The OFFICIAL DOTA2 Thread

**`lorko** · 06-29-2012, 10:10 PM

Originally Posted by nigmorris

1. proper "rts" game? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ByD29uiJYjc you mean like sc2? lol

2. It's unit response delay = delay on giving a command. Which command doesn't matter.

3. Client side prediction big part of everything.

4. It got fix'd. Check the date on SUNSFans video and then look at the patchnotes afterwards.

I have been in the beta the entire time. Thanks for the talk, but you have no idea what you are talking about.

See, some things are just different in other games. And that's how it is. DotA has delay/castingtimes/animations/high turnrates etc. on some heroes/in the overall game. And that won't change just because 10000 HoN players complain about it.

You saying valva servers or bad coding? and why hon got such great response delay???
but theres heroes like (torture w/e his name in dota 2)requires like 2~2.5 sec to land his stun which is retarded beside server delay makes it like 3 sec , and tbh valve should work more on heroes designs and attack animations.....

**nigmorris** · 06-29-2012, 10:50 PM

Originally Posted by `lorko

You saying valva servers or bad coding? and why hon got such great response delay???
but theres heroes like (torture w/e his name in dota 2)requires like 2~2.5 sec to land his stun which is retarded beside server delay makes it like 3 sec , and tbh valve should work more on heroes designs and attack animations.....

No, because DotA is that way. That's how DotA is. And DotA is way more successful in pretty much everything than HoN. Playerbase etc.

People like it that way, and nobody has to change it for the SMALL PART that the HoNcommunity actually makes. Leshrac stun delay is 0.5 seconds. With the animations that he has to actually cast it. He's going up for the stun, and then it takes 0.5 for it to come off. That's easy as that. That's how it is. You don't actually know how long 2 seconds are, apparently. Count the time, please.

It really is easy as that.

In HoN nearly everything is instant. In DotA it's different. More people play DotA than people play HoN.

**Swanker** · 06-30-2012, 12:10 AM

The stupidity of some of you is astounding. Comparing cast-times to ****in delay. Someone needs to link the stupid ES/Behe video again to show people that the response is INSTANT in both.

**[GnJA]Good_Apollo** · 06-30-2012, 12:43 AM

Apparently people weren't around before Tort got buffed. S2 MADE it faster, it's not a technical issue.

**nigmorris** · 06-30-2012, 01:23 AM

Originally Posted by Good_Apollo

Apparently people weren't around before Tort got buffed. S2 MADE it faster, it's not a technical issue.

They also apparently were not around when Torturer was shittier and the stun was the same as the one in DotA. I love how dumb people are. It makes me happy.

**Gipp** · 06-30-2012, 02:19 AM

i feel like people play lina/leshrac in their first game and then ***** about delay

**Hat_Truck** · 06-30-2012, 02:34 AM

Originally Posted by nigmorris

They also apparently were not around when Torturer was shittier and the stun was the same as the one in DotA. I love how dumb people are. It makes me happy.

Leshrac is one of the most picked and banned heroes in comp play for DotA 2. S2 had to buff Torturer cuz they're **** at balance.

**[Jigg]Tensei** · 06-30-2012, 05:47 AM

Don't forget that S2 outright buffed certain heroes' turn rates (I remember Valk and Soulstealer getting turn rate buffs specifically, but I'm sure there were other heroes as well), and certain new heroes (Monkey King for example) already have an insanely high turn rate. Various heroes also got improved cast speed (like Torturer and Pyro). Suffice to say, HoN in beta felt a lot 'slower' too, so I still think it's less about the net code and more about the animation and cast delays.

**gambler** · 06-30-2012, 07:27 AM

Leshrac is almost always first pick in competitive playing. And by the way, go watch competitive Dota 2 games. You'll feel like there's only noobs left in comp Hon.

**Roux** · 06-30-2012, 09:31 AM

There is no delay like i said, pick Wisp and see for yourself, he moves instantly because he has no turnrate and neat animations.

**airplane** · 06-30-2012, 04:23 PM

Originally Posted by Roux

There is no delay like i said, pick Wisp and see for yourself, he moves instantly because he has no turnrate and neat animations.

wisp's turn rate is 0.7. average.

**XrBob** · 06-30-2012, 04:59 PM

I got the dota2 invite a week ago. All I gotta say is invoker won me over. He's so much fun, he's all I play. I might go back to playing hon if he didn't exist.

**Fruit_Goose** · 07-03-2012, 08:39 AM

Received a dota 2 beta invite.

I've played hon for a long time and have a few words to say.

The first thing I noticed and tried to fix was unit response time. It's not cast or attack or anmimation or whatever else times. It is the time that your hero needs to react to your command. And the thing is, it isn't instant, like in hon. It is 0.1-0.2ms(so it feels). It feels like playing with 150-200 ping.

Dota 2 unit response time is utterly UGLY. MOBA games are all about action, clutch situations, juking , lasthitting, harassing, orbwalking and etc etc etc. People who say that dota2 is more about strategy are idiots.

If I wanted to play a turn-based strategy, where reflexes are completely irrelevant , well I might as well go and play Heroes of might and magic or whatever other turnbased game people are playing now.

Dota 2 feels like playing hon with 200 ping. Ofc anyone can adapt and learn to lasthit and so on. But I just don't see any point in introducing artificial delay of this kind. It kills the fluidity of the game, makes it less dynamic and this kind of games are all about being really dynamic and fast.

You want to quit playing MOBA games - play dota 2 after hon. The games are slow, uninteresting, no rush of adrenaline in your bloodstream, nothing.

And yeah, concede function in hon absolutely rocks. Community in both games is about the same. Plenty of haters, noobs, whiners, a lot of leavers in the lower brackets.

**Swanker** · 07-03-2012, 08:47 AM

Originally Posted by Fruit_Goose

Received a dota 2 beta invite.

I've played hon for a long time and have a few words to say.

The first thing I noticed and tried to fix was unit response time. It's not cast or attack or anmimation or whatever else times. It is the time that your hero needs to react to your command. And the thing is, it isn't instant, like in hon. It is 0.1-0.2ms(so it feels). It feels like playing with 150-200 ping.

Dota 2 unit response time is utterly UGLY. MOBA games are all about action, clutch situations, juking , lasthitting, harassing, orbwalking and etc etc etc. People who say that dota2 is more about strategy are idiots.

If I wanted to play a turn-based strategy, where reflexes are completely irrelevant , well I might as well go and play Heroes of might and magic or whatever other turnbased game people are playing now.

Dota 2 feels like playing hon with 200 ping. Ofc anyone can adapt and learn to lasthit and so on. But I just don't see any point in introducing artificial delay of this kind. It kills the fluidity of the game, makes it less dynamic and this kind of games are all about being really dynamic and fast.

You want to quit playing MOBA games - play dota 2 after hon. The games are slow, uninteresting, no rush of adrenaline in your bloodstream, nothing.

And yeah, concede function in hon absolutely rocks. Community in both games is about the same. Plenty of haters, noobs, whiners, a lot of leavers in the lower brackets.

**Fruit_Goose** · 07-03-2012, 09:31 AM

Lol this video shows that cast times, cast points and so on are equal. What I'm talking about is unit response time. The video doesn't show that the author clicked "q" at the same time. He just made two replays and interposed the moments when the earthshaker and behemoth already STARTED casting the spell. It doesn't show that it actually takes earthsaker longer to START casting the spell, not CAST it.

**chamois** · 07-03-2012, 11:24 AM

I don't feel the input lag/delay in Dota 2.

I have played countless hours of bw on bnet hamachi and iccup, war3, sc2. They have various levels of input delay. If I go into a sc2 game right now I will be able to notice the terrible delay. If I play BW I can tell just from unit response if it's vlan, iccup, or bnet from the delay. In Dota 2 I don't see or feel a delay, but still there are HoN players who insist it's there.

You can't say I'm used to it or conditioned because I still notice it in those games. How can I be unable of noticing it in one game but be able to notice it in every other? They clearly don't all play the same, and I would never argue they do, but I don't experience input delay in Dota 2 and I haven't in a very long time (at least 8 or 9 months).

**Hat_Truck** · 07-03-2012, 11:45 AM

I get almost no delay as well. It helps to turn V-Sync off and google how to edit your autoexec.cfg to reduce input delay. Once I've done both those things I don't notice any delay.

**`lorko** · 07-03-2012, 12:09 PM

you should teach us!

**Evermourn** · 07-03-2012, 08:01 PM

Originally Posted by Fruit_Goose

Lol this video shows that cast times, cast points and so on are equal. What I'm talking about is unit response time. The video doesn't show that the author clicked "q" at the same time. He just made two replays and interposed the moments when the earthshaker and behemoth already STARTED casting the spell. It doesn't show that it actually takes earthsaker longer to START casting the spell, not CAST it.

Look closely and you can see the curser click to indicate the input for both Earthshaker (red) and Behemoth (yellow). Slow down the video speed (I watched at 0.5x) and it's apparent that the response times were identical to the human eye.

**Roux** · 07-04-2012, 04:11 PM

Valve with another 2 hero patch, awesome sauce!

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