How do you counter teams with heroes like Keeper, Tempest, Behemoth, Hag etc. in the mid-late game phase where picking of lone heroes is hard.
How do you go about disrupting their massive teamfight potential?
You can't rely on the whole team farming a Shrunk, Shamans does help, but it won't save you when Keeper and Tempest disables you for 5+ secs while the rest of the team bombards you with nukes.
Are any heroes besides Vindi good at countering these kind of heroes?
Tempest: hold a long range stunner hero back or someone with a port key and disable him the moment he ults(if he has a shrunken you will need a superior stun like succ ult or tundra ult)
Behe/Hag: there isnt much you can do about them, your only hope is to catch them before they port in or to have lots of magic armor / shrunkens.
The only gold I keep,
is on my shelf,
in my emmy's
If you want to stop a tempest: superior stun or physical push works (gauntlet with PK and pharoah with hellfire are probably the two absolute best counters to tempest (maybe hellfire is physical stun?)
To stop a plague/hag/magmus - i find barrier idol is a fantastic way to nullify their ults
Behe with a PK/HB.... not a lot you can really do here. pharoah/aluna deactivating port keys and having enough awareness to destroy them before they ult is about the only counter.
Oh yeah and if they pick a tempest just go ward his creep camps or pick keeper and eye them. At low level people dont know wtf's going on
Watch out for Behemoth, as he is the kind of hero that is either really bad or really good, there isn't really a middle ground for him.
Speaking of Behemoth, he is a really strong crowd controller and is relatively good against Tempest (his elementals duplicate the Behemoth's power)
He is also a good counter-initiator against Keeper, as often, ennemies tend to stack themselves in Keeper ult after it's done to maximise kill power while possible. This specific moment is the best for Behemoth to strike.
AND he is suitable to wear a Barrier Idol after he completed his Portal Key in case no one else can.
Oh, and if it was not ennough, Behemoth is also suitable to buy wards as he is item independant after his Blink =)
Pick an initiator or counter initiator, if your an initiator try and catch characters like bhe off guard, if your a counter initiator like vindi, use your ult. Keep spread out and always keep a spare disable/stun on your team, one of my top played is Magmus, pre portalkey I will wait for the other team to use their stuns/interupts and then cast my ult right in the middle of them while they watch... This doesn't work verse good players unless I really catch them off guard because generally thy know not to waste their **** on useless characters.
Tl:dr; think before you position yourself, initiate or use your crowd control abilities.
Seriously though, is just really too great of a counterpick if it's banning pick. Otherwise, :TabletOfCommand: is really good along with the previously listed items.
Last edited by Zortkillah; 06-08-2011 at 03:04 AM.
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Well, to counter AoE heavy lineups, split up and push. If they have an AoE lineup, clearly you've picked heroes that, although may not be the best in team battles, shine in battles with smaller numbers (e.g. those with spammable single target nukes) and have some/lots of pushing potential.
AoE line ups do far worse in smaller fights (well, relatively). So don't fight on their terms, force them to fight on yours.
Also, ward up, carry tps, barrier idol etc so they don't move from lane to lane picking off your smaller groups. However, this is worse for them, as their ults generally have long cooldowns, so while they can take out one lane, if they use their ults, they generally will have a hard time countering another lane.
Tablet of command does it's job very well against tempest/Kotf.
Hero concepts and quick drafts.
Most of the things have already been said, but :
- If the enemy team is relying on PK's to initiate (or follow their main initiator), get heroes with global ultimates ( rapes PK hands down,,). Didn't really played him much, but I believe is an awesome initiator AND counter-initiator, preventing followup and messing up enemy's positionning.
- A counter-initiator is needed in most other cases: if they have a tempest (which is prolly getting a shrunken) get heroes with superior magic or physical stuns (bubbles ulti first mini-stun is superior magic, Hellfire is not physical if I'm not mistaking).
- AoE line-ups shines in teamfights, and usually rely magic damage. Pick up counter-items (tablet, stormspirit, shrunken heads, nullfire for , barrier idol) and gank the hell out of them early game, while trying to get your carry farmed.
- I found that is very good at countering such line-ups. Get a shrunken on him, and get the main target before a teamfight even starts. In general picking off one or two key heroes before a teamfight will allow you to get the pushes and secure your advantage (but hey, don't get out of position to get annihilated 5v3).
Extremely mobile heroes gives a really hard time to thoose extremely wombo-combo reliant teams because they can be way up front without having to fear dieing because they are so mobile, and they can pick off heroes before a fight happens.
Therefore: are all very good
Special mention he simply f*cks them up all over, makes them throw up in rage.
"In Latin, X stood for [ks]. In some languages, as a result of assorted phonetic changes, handwriting adaptations or simply spelling convention" - Wikipedia
X stood for [ks]
Just realised there is only
80100 people with more mmr than me... im such a nerd : (
and laugh. Stay back, press R, go in, rickroll teamfight with passive E
:BarrierIdol: can help too. At the very least it can nullify a wave of AoE damage giving you and your teamies a chance to react.