Having no vision but yours, which is reduced aswell, is really an effective way to block your usefulness. Considering the duration on lvl 3 (14 seconds), enemy heroes will be forced to blindcast, blindrun, blindport..Current:
Mana Cost: 50/150/250
Duration: 7/10.5/14 seconds
Cooldown: 120 seconds
- Unlinks shared vision with allies
- Slows enemy heroes for 5% of their movement speed
- Shrinks enemy hero vision radius to 500/450/400
Since it greatly reduces enemy cooperation capabilities in team fights and does that for such a long duration, I propose a nerf.
It's a simple change. Lower the duration, modify the mana cost and make the ulti work on a target hero, not all of the enemy heroes.Suggestion:
Mana Cost: 75/150/225
Duration: 6/8/10 seconds
Cooldown: 120 seconds
- Unlinks target hero's shared vision with allies
- Slows target hero for 5% of their movement speed
- Shrinks target hero vision radius to 500/450/400
This change makes it still very effective for ganks and gives the ability to greatly weaken the effectiveness of an important enemy hero in team fights.
I'm not sure if the slow should be 5% or 10% though :/
Comments or other ideas warmly welcomed
Last edited by Zedor; 07-22-2009 at 07:49 PM. Reason: Changed the topic title
I like those changes, but maybe an area effect would be better. Say for example all heroes in a range of 300/550/800 or something like that. This would keep it still a good 1v1 spell, but also add some teamwork too.
too much of a nerf. it isn't as game breaking as you make it seem. most people use it in team battles, which is a bad time imo. it's a gangking skill, you cast it so no one know's who's getting gangked until it's too late.
In my opinion it's a little too early to start changing the ultimate. I love it the way it is, and being on a near useless hero like Dark Lady almost warrants picking her. I think it lasts a bit too long, but if it was made single target like you are suggesting, she would be 110% worthless.
You're also forgetting the fact that for the 14 seconds you greatly diminish teamplaying ability of the enemy, which is, for a team game, ~10 seconds too long.
that's a valid arugment, the length of how long it lasts, but changing it to a single target? nah bra nah.
If you want to go the AoE route you could have it like Naga's sleep which has a very large AoE radius.
But I think the real fix here is simply to reduce the duration of the effect, or as Limi pointed out in another thread make the effect 'roll off' after its initial cast, this way the longer it goes on the weaker the effect is.
This ulti is way too overpowered to stay as it is. I made my points in the earlier posts in this topic, so I won't repeat them.
The only similarity with this ulti that other heroes have are Thunderbringer and tobeported potm.
Don't know if potm's ulti will stay the same, but it does not hinder enemy teamplay nearly as much as DL does.
Thunderbringer's ulti is mapwide aswell, but it deals damage and gives vision for a short time, it can kill but not block enemy teamplay in a way that you're just running around hoping not to get stomped by the enemy team while waiting for the ulti to expire.
Halving the duration might aswell do it justice, I have no spreadsheets to be able to see it :////////
I think the problem about Dark Lady is the manacost of her spells. You can't really use them untill you hit like level 7-8, because you will be instantly oom. Having no mana regen items means that you will most likely be oom after casting ya spells, too. Either that or give her more str/agi per level.
It's similar to potm's spell.
except it's way better.
it needs a duration nerf.
make the duration constant across all levels.
14 seconds is too much.
7 sounds like a nice number
To be honest, I don't see any problem with it hitting the entire enemy hero roster. It's a good ganking/escape spell early on, and a good initiator later. It shouldn't get so much stronger in terms of duration between ranks, though; keep the sight distance static at the Rank 2 level, and lower the progression of duration to 10s at Rank 3 (same duration at Rank 1) but make it apply a stronger movement speed snare.
There are other solutions, of course (making it wear off slowly was one that makes sense to me too), but that'd make it less weird late-game. You'd certainly have to buff some of her other abilities if you nerf the Ultimate, but that's something that should be done anyway.
I'd be willing to support this, if they atleast fix her mana problems. Lower mana cost on either spells or give her some more +int per level.
How about making it a passive aura with 500/750/1000 range which takes away allied vision and reduces sight (maybe not as much as it does now) to heroes near Dark lady.
A passive aura is much stronger than the ulti now.
10s is too long still, the duration needs to be halved at least
Also her Ultimate needs work, it is easily countered through talking to each other. If everybody knows where everybody is you can meet up no matter what. Also if Cover of Darkness hits, everybody is on alert and tries to get somewhere safe. Yes, it is an initiator, but most of the Ladies I've met used it way too early.
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The Dark Lady's ultimate is fine as it is... Its not "overpowerd" its not even "Good"....
Is very very usefull when used properly in a co-ordinated gank, other than that its not that great... Its easily overcome and does no damage? The slow is hardly noticable.
The 14 sec time on it is there for chasing when and the intended target doesn't know if he's getting intercepted or not.
In my opinion is perfect as it is.
This spell is downright overpowered. Because it takes you friends sight away too. Please think about this spell in competitive play. One team would have to stand together to see each other and help eachother. Any strong AoE would completely wipe out a team. Option 2: you spread and die one by one. 14 seconds is damn long. In a good team ths enough to take out up to three opponents or at least 2 with a slow/disable on target 3