won't ever get the best, if you don't strive for perfection.
TL;DR - Breaky and Zyori are too good maincasters, to be wasted on casting together. Two maincasters doesn't add up, in my honest opinion.
PS: I am sorry if this is too "frankly" spoken for the honforums, but if not here- it'll simply be on reddit. I would be happy to hear some feedback.
The question is: What is the perfect combination of casters?
- How do we reach the level of the SC2-casters?
> Also, paying freelancers could be a good way of increasing interest.
Last edited by FJ; 04-23-2012 at 04:29 AM.
To be honest: I think your analysis of zyori is a bit off. He does give much better strategic insight than breaky, he has a much better grasp of the game and isn't afraid to show it. The information he provides as to why certain itemchoices are made, line-ups are picked or strategies are played out is almost always bang on the money. I like to look at breaky and zyori like this: Breaky is the easier caster that gives good entertainment value, although his casts aren't always as professional as zyori's, it's fun to watch and great to have a beer and some friends over so you can watch it like you would've watched a regular sports match.
Zyori gives the more professional side of the story, he sees so much more going on in the match and succesfully communicates that to the viewer. The audience he caters too is a bit more interested in the strategic part of the game, they watch those matches for other reasons and would never watch breaky if they actually wanted to learn something new. Zyori can provide just that, and he does it with flair
Both have their weak and their strong points idd, and putting zyori and breaky together might work great on paper, but the reality shows that it just doesnt work out at all.
Wich is kinda normal: breaky is never going to give up his position as main caster, even though zyori is the much better option. So I agree with you that they should never have joined forces. I say let there be a little competition. If breaky sees the need to dumb down every cast he makes than zyori's efforts and talent will be wasted. Simple as that.
you got something wrong: the most popular duo was never and still sin't breaky + zyori. the most popular co-casters alongisde breakycpk/zyori has always been and will always be competitive players. for instance, when zyori is casting with Jah or whoever or breakycpk with HenryD (popular but not that great insight) or swindlemelonzz.
and why are you talking about what it requires to be a caster? honestly you don't have any experience on par with alot of other casters - so why you're trying to act as an expert on the subject doesn't really make sense. (no offense i know u really like hon and especially its gosu)
@Nitpicker: I agree, come to think of it- i actually do think Zyori has done a great job bringing in analytical and professional insight to the game. I do, however, think that his abilities and skills weights towards him being the maincaster- and not being on the sideline.
I editted, per request, to give it a more fitting approach.
@_ARIGOLD_ No, i don't have experience on par- or anywhere near breaky and Zyori, Tasteless and Artosis, or any other caster for that matter. I am not trying to act like an expert on the subject. I am expressing my opinion and view upon the case.
- Yes, Zyori and Breaky is the most popular duo right now, because there pretty much isn't anything else.
The scenarios where Breaky- or Zyori is using a competitive cocaster, is not a duo- that's a coinsedence.
before, we had Breaky + HenryD, Sunsfan, FCJ and Nuraun- now it's just Breaky left, as being the only S2-supported caster.
From my perspective, i do not believe that Breaky was "chosen" due to his capabilities, time put into it- or intelligence. To be quite frank, i believe the only reason breaky was chosen, was due to connections @ S2Games- and possibly the fact that he lived close to S2- and would be easy to use as a permanent solution.
(note that these are just perspective-based opinions, and is in no way facts)
I have no complaints with breaky and Zyori, and Ill say that I thought you were very good yourself FJ when I tuned in between games on Honcast you and Sneakee were doing a good job although Sneakee could use a better mic for sure.
find me some co casters
100% agree. I actually like Breaky a lot but the game is so more entertaining when someone is handling the competitive insight. It improves the viewer exprience by 9001%.
Zyori I'm unsure if onaprayer is still around but I remember him doing some great casts at GameReplays and even with Breaky. Swindle is AFAIK ringing but not teaming so he could be a possibility as well. Even shamz did some work with Honcast maybe he could be a better fit? I know forr sure Peterpandam wanted to cast, not sure why he was turned down but he could also be a decent choice.
You could also occasionally try to invite pro players. I know it's hard but sometimes pro players are watching the game live with you and they could be casting. Sender, for instance, does a lot of specing why not invite him over? I also remember some old school casts with N0va that were pretty darn good. Why not ask a couple of TiG members to cast a few games as well?
I'm sure there are a lot of really strong competitive players out there that would like an opportunity to cast...
Dear S2, all I want for my birthday is Brophelia. Please make it happen, thank you.
I've been about to make this posts several times in the past week, great that you got it done FJ and I agree completly with most of it. @Zyori assuming that there's a small paycheck getting a solid co-caster would be incredibly easy, though even without one I could probably find one. @Breaky (lets see if you read this^^) I really love the fact that you've improved your game knowledge by a huge amount lately, your play-by-plays have always been solid but previously I usually cried a little inside when you discussed items/picks, nowadays you are usually right on the money and it really improves the experience.
Comparing SC2 casting to HoN almost makes as much sense as comparing it to Counter Strike casting.
“You promised me Scout,
that if I followed you, you would walk with me always.
But I have noticed that during the most trying periods of my life there has only been one set of footprints in the sand.
Why, when I needed you most, have you not been there for me?”
“The years when you have seen only one set of footprints, my child, is when I carried you.”
S2Games: "Our shop provides only cosmetic changes, NOTHING that directly affects gameplay." ¯\_(ツ)_/¯The two most common elements in the universe are hydrogen and stupidity.
EAP? （╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻
Problem with most of HoNs competitive players are their attitudes; while they always provide insight, they make dumb (often insider) jokes about players or heroes (and often are the only ones who laugh about them). That is the biggest problem with Swindlemelonzz (and HenryD for that matter, even though he is no competitive player).
They are not funny. Period. In other games, dumb jokes and comments have cost people their position as a gamecaster (for example ORB with his famous "dumb ****** risks").
What you basically need is someone like NoVa_, however one that speaks English more fluently (that is not intended as a flame).
Lets compare HoN casts to any other Dota casts:
We have Ayesee, a great talker and play by play shoutcaster that has a voice similar to the one, the only Madmortigan (and thus gives him a lot of fans) + Draskyl, someone who knows the game very well and plays a lot with a lot of different players in NADL inhouses to complement competitive insight. This duo works so great; it is almost a shame that IG choses to overlap their tournaments/casting timings with Tobi.
We have Tobi, the one, the only BLACK HOOOOLE, nothing much needs to be said about him, this guy's enthusiasm is always on such a high level you could argue he is permanently high. This guy plays with all the pros 24/7, even though he is awful at the game, gaining a ton of insight on the players and atmosphere, a thing NO HoNcaster has. And if he does not play with them, he listens to their voicechat+ Synderen,Wagamama, Maelk and any other pro player he can get. Puppey does a lot of dumb jokes (like Swindlemelonzz) and thus is not the ideal caster, but Synderen, Waga, Maelk are all active pro players that play every role for their team and do the drafting, thus delivering a TON of insight.
We have 2GD, a legendary caster that needs no introduction. This guy alone made WoW esports from a spectator-unfriendly game into what it has become over the years + Wagamana (last time, don't know whos next). He basically choses competitive insight over anyone else.
We have Purge, the only caster who mostly casts alone but still does do a phenomenal job. This guy spends so much time on Dota it is unreal, but thanks to that, he delivers high quality casting with his own insight of observing more Dotagames than humanly possible.
I can't speak much about the russian casters such as Vilat, but they appear to be awesome. I think they took the korean model of gamecasting as their own (from PLAYGUUU to RIKIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII DAUBEL KIELLL)
I won't even get into the other casters, you get the gist.
Last edited by musclzglassz; 04-23-2012 at 09:47 AM.
Success in casting has little to do with quality, and lots to do with consistency and reliability. Nova casts with swindle were amazing, the whole 3 casts they did.
Well JF and Swindle were the only person to ever make comments about ward placements and actually talk about it rather than skim over it for some inane chat about Wingbow. Thats why I propagate the Swindle/JF dreamteam.
Fnatic team casting still #1.
main problem is, they know jackshit about the game and are only commentating what everyone can see, good if dont look at the stream, useless otherwise
breaky is there for entertainment and other one should definitely be someone with insight preferably still competitively active or well of wisdom like day9
breaky+zyory is total crap since they are both entertainers and cant provide insight, even if they try its just observations from past games, no reasoning behind it
perfect would be 2 active comp players different roles, different teams, who can showcast ofc (not everyone is made for it) + awesome camera man, concentrating on caster and game itself (dont know anyone like this, hon camera cast always suck at getting action and supplying background for casters)
Last edited by Batchman; 04-23-2012 at 10:18 AM.
List of HoN streamers
i liked breakycpk and henryd ;p
breaky is fantastic caster and i cant really get the haters
he aint pro player but he still learnt a lot and listening to him is really entertaining
his voice is perfect for shoutcasting, he talks fast with amazing diction and his sentences actually make sense
i prefer him to tobby who makes my ear bleed :P