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Depending on your character obviously, but lets here what lifesteal the community chooses to use with who and why.
Personally, I use Vamp aura most of the time, however Elder Parasite seems appealing on Madman.
Elder Parasite I will get on Chronos, but Madman doesn't have the HP to support it. Whispering Helm beats Abyssal Skull nine times out of ten and you really only will be getting the latter if you're a hero like Accursed. Symbol of Rage is very pricey for what it gives but can be a nice luxury item to get if the game starts dragging into the point where you have level 25s on all sides slogging it out, otherwise the money is far better spent elsewhere.
I don't get abyssal skull unless I need auras for some reason, or I need additional lifesteal over what I have.
Elder parasite is for attack speed (such as puppet).
Everything else, whispering helm.
My hero suggestions:
http://dream.heroesofnewerth.com/hero/WindRaven/
Gust - Druidess - Mobeus - Stone Angel
Most of the heroes I get that would need life steal also need attack speed so I almost always go Eldar Parasite.
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Mr. Warbeast = Abyssal Skull, especially early
Eldar Parasite is a double edged blade. The damage it forces you to take is insane, so it is best partnered with an item like Shrunken Head. Without the skull, you'll get stunned and killed very quickly.
I don't get lifesteal at all on most heroes. The benefit it grants is very low unless you already have a lot of damage. Lifetube for 25+ less gold grants more lane staying ability. Late game, the lifesteal simply isn't worth it when similarly priced items will end the fight faster, preventing the need for lifesteal.
Don't get me wrong, lifesteal is good for some heroes. For most; however, it is not.
Notable heroes who usually get lifesteal are Moonqueen, Chronos, and Pestilence. Sometimes Hammerstorm depending on how you build him.
Last edited by Tripwyr; 10-12-2009 at 12:37 PM.
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I am of the firm opinion that subtracting "raging stupidity" from anyone's voice can only cause them to sound more like myself.
Could you elaborate why the eldar + skull is a good idea? I'm afraid I don't understand the logic there.Originally Posted by Tripwyr
Agreed. Early game you attack too slowly and do too little damage. Mid-game it's nice but late game, unless you have crazy attack speed and damage it's not going to do much.I don't get lifesteal at all on most heroes. The benefit it grants is very low unless you already have a lot of damage. Lifetube for 25+ less gold grants more lane staying ability. Late game, the lifesteal simply isn't worth it when similarly priced items will end the fight faster, preventing the need for lifesteal.
Don't get me wrong, lifesteal is good for some heroes. For most; however, it is not.
It's important to note that Moon Queen does not get the life steal off of her bounces (unless this has changed). The animation used to show it doing that. I don't know if it does now.Notable heroes who usually get lifesteal are Moonqueen, Chronos, and Pestilence. Sometimes Hammerstorm depending on how you build him.
Hammerstorm with enhanced marchers and Eldar is ridiculous. Shrunken head will let you finish your attacks, too.
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Agreed, you get it for the AS rather than the lifesteal though, as combined with insanatarious and shrunken head you can do some serious damage.Hammerstorm with enhanced marchers and Eldar is ridiculous. Shrunken head will let you finish your attacks, too.
Imo, the only reason for moon queen to get lifesteal is to stack ancients, else its not that useful unless you manage to get a symbol of rage.
Lifesteal is overrated in pubs really, in all the comp HoN games I've seen only one MQ that bothered getting it. Damage and health are much better options early and mid. However if you do get one, abyssal is for warbeast and supports only imo, HotD is a better choice for dps heroes
My ISP blocks LoL forums
Simply because it makes you immune to stun. By making yourself immune to stun you can dish out the damage that you intended when you activated eldar. Without skull, they will just stun and destroy you when you activate it.
I know it doesn't proc from bounces. It is taken on Moon Queen because her farming capability combined with her ability to obtain kills easily makes her core build very extensive. Specifically: Bottle(opt.) -> Slash -> Geometer's -> Wingbow -> Whispering <-> Shrunken Head -> Symbol of Rage.
This for a long time has been the core build on Moon queen, with the exception of Geometer's Bane being added after the revamp. The reasoning behind this is that her multi-strike scales extremely well, so we build her for staying power. Since she can farm very well, she can afford all of this very easily. Geometer's is taken for damage and the dispel, often highly underrated. Most people think Geometer's is only good for MS and illusions, this is not at all true.
Next she gets Wingbow so that she evades at 30% in addition to giving her attack speed. She now has a lot of damage and can tank well with Wingbow, we now get Whispering because the effect of lifesteal is devastating to her now outstanding lasting power. Her only weakness now is stuns, for that we get Shrunken Head. When Shrunken head is active she will not die unless focused by 3-5 people. What do you do to fix this? Symbol of Rage. With Shrunken Head and Symbol of Rage, Moon queen can not die. Her multistrikes will kill the entire team while she remains above 90%.
Why don't I just write a mini-guide, wtf. In short, while her multistrikes don't steal life, lifesteal is still part of the core build on Moonqueen after Wingbow + Geo's bane.
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I am of the firm opinion that subtracting "raging stupidity" from anyone's voice can only cause them to sound more like myself.
Do you mean the Shrunken Head? That has the Avatar ability. The Abyssal Skull is just a port of Vladmir's Offering.Simply because it makes you immune to stun. By making yourself immune to stun you can dish out the damage that you intended when you activated eldar. Without skull, they will just stun and destroy you when you activate it.
I get a lifesteal on 2 heroes, Maliken and Hammerstorm, even then only when I've finished their core items and have over 200 damage.
Yeah, I have not much to add.
Lifesteal can be useless if you do not have damage enough. However any heroes that benefit from critical strikes should have it, as Swiftblade or Puppet Master.
However, it can really make the difference when you go jungle after a teamfight, or when you get into a direct fight against other dps hero. It's not that it is necessarily most of times useless, its just that it's not essential, maybe secondary.
Then, answering the original question, I always go for Whispering Helm. When I have nothing else to spend money, I upgrade it to Symbol of Rage. Abyssal Skull seems so useless since I can have Lifesteal and others orb effects, and never used Elder Parasite; i just don't like the cost-benefit. Works well on Chronos and other attack speed lacking heroes.
whispering helm, nearly always.
turn it into symbol and youre fine.
elder parasite on carries is good.
Whispering Helm is usually an incredibly strong choice, being able to dominate a creep and use it to scout or stun or lend an aura is an incredible asset, its a shame most people don't have the micro to pull it off most of them time.
I think you meant to say shrunken head instead of abyssal skull. Right?
You know that, and I know that, but I've seen people who didn't know that.
I know it doesn't proc from bounces. It is taken on Moon Queen because her farming capability combined with her ability to obtain kills easily makes her core build very extensive. Specifically: Bottle(opt.) -> Slash -> Geometer's -> Wingbow -> Whispering <-> Shrunken Head -> Symbol of Rage.
So to all of you who didn't know: It does NOT proc on bounces. Only on the initial hit.
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Abyssal Skull only on Warbeast, and on the Ursa Port once it comes out (maybe not if his swipes stack with Whispering Helm).
Elder Parasite on Chronos
All other times Whispering Helm --> Symbol of Rage IF I am taking lifesteal
"Flaming on the internet is like running in the special olympics. It does not matter if you win, you are still retarded. "
Ya, I meant Shrunken head. I always mix them up.
Last edited by Tripwyr; 10-12-2009 at 01:03 PM.
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I am of the firm opinion that subtracting "raging stupidity" from anyone's voice can only cause them to sound more like myself.
I get whispering helm on most melee heroes afte ri got a respectabel amount of damage and attack speed items
does madman need lifesteal? and if so, which one?
It's useful to get in the later game. Generally you should get Whispering Helm as by that point you can rely on your ulti or other items for attack speed and move speed. You don't need the extra damage-taken you'll get from the activatable.
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