Hypothetical and Ridiculous HON Math, Your Questions Answered! - For Entertainment Only

[Imakuni]

Got a gold-related question

Suppose there is a passive, 0 cooldown skill that INSTANTLY kills all enemy units as soon as they spaw. Will you reach max gold possible, or will the throne fall before that? At which time each situation would happen?

Notes:
-only your hero in game;
-hero doesn't help creeps at pushing, stays afk in base;
-neutrals are killed as well;
-worst/best case cenarios (lessmax possible gold earned from each creep and neutral);
-no itens are bought or sold

[[S2]ElementUser]

Max gold is 65535. Average gold per regular creep is 42.5 and there are 3 melee creeps & 1 ranged creep per lane from the start and 3 lanes, 1 spawn per faction per lane, so 3*4*42.5 = 510 gold MINIMUM per 30 seconds.

There's also 2 easy camps, 2*2 medium camps and 2*2 hard camps, so I would estimate the gold amount to be ~ 40 for easy, ~80 for medium and ~170 for hard. 2*40 + 4*80 + 4*170 = 1080 gold

So by the 30 second mark you'll already have ~ 1590 gold!

Then you'd get another 510 and another 1080 gold at the 1 min mark, then 1020 + 1080 at 2 mins, and so on - neglecting creep wave increase for melee/ranged units and siege units entirely.

1590 + (1080+510) + (1020+1080)(x-1) , where x=# of mins.

65535 = 3180 + 2100x - 2100

x = ~30 minutes.

This value is most likely representing the more upper limit on these things since melee wave count increases and siege units do spawn as well. Also my gold estimates for neutrals are most likely on the lower end of things to be safe, so chances are you'll reach this amount closer to ~20-25 minutes.

Also, the values for neutrals are ESTIMATED averages - I didn't use any hard numbers whatsoever for neutrals. I also excluded Kongor, as the Kongor gold would make it slightly faster too.

[Imakuni]

Nice! You just didnt count the starting 603 gold, gold earned from creeps pushing towers (since no enemies means tower pushes) and gold the 5g per second we naturally have... I assume with those we could reach somewhere like 18~20min.

[[AOWL]SmurfinBird]

Nice! You just didnt count the starting 603 gold, gold earned from creeps pushing towers (since no enemies means tower pushes) and gold the 5g per second we naturally have... I assume with those we could reach somewhere like 18~20min.

I'm not sure what "gold the 5g per second" means, but you have 0.85 innate gold per second.

[FoXaS]

Hows the player distribution? Like 30% between 1500-1600,20% 1600-1700 etc.

Doesnt really fit in here but i didnt want to open another thread

[Imakuni]

stands for the gold you gain per second in game. since you are alone, you gain the gold from all players. though i didn't know it was 0.85 and not 1.

5*0,85=4,25g

[[ORPO]Zelfana]

If you started the game alone you would only gain the 0.85 gold per second. Only if there were other players and they quit after starting would you get their gold, too.

[[AOWL]SmurfinBird]

If you started the game alone you would only gain the 0.85 gold per second. Only if there were other players and they quit after starting would you get their gold, too.

This would actually change dependant on how many players you set the game to have. In practise, it is normal 0.85/s. In public games alone, you can set the game to 2,4,6,8 or 10. Each of these slots, even if not filled, count as a player to [and therefore, add to] the passive gold/minute.

[[tata]pyrignis]

Is there any hero and item combination (passive skills included) that can kill kongor in one hit in auto attack?

[[S2]MacroHard]

Is there any hero and item combination (passive skills included) that can kill kongor in one hit in auto attack?

We figured out earlier in this thread that the biggest crit possible is 5933 damage. As Kongor has 7500 health and is not affected by armor reduction, the answer is unfortunately no.

=(

[[iG]iNsania]

What's the highest GPM that can be achieved at the 20min mark excluding hero slays and tower pushes?
- If you could add "highest CS possible" as well that'd be great.

Thanks on forehand Macro and EU

[OsianII]

Assuming only lane creeps are killed, by the min 20 (or better before 19.59 min) there are 39 creep waves.

First 33 contain (not including siege yet) 3 mellee and 1 ranged, so 4 creeps. 6 of them, waves 34 to 39 contain 4 mellee and 1 ranged so 5 altogether (because there is additional creep added at 999 sec).
Additionally every 7th wave has a siege unit. There are 5 of these waves till min 20 (7,14,21,28,35).
(Source http://www.playdota.com/mechanics/unitstats#i).

Max gold for creep =50
Max gold for siege = 80
Average gold for creep =42.5
Average gold for siege =65
(Source http://honwiki.net/wiki/Sapling and adjoining pages)

Passive gold =69
=================================
Gold you would expect if you last hit every creep
((33*4 + 6*5)*42.5 + 5*68)/20 + 69 = 361.25 + 69 (68.75)= 370 gpm

Max gold is 50 for creeps, 80 for siege. All together
((33*4 + 6*5)*50 + 5*80)/20+69 = 425+69 = 494 gpm.

Max number of creeps
(33*4 + 6*5) + 5 = 167 cs


Plz check somebody as I am quite tired right now and mistakes are probable

[PotatoFalk]

I've got a question for you.

When playing puppet master (with a shroud), in which cases is it beneficial to use your ultimate to break your shroud followed by a whiplash that hits both the target enemy and your ult, versus simply breaking shroud with a whiplash attack?

Please also factor in the different levels of ult giving different damage amplification.

Thanks in advance!

[[wGCw]Wei2SMITHIE]

We figured out earlier in this thread that the biggest crit possible is 5933 damage. As Kongor has 7500 health and is not affected by armor reduction, the answer is unfortunately no.

=(

I'm not trying to insult your knowledge or anything here, in fact I may be wrong as they may have been changed this.

But wouldn't it be possible to one shot kong in one auto attack if Puppet Master ultied kong then used a refresher orb to ulti the existing puppet? (I know this use to work as I’ve done it in practice mode a while ago)

If it’s been changed so you can’t do this then dw, but if you Puppet Master still can "ulti his ulti" then read on.

I’m no mathematician or HoN guru.. but!!

Assuming Puppet Master had
x 5 Doombringers and x 1 Refresher Orb
= 1,298 raw item damage

Chuck in a x2 crit Whiplash = 2,596 damage
Now I’m not sure how the damage how the damage from the 1^st Puppet to the second is calculated but I’m guessing it would be done by taking the total amplified damage delivered to the 1^st puppet then amplify that again by 180% when it passes through the 2nd puppet.

This makes more sense then taking the above number and multiplying it by 360%.

If this work then the amount of total damage would be 20,274.24 total damage (this is enough to kill Kong twice over)

Note this number would be bigger when you factor in Puppets base damage at level 25 (I don’t know this number as I’m at work atm)

So in theory if this still work I guess you can still one shot kong in one auto attack?

If I’m completely wrong then excuse this post, a minor totem for effort would be nice though

[Jotain]

Wei2SMITHIE, the ult doesnt work like that. It will only amplify up to 1000 damage, if it takes more than that then the extra damage will be transferred without amplification.

[[AOWL]SmurfinBird]

I'm not trying to insult your knowledge or anything here, in fact I may be wrong as they may have been changed this.

But wouldn't it be possible to one shot kong in one auto attack if Puppet Master ultied kong then used a refresher orb to ulti the existing puppet? (I know this use to work as I’ve done it in practice mode a while ago)

If it’s been changed so you can’t do this then dw, but if you Puppet Master still can "ulti his ulti" then read on.

I’m no mathematician or HoN guru.. but!!

Assuming Puppet Master had
x 5 Doombringers and x 1 Refresher Orb
= 1,298 raw item damage

Chuck in a x2 crit Whiplash = 2,596 damage
Now I’m not sure how the damage how the damage from the 1^st Puppet to the second is calculated but I’m guessing it would be done by taking the total amplified damage delivered to the 1^st puppet then amplify that again by 180% when it passes through the 2nd puppet.

This makes more sense then taking the above number and multiplying it by 360%.

If this work then the amount of total damage would be 20,274.24 total damage (this is enough to kill Kong twice over)

Note this number would be bigger when you factor in Puppets base damage at level 25 (I don’t know this number as I’m at work atm)

So in theory if this still work I guess you can still one shot kong in one auto attack?

If I’m completely wrong then excuse this post, a minor totem for effort would be nice though

As above, you are incorrect in your assumptions. This idea has already been brought up in this thread and MacroHard has explained it. Additionally, asking for minor totems is the most surefire way to guarantee you do not get one; it's not usually for a one time thing either.

[[SBT]Necroth]

What is the longest time your team can stunlock an enemy hero given they have infinite mana.
Channeling abilities are not allowed.

[SuperCommand]

What is the longest time your team can stunlock an enemy hero given they have infinite mana.
Channeling abilities are not allowed.

What is the longest time your team can stunlock an enemy hero given they have infinite mana.
Channeling abilities are not allowed.

Doing it for indefinite time without using specials such as VJ(2 targets with optimal distance) or Ophelia with many creeps(Should that be a good idea) and without using pseudostuns such as succubus sleep or morph/hex this could be tricky.

Behemoth 1.5sec 4sec CD.
Pestilence 2.5sec 8sec CD.
Rampage 1.5sec 7sec CD.
Witchslayer 2.5sec 12sec CD.
Midas 2sec 7sec CD.

Adding casttimes(And letting Rampage run around) we get:

Behemoth 1.5sec 5sec CD.
Pestilence 2.5sec 8.5sec CD.
Rampage 1.5sec 6sec CD.
Witchslayer 2.5sec 12.5sec CD.
Midas 2sec 7.5sec CD.

This combo does not allow you to stun someone forever by just using the skills listed. Adding Fissure, Shockwave, Stamped and the Chains that bind might allow you to stun something indefinite. If anyone finds a better combo you should list it.

[[E]theli]

btw, top ways to stun heroes
valk 5s arrow
tundra ult 4s (lvl3 ult)
nomad ult lvl3/minotaur/bubbles ult lvl3 - 3s

[[SBT]Necroth]

@theli

The whole idea of my question was to find a combination of spells where stun abilities get used multiple times once they go off cooldown.

For example, if pestilence uses Impale (8s cooldown, 2.5s stun) and the others manage to stun him for another 5.5 seconds (8 - 2.5) he gets to use his impale again. Obviously duplicate heroes are not allowed and cast times should be factored in for this to be accurate.