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Thread: Cherubim - Huskar inspired agi carry

View Poll Results: Do you like the concept of this hero?

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  1. #1

    Cherubim - Huskar inspired agi carry

    Please remember to vote on hero concept, not on the hard numbers as these will need balanced.


    Cherubim - The Archangel Disciple

    Drawn down from the heavens to fight the Hellbourne, Cherubim is closely linked with the life force of the universe. She fights willingly, but combat in the natural world drains her of her own vitality. However, she makes this sacrifice willingly, and it results in her own combat prowess increasing drastically as she suffers more and more.





    Visuals: What I'd love to see with Cherubim is a kind of morphing. At full health, she should look very human, with angelic wings that are slightly underdrawn, and with a general lithely body shape. As she looses health, she should gain stature and become more "visible". Her wings should gain stature and definition, and she should begin to glow. At extremely low health, she should losok like an avatar, bright glow, large powerful wings, less human features, and very angelic. Her movement should be helped along by wing beats, but she does not truly fly.

    Alignment: Legion
    Primary Stat: Agility
    Speed: 310
    Attack Range: 128

    Strength: 21 +1.95
    Agility: 20 + 2.35
    Int: 15 + 1.5




    Skills:


    Force Strikes
    Cherubim directly injects her life force into her sword, imbuing it with life force altering properties. Each strike slows her opponent, while adding to her own effectiveness. But the cost is high, as her own life feeds the flaming blade.


    • Toggleable
    • Each strike adds 1 debuff charge to her opponent - Stacks up to 4 times
    • Each debuff charge transfers 3/6/10/15% Movement Speed and 1/3/5/8% attack speed from the target to Cherubim.
    • Each attack costs .5/1/1.5/2% of Cherubim's life and mana
    • While active, Cherubim receives a 1% boost to her damage for each 1% of life she is missing.
    • Charges last 10 seconds

    Visuals: Upon activation, her sword should glow with very light colored flame effects, each strike should cause two effects, one transfering power lines from Cherubim to the sword, and another transferring power from the enemy back to Cherubim. This can be similar to the lifesteal effect.



    Heaven's Light

    This skill accumulates the life force of Cherubim's opponents and uses it to protect her as she channels immense forces from the skies. Upon activation, an immense beam of light from heaven strikes her target, but can cause serious harm to Cherubim, and must be employed wisely.

    • Each enemy creep or hero killed adds a charge to the skill
    • Maximum 10 charges
    • On activation:
      • Deals 90/175/290/400 magic damage to a single target
      • Stuns target for 1/2/2/3 seconds
      • Reveals all units within a 450 radius of the target
      • This ability also causes the target to deal damage to the Cherubim equal to her max HP BUT damage is reduced by 10% per charge that has been accumulated (this means if the skill kills her, whoever she targeted will get the kill credit and gold for her)
      • Resets charges to 0

    • No cooldown
    • No mana cost

    Visuals: Cherubim should stop, arch her back and face the sky. A beam of light (think Independence Day) should hit both her and her target.

    I've been asked for some clarification on this skill so here it is. You start with 0 charges on the skill. Each kill you make adds a charge (up to 10). If you were to use the nuke with 10 charges (from killing creeps/heroes) you'd take 0 health damage. If you use it after only getting 5 charges, you'd lose half your max hp. If you use it with 0 charges, you'll kill yourself (giving the other team a kill). Each time the skill is used it eliminates all charges, and it has no CD, so spamming the button is gonna get you killed - hope that helps


    Blessing of the Archangel
    Blessing may be a bit of a misnomer, at least for the recipients of this spell. When used, Cherubim focuses her sensitivity to life and projects it upon her opponents. This opens a bond of pain from Cherubim to her enemies that is a small glimpse into the world of the Archangel.


    • This spell bounces between 3/4/5/7 opponents, placing a debuff charge on every hit
    • No limit on a single target to total charges
    • Debuff charges last 30 seconds
    • While active, 30% of all damage Cherubim takes is dealt to each debuff charge.
    • 120/90/75/60 second cooldown
    • 115/175/225/275 mana cost

    Visuals: This spell should be VERY fast animated, like the chain animation from Warlock in DOTA. It should be a halo effect that starts around Cherubim's feet and quickly moves up her body and past her head before dissipating. Simultaneously, her non-sword hand should make a throwing motion that launches a white glow at opponents, which instantly bounces between all targets and gives them a soft white glow that lasts throughout the effect. Ideally it will calculate the bounces before the animation and do it without an agonizingly slow keg-like animation.




    Righteous Judgment
    In the ultimate show of sacrifice, Cherubim weighs her own life against that of her opponent. Both Cherubim and her target are lifted high in the air and judged against eachother. If she is deemed worthy, she can survive the test. If not, she is destroyed in a glorious explosion.


    • Righetous Judgement calculates 60/80/100% of missing health from Cherubim, if this number dealt as damage would kill her opponent, the opponent is killed instantly.
    • If this kills her opponent, 20/30/40% of her opponent's maximum health is returned to Cherubim and she survives.
    • If this does not kill her opponent, the opponent instead takes 200/300/400 damage, and Cherubim is killed in a firey explosion, doing 20/30/40% of her maximum health as magic damage to opponents and healing to allies in a 350 AOE radius.
    • All opponents hit by this damage are stunned for 2 seconds and silenced for 4 seconds
    • This spell does not actually do damage when killing either Cherubim or her opponent, it simply kills them (like decapitate)
    • 200/160/120 second cooldown

    Visuals: This should be a spectacular effect over approx 3 seconds. Cherubim and her target should be drawn up into the air and towards each other over the course of 1.5 or so seconds. The next 1.5 seconds (based on who is going to die) should be a quick glow that grows to immense brightness and lights a huge portion of the visible screen. The culmination should be an explosion of light that gets absorbed into everyone in the AOE range if Cherubim dies, or dissipated into the ground if her target dies.





    Synergy:

    Internal synergy is amazing on this hero. The ability to impact your health level via the nuke skill complements all the other skills perfectly. This hero is capable of doing a ton of damage throughout the game, but that capability is limited by how fragile she will be as soon as combat starts. At full health, she is not a huge threat, but still will draw attention so that she can not combo her abilities. All of her skills add player skill beyond mashing buttons, as situational awareness must be very high, and combos must be timed perfectly.

    Partnered with a babysitter type hero (especially healers) she will be devastating as she can utilize her abilities and then be repaired by her friendly lane mate, but she will still fall prey to heavy nukers or disablers. She will be especially vulnerable to Soul Reaper, who is nearly a hard counter.

    Versatility:

    Slightly limited (intentionally) to the glass cannon role, she can also be a sacrificial initiator (hopefully taking someone out with her) that will have a short duration stun + silence. She is a strong hard carry, with good scaling damage and a strong late game power curve. She can be itemized to maximize damage or health pool, both of which will be workable builds.


    Role:

    Hard carry, initiator, glass cannon.
    Last edited by Wylker; 10-12-2009 at 03:42 PM.
    Please check out my two hero ideas (and give them a thumbs up or suggestion):
    Cherubim - A Huskar inspired melee agility hero
    Sergent - A builder type intelligence support hero

    Come help build the HoN Unofficial Wiki at
    http://honwiki.net


    <nface>wylker try to be original
    <nface>else u can't counter me
    <nface>because you're pretty lame

  2. #2
    Changelog:

    10/8/09:

    -Changed Heaven's light skill to no longer allow self-denys
    -Changed Righteous Judgement to not deal damage when killing Cherubim (nerfs the synergy to Blessing of the Archangel some)
    -Added visual effect suggestions
    -Tweaked damage down on Heaven's light
    Last edited by Wylker; 10-08-2009 at 07:14 PM.
    Please check out my two hero ideas (and give them a thumbs up or suggestion):
    Cherubim - A Huskar inspired melee agility hero
    Sergent - A builder type intelligence support hero

    Come help build the HoN Unofficial Wiki at
    http://honwiki.net


    <nface>wylker try to be original
    <nface>else u can't counter me
    <nface>because you're pretty lame

  3. #3
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    Really? More Legion Agility? Christ, this is getting out of hand...

    First off, thanks for changing the name, before it didn't even make sense.

    Second, Skill 2 does 150 at RANK ONE? Uhhhh op?

    All of her abilities have charges? That's annoying

    I like the ultimate but how long does this channeling last? It's like you can effectively take an enemy out of the battle while all that happens.

    Overall it feels very Moon Queenish, with bouncing damage and nuke from the skyyyyyyy

  4. #4
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    Rok - 150 is relatively okay for a rank one...My problem is the next 3 levels after that, IMHO.
    All having charges could be rather creative imho...
    This is officially the greatest response to an answer containing the phrase 'human suffering' EVER. Of All Time. Period.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lawl View Post
    With all these responses, particularly the last, it seems that your mind may be running at a mile per second! The lack of HoN due to the downtime has brought your brain to a raging pace; I suggest a calming activity, such as scrap booking.
    How can someone win if winning means that someone loses?
    WiLL/Shockwaves...have my man-babies
    [My Suggestions]
    Under Construction....

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by EontheWolf View Post
    Rok - 150 is relatively okay for a rank one...
    orly

    Andromeda's Comet: 100

    Valkyrie's Call of the Valkyrie: 75

    Valkyrie's Javelin of Light: 90

    Madman's Barrel Roll: 100

    Blacksmith's Fireball: 75

    Glacius's Tundra Blast: 80

    Hammerstorm's Hammerthrow: 100

    Jereziah's Inner Light: 90

    Pollywog priest's Jolt: 75

    Pyromancer's Phoenix Wave: 100

    Thunderbringer's Blast Lightning: 100

  6. #6
    Do you guys see the downside of the skill? If she doesn't accumulate charges on the nuke, it does MAJOR damage to her. In order to not lose life, she has to have 10 kills in between casts. That is a lot imo.

    Also even if the numbers are off, do you like the synergy of the skills? See how each can work off the other? It adds a lot of player skill elements, instead of just spamming skills.
    Please check out my two hero ideas (and give them a thumbs up or suggestion):
    Cherubim - A Huskar inspired melee agility hero
    Sergent - A builder type intelligence support hero

    Come help build the HoN Unofficial Wiki at
    http://honwiki.net


    <nface>wylker try to be original
    <nface>else u can't counter me
    <nface>because you're pretty lame

  7. #7
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    That's why I said it seemed okay for lvl 1, but even if she DOES take damage, its equal to a certain amount of her Max HP, and if she stacks some regen or health, she can easily just spam the 450 nuke or lvl 2 225 nuke....so...
    This is officially the greatest response to an answer containing the phrase 'human suffering' EVER. Of All Time. Period.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lawl View Post
    With all these responses, particularly the last, it seems that your mind may be running at a mile per second! The lack of HoN due to the downtime has brought your brain to a raging pace; I suggest a calming activity, such as scrap booking.
    How can someone win if winning means that someone loses?
    WiLL/Shockwaves...have my man-babies
    [My Suggestions]
    Under Construction....

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Rokman View Post
    Really? More Legion Agility? Christ, this is getting out of hand...
    Devs asked for agility heroes :P

    All of her abilities have charges? That's annoying
    A lot of the charges are just placeholders, the only one that really needs managed is the second skill.

    I like the ultimate but how long does this channeling last? It's like you can effectively take an enemy out of the battle while all that happens.
    I envision the animation lasting around 3 seconds total

    Overall it feels very Moon Queenish, with bouncing damage and nuke from the skyyyyyyy
    There isn't any bouncing damage, it is a nearly instant debuff (think fatal bonds from warlock). She is a melee hero, and uses her current life level to impact her damage, not very moon-queenish imo.
    Please check out my two hero ideas (and give them a thumbs up or suggestion):
    Cherubim - A Huskar inspired melee agility hero
    Sergent - A builder type intelligence support hero

    Come help build the HoN Unofficial Wiki at
    http://honwiki.net


    <nface>wylker try to be original
    <nface>else u can't counter me
    <nface>because you're pretty lame

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by EontheWolf View Post
    That's why I said it seemed okay for lvl 1, but even if she DOES take damage, its equal to a certain amount of her Max HP, and if she stacks some regen or health, she can easily just spam the 450 nuke or lvl 2 225 nuke....so...

    I can tweak the damage numbers for sure, but think about how long it takes to kill 10 creeps... Even if she only kills 5 between casts, she's taking 50% of her total health in damage to nuke. I can add a CD, but I thought letting her accidentally nuke herself to death would be pretty cool.
    Please check out my two hero ideas (and give them a thumbs up or suggestion):
    Cherubim - A Huskar inspired melee agility hero
    Sergent - A builder type intelligence support hero

    Come help build the HoN Unofficial Wiki at
    http://honwiki.net


    <nface>wylker try to be original
    <nface>else u can't counter me
    <nface>because you're pretty lame

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wylker View Post
    but I thought letting her accidentally nuke herself to death would be pretty cool.
    And if she does kill herself, she does mad splash damage?

    That would be better

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Rokman View Post
    And if she does kill herself, she does mad splash damage?

    That would be better
    Thats how her ulti works :P
    Please check out my two hero ideas (and give them a thumbs up or suggestion):
    Cherubim - A Huskar inspired melee agility hero
    Sergent - A builder type intelligence support hero

    Come help build the HoN Unofficial Wiki at
    http://honwiki.net


    <nface>wylker try to be original
    <nface>else u can't counter me
    <nface>because you're pretty lame

  12. #12
    bump
    Please check out my two hero ideas (and give them a thumbs up or suggestion):
    Cherubim - A Huskar inspired melee agility hero
    Sergent - A builder type intelligence support hero

    Come help build the HoN Unofficial Wiki at
    http://honwiki.net


    <nface>wylker try to be original
    <nface>else u can't counter me
    <nface>because you're pretty lame

  13. #13
    I think this hero might be OP in general with all that self damage. Can't she just always deny herself? Will she deny herself in general?

    I like your first ability. its like Huskar's burning spear except works with MS and AS.

    Your 2nd ability just makes me cringe. It is such a powerful ability that I almost don't know what to say about it. Honestly, I think you should rethink what this ability does as it is like a self deny for kill.

    3rd ability is really good and I like it

    Ult: I don't really like the aspect of either killing yourself or killing your opponent on an ultimate. It is actually pretty cheap in my opinion.

    Anyways, I think you have two really solid abilities and 2 that need work. Overall, I like the concept, but with all this damage to self dealing, you might be better off making this a STR Melee.

  14. #14
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    Only problem I see is that the 3rd skill synergizes too well with the ult. debuff a couple people, channel someone you know will wind up getting you killed, huge damage on everyone. If you already got off the uber nuke than this could be fatal to multiple people. I think the word "physical damage" replace just "damage".

  15. #15
    Ok made some changes to ulti and second skill. Second skill can not be used to self-deny. Instead if you miscalculate and kill yourself, whoever you were targetting gets the kill. Ulti no longer actually does damage when killing, instead it works like decapitate and checks HP values then insta-kills.
    Please check out my two hero ideas (and give them a thumbs up or suggestion):
    Cherubim - A Huskar inspired melee agility hero
    Sergent - A builder type intelligence support hero

    Come help build the HoN Unofficial Wiki at
    http://honwiki.net


    <nface>wylker try to be original
    <nface>else u can't counter me
    <nface>because you're pretty lame

  16. #16
    Added visuals
    Please check out my two hero ideas (and give them a thumbs up or suggestion):
    Cherubim - A Huskar inspired melee agility hero
    Sergent - A builder type intelligence support hero

    Come help build the HoN Unofficial Wiki at
    http://honwiki.net


    <nface>wylker try to be original
    <nface>else u can't counter me
    <nface>because you're pretty lame

  17. #17
    I really like this idea, and there should definitely be an angel inspired hero!

  18. #18
    Bump, big thanks to the 3 people who t-down'd it without posting anything. You guys are true champions.

    Don't forget to drink some drain-o!
    Please check out my two hero ideas (and give them a thumbs up or suggestion):
    Cherubim - A Huskar inspired melee agility hero
    Sergent - A builder type intelligence support hero

    Come help build the HoN Unofficial Wiki at
    http://honwiki.net


    <nface>wylker try to be original
    <nface>else u can't counter me
    <nface>because you're pretty lame

  19. #19
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    ROKMAN RAGING! YAY but seriously i have to agree with him. enaugh agi carries i HATE agi carries. will comment on this one some later

  20. #20
    tweaked damage numbers slightly
    Please check out my two hero ideas (and give them a thumbs up or suggestion):
    Cherubim - A Huskar inspired melee agility hero
    Sergent - A builder type intelligence support hero

    Come help build the HoN Unofficial Wiki at
    http://honwiki.net


    <nface>wylker try to be original
    <nface>else u can't counter me
    <nface>because you're pretty lame

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