I just played a 3vs2 game as Electrician with Blacksmith and Magmus against Jereziah&Accursed, we lost
Now, we 3 were noobs (I'm generally still a noob, Magmus wasn't bad and Blacksmith was a 1st time player, but he didn't play that bad really), but I still think we should've been able to get them.
Thing is, we simply couldn't kill Jereziah. We managed to bomb the Accursed twice I think, but they got so many escapes (usually very low on health and Jereziah just pops his heals) it's not even funny. This was on the small map.
Any idea how to counter them? I used my ulti as much as possible on Jereziah's shields etc. and I tried to grip and emp the hell out of them while taking it on with my shield but we just weren't able to pound them down when they were together, they always managed to heal back and eventually push us.
Any ideas? Specific items etc?
NOTE: I'm not discussing team change here. I'm asking how to play in this specific scenario. It's also not a whine thread, the guys were playing great, we weren't.
The game isnt balanced around 2v2, 3v3 etc etc, its made for 5v5. When you have 5 players you should always have someone who can counter healers by silencing them or at least stunning them a couple of times to get them out of the battle, this isnt the case when theres only 2 or 3 of you
Saying that in your battle every fight should have gone a similar way, and you should have easily won since Electrician is a decent counter to Jeraziah
Electrician grips Jeraziah when he doesnt have protective charm up, if he does have it up use Electricians ulti first to get rid of it, magmus can then stand next to him and ulti. Blacksmith then could fireball him to help finish him off before Electricians grip wore off. If Accursed stuck around to try to help Jeraziah Blacksmith will be able to easily keep up with him with frenzy, stunning him when his fireball comes back, by then electrician should be able to grip him again. when his ulti goes off just stop attacking, when it finishes magmus can stun, electrician zap to slow him down etc etc.
What the previous poster said mostly. You need to make sure that you're teammates are bursting Jereziah during your grip, which also means make sure you grip while your allies are nearby. Tell magmus to only use his ultimate when Jereziah is gripped, or if you just purged shield off.
Jereziah + Accursed has a lot of healing, but your team doesn't have much sustained damage. All of the damage from your team is burst, so if they can survive it, there is no way for you to win. If you organize yourselves well, and burst down Jereziah during grip, then you stand a chance. If you don't do that, you'll go down pretty quickly.
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First of all you will lose definitely ... because initially they both have heal and money
Countering their heroes such as Magebane, Succubus, Arachna and the likes...
For Accursed if he got sheild, just wait for it to disappear and then kill him
For Jereziah.. Avoid getting near him when he has mana and heal because it is pure damage like succy...
You're 3 heroes do actually have good combo just that you dont have enough money and precious time
Electrician can use his ulti to purge Jeraziah's shield, that's definitely something I've found VERY usable. Other than that it's mainly about good teamplay and getting a balanced team together.
Sadly your team don't have enough reliable dps unless Magus got his ulti on.
Electrician is a excellent gank initiator but in a 3v2 game his dps is too low.
Both you and Magmus need some dps item no matter if it's Codex or Mocking Brilliance.
Btw you need to learn when to stop attacking Accursed in order to kill him. When you see he's on blue fire just follow him or grip him, you need to save all your dps until he's out of ulti.
EDIT: Forgot that accursed can remove the grip.
Last edited by Avathacis; 10-07-2009 at 12:50 PM.
The key is to get a Legionnaire if u face both. Taunt + Spin + Decapitate goes through repel. The last decapitate also goes through Accursed ultimate.
Also what they already said, the game isn't balanced around 3v3. It is very hard to nuke those 2 down when there is a third assisting him. My advice is to get 1 Legionnaire, 1 CC hero and 1 strong carry from early to late (madman for example, the AOE stun helps aswell.)
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Note that Electrician's ult does not dispel Accursed's blue fire. You'd think it would, but it doesn't...
Also, neither Accursed nor Jeraziah have any stuns/disables, unless they buy an item such as Totem of Kuldra or Storm Spirit. This means they can't stun Electrician out of his Static Grip. However, both heroes can use Protective Charm or Fire Shield to dispel Electrician's Static Grip. The idea is to wait until one of them casts their protective ability, then you counter with Electrician's ult and immediately grip the other hero. Once you have an enemy hero successfully gripped (preferably Jeraziah), all of your teammates must focus fire on that disabled hero.
Lastly, your team has 3 stuns/disables. At max ability levels, that's 4.75 + 1.5 + 2.17 = 8.42 total seconds of stun time. If you waited until your enemy's cool-down as I mentioned above, then there's no reason why you can't kill at least one of them, especially given Magmus' incredible ult. Just remember to coordinate all of your stuns ahead of time.
Last edited by geofflee; 10-08-2009 at 04:13 AM.
You have Electrician, Magmus and Bltoo bad! It's me BLACKSMITH!
They have Jera and Accursed.
Your basic strategy with your heroes would be to crowd control them to death.
Blacksmith --> Hellflower, Stormspirit, Brutalizer, Daemonic Breastplate
Electrician --> Helm of the Black Legion, Stormspirit, Frostfield plate, Behemoth's heart.
Magmus --> Nome's Wisdom, Totem of Kuldra, Restoration stone
The general idea is that you have enough crowd control in that team to isolate a hero for 20 seconds while you beat down on another hero, you should be beating down on Jeraziah while you have Accursed hex'd cycloned or grabbed. Blacksmith should use stun to initiate followed by magmus stun, then you grab Accursed while Blacksmith silences Jeraziah as Magmus is casting his ultimate (they have no interrupts anyway. Magmus gets a full duration ultimate off, you then both cyclone accursed while you beat down Jeraziah, he has to die within about 12 seconds or he will get his ultimate off mid-game, Late game you have about 20 seconds of free dps time on him. If he does get his ultimate off, Magmus should use steam bath, you should activate your shield and run, and Blacksmith can just run away with his 480ms. After that just rinse and repeat.
The game really isn't balanced for anything lower than 5v5 so I really suggest if you want to learn the game mechanics and understand the game on a higher level, you shouldn't be playing <5v5 also don't play EM either, it really isn't easy, the more you play it at the start the harder it is to learn non-em which is what the game is balanced around.
The game isn't meant to be played 3v3, but quite honestly I find that the game is mostly still balanced aside from a few strong hero lineups. These can always be banned, or countered by items and careful ganking strategies. Trust me, I've played over 400 2v2 and 3v3 games. I prefer 3v3 because 2v2 can screw you over with hero picks much more easily, and because I don't enjoy the chaos of and multitudes of things to keep track of in 5v5.
Also, I firmly believe that the game is easier to learn in a 3v3. Single mechanics and ganking tactics are much easier to learn in smaller games where they are less likely to be lost in the confusion. A new player has less heroes to keep track of and less abilities to learn and understand in a single game. Basically, less chaos means better learning and understanding. After getting a grasp on the game, one could move up to 5v5 and have a better chance of actually having a decent game.
Last edited by Ashnal; 04-25-2010 at 03:35 PM.
Get vindicator or succubus in your case. The Jera + Accursed combo is very hard to beat if both of them are competent, silencing them will halve their combat effectiveness though.
I think the key would be :Stormspirit: on blacksmith. You can get it realy fast with the high starting gold in 3vs3 and it would make it 3 vs 1. If you use it on while killing the figth is over. With all your stuns and slows and bs frenzy, can never defeat you anyway solo. Cause you could just run away when you are low.
When ele gets his shield and some mana and when magmus would skill his creepkill skill you can even outpush them.
The most difficult time would be the early game where you have to play very carefull so they cant collect to much gold.
Nullstone and Nullfire just think about it its pretty easy to counter these two guys
All three of you should have gone hex and aim jereziah. Between 3 hexs, electrician, mamus and blacksmith you could keep him disabled a very long time. When hexed his MS changes to 100 so he cant escape magmus ulti so you dont need the blink. So kill jere then aim for accursed.
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From the author of Tip of the Week.
I would of thought it would be better for Magmus to initiate on Jereziah with a stun. Then elec to grip accursed, while BS follows up on Jere with his stuns and everything in burst.
This way Elec will likely get his full grip as Jere then has to worry more about himself.
You will also need to keep spread, for Jeres heals, that will be a problem as you are all melee.
I am not sure you would be able to do much against two good players. Accursed and Jere are both hard counters to Elec and they will both scale better than all your chars to late game.
Good job necroing a thread from 6 months ago.