I have uploaded 2 replays (yes, it can be done now!) of how this works as well as pics because it is so much easier for people to see what to do.
For ease of description (believe me it is complex enough) I have written this guide for a Legion hero. This all applies to a Hellbourne jungler too; just watch the replay to see how I do it hellbourne style (all timings are the same.) If you are at all puzzled with the guide - watch the replays I uploaded (see bottom of guide).
For tempest (the hero this guide is mainly for), or any other jungle hero, a great way to speed up your farm and slow down the enemy bot lane farm is to double creep pull.
Ok so a normal starting build for tempest and you obviously have to skill the creeps:
1. If you're legion, at x:52, hit the bottom creep camp near the bot lane and run away from the creeps (not into the lane, run back into the forest) so that nothing can see the creep camp from where you pulled them. This will double spawn the creeps. (New creeps will spawn in the camp at x:00). Advanced enemy players will place wards in that bottom central creep camp so that creeps never spawn there. To continue creep pulling you must counter-ward.
2. Then at x:15 hit the neutral creeps and run into the lane to get the legion creeps to attack the neutrals.
The first time you can do this is at 0:52 and 1:15; but be sure that the lane is nicely pushed before you attempt it.
You should only do this when the bot lane is quite pushed because you will have time to kill the neutral creeps (and deny any low-HP legion creeps) before the enemy realises or can reach you. (It will take them longer to realise the legion creep wave is missing the further towards their tower they are; also they will be further from you.)
It helps to use elemental on the neutral creeps to kill them faster, and for easier last hits on them (the legion creeps will be attacking them.) If you can get a few legion creeps killed it is great because it is a full XP and gold deny to the enemy bot laners.
You will have killed 2 camps' worth of creeps nice and fast.
For advanced tempest farmers only, if there is a catman camp or skeleton camp in the spot in the centre of the forest, whilst doing this your elemental creeps could be killing one of those camps on their own from lv1 (requires some nice micro to stop your elementals dying. With the catman camp, even at level 1 you can spawn creeps from the catman champion.) Once they have killed that camp, run them to the right hand camp and try to kill creeps there too.
With tempest, if your elemental creeps are slightly higher level, (skill level 2-4) you can even kill the two creep camps in the left hand portion of the legion forest while doing the double pull (your hero not present, just the creeps). You kill the "noob" camp easily (use tempest to spawn the creeps from the strongest creep in the "noob" camp whilst on your way to double pull), and this should give you 6 elementals. Micro them so none of them die. Then walk the 6 creeps down to the creep camp on the far bottom left and kill the creeps there; again micro required, whilst coordinating a double pull - it is not easy. You cannot kill a vulture camp in this way until your creeps are level 4 and you have VERY decent micro to keep them out of the tornado. Remember you are double creep pulling WHILST doing this.
For a little bit of teamplay and coordination try to get your bot lane allies to push the creeps (just autoattack the enemy creeps or use spells to last hit, preferably AOE e.g. a soulstealer could use his nukes to obliterate a wave) in the lane every fourth wave from the second wave. (You will be pulling every 2 minutes; 1:15, 3:15, 5:15 etc) As in, they push the second wave (spawns at 0:30,) the sixth wave (spawns at 2:30,) the tenth wave (spawns at 4:30) etc. Your creeppulling will counteract their pushing yet make it easier for you; the enemy will take longer to realise what you're doing.
The reason it is better to double creep pull every 2 minutes rather than single every 1 is that the neutrals will kill more legion creeps and deny more XP and gold to the enemy. If you have 2 strong camps (minotaurs, wolves etc) and do not assist with your elemental creeps, they can kill an entire creep wave. This is definitely worth it to full XP and gold deny a whole wave. This is over 200XP and gold to the enemy, early game, just gone. Lost forever. That's if you do it only once. With a bit of skill you can kill the neutrals too.
It is also advantageous in that it happens less often, so the enemy will be less likely to cotton on (that your bot lane teammates are using all their spells on creeps every 4th wave, rather than every other wave, etc.)
I have made a replay of how it all works. I do a basic double creep pull and manage to kill the creeps and the legion wave with a bit of skill. If I was going very advanced I should have run my first set of creeps (and my illusions) from the central camp to the right hand camp earlier. They probably could have killed the creeps there too whilst I was coordinating the double pull.
You will also notice that the timings are not what I say in the guide. That's cause they're pretty flexible - as long as it works it doesn't matter. Don't worry about the illusion rune I use; I understand it might not appear and I only use it to help me farm a bit. (Nothing to do with the double creep pull.) You will also notice the position of the creeps on bot lane when I have finished the pull: the enemy would have realised that I was pulling. That is because the creeps were not far enough pushed (and there were no allies to rape the second enemy creep wave).
For the hellbourne replay, I wanted to demonstrate the flexibility of the timings; so I do not pull the creepwave until 0:20 but this takes a bit of practice. Also note that at level 1 the creeps are pretty bad at killing catmen; but you get the idea. At level 4 they could own that camp without you there. As you can see though, it all still works!
Here are the replay files:
HOW TO WATCH THE REPLAY:
Put the replay files in the same folder as your HoN executable. Go into a practice game, open the console (Ctrl-F8) and type:
startreplay tempestjunglefarm1 (for legion)
startreplay tempesthellbourne (for hellbourne)
All in all it takes a bit of practice guys, but well worth it. Just focus on the pulling first few times you do it, then try to use your elementals to farm the other camps at the same time after you know what you're doing.
Last edited by Bananana; 09-20-2009 at 01:00 PM.
This guide is pretty informative, but including pictures and applying a bit of formatting to the text would really help with readability (which I think is an important part of guides).
I drafted this up in about half an hour, give me a break! Lol ok I'll improve it soon. Pics and fancy formatting en route.
A replay? It's awesome, I'll be sure to follow this guide when ever I random tempest the next time!
The replay is great. Thanks for providing it. I tried it out myself and it's a lot of micro but I'm sure it pays off if you get good at it.
I really wish you didnt use the illusion rune, you can never rely on it to be an illusion rune AND for it to appear in the bottom side AND to not expect enemies to also be checking out for it (espeacially if you are jungling you would want to avoid early damage).
Epic, Truly epic. I would have your child, i would literally take your seed and plant you a child on this earth- if only I was a women. Yeh but seriosly, great idea, great method, tempest elite you are young padawan.
Double pulling in HoN is pretty simple since the creeps chase you for so long. Generally if you're playing Legion you can pull the big middle spawn at :50 and walk right and get a double pull out of the medium spawn as well.
Last edited by Bananana; 09-20-2009 at 12:28 PM.
Oh damn, you're talking about stacking (pulling for respawn) and then pulling a double camp (into the wave)
Quite nice as it destroys more creeps of your wave.
But why don't you stack 3 camps then? It destroys 2-3 of your creepwaves, completely denying the xp. Problem is you don't get much xp either.
edit: i use my double pull method as i don't have time to stack.
Nice post and thanks, good to know the specific times shown in your post.
PS. where did you get your replays from?
[17:23] <@Warchamp7> You can't spell 'Sucker sucks' without "Sucker sucks"
Is it faster to wait at the start and double stack the creep camp you're pulling to the lane?