Elmy's Lucky Die - Item Suggestion

[Elmy]

Elmy's Lucky Die

Item Properties/Attributes:

Passive +3 to All Stats at Level 1. Upgradable to Level 3.

Activated Effects:

Level 1:

"Roll The Dice!" Mana Cost: 50. CD 30 sec.

Target Self or ally. Has a chance to do one of three things:

- Restores 90 HP.
- Restores 120 Mana.
- Your next attack does +15 extra damage.


Target Enemy Hero. Has a chance to do one of three things:

- Slows the hero by 15% for 2 seconds.
- Removes 60 Mana.
- Heroes next attack does -15 damage.

The targeted hero gains a debuff that makes him immune to any further "Roll The Dice!" attacks for the next 30 seconds.

Level 2:

+3 to all stats.

"Roll The Dice!" (Level 2) Mana Cost: 60. CD 25 sec.

Target Self or ally. Has a chance to do one of three things:

- Restores 105 HP.
- Restores 130 Mana.
- Your next attack does +20 extra damage.


Target Enemy Hero. Has a chance to do one of three things:

- Slows the hero by 25% for 2 seconds.
- Removes 70 Mana.
- Heroes next attack does -20 damage.

The targeted hero gains a debuff that makes him immune to any further "Roll The Dice!" attacks for the next 25 seconds.


Level 3:

+4 to all stats.

"Roll The Dice!" (Level 3) Mana Cost: 70. CD 20 sec.

Target Self or ally. Has a chance to do one of three things:

- Restores 120 HP.
- Restores 140 Mana.
- Your next attack does +25 damage.


Target Enemy Hero. Has a chance to do one of three things:

- Slows the hero by 35% for 2 seconds.
- Removes 80 Mana.
- Heroes next attack does -25 damage.

The targeted hero gains a debuff that makes him immune to any further "Roll The Dice!" attacks for the next 20 seconds.


Total Cost:
(Level 1): 509 Gold
(Level 2): 674 Gold
(Level 3): 839 Gold


Ingredients:

Minor Totem x3: 159 gold
Pretender's Crown: 185 gold
Elmy's Lucky Die Recipe: 165 gold


Goal:

Due to the nature of the items required for the recipe, this would evidently be an early-game item. Depending on how tweaked the numbers are, it could be quite useful. Most people usually buy several branches (sorry I forget the equivalent) and one or two circlets for the extra damage, along with some tangoes / runes. This allows you to make use of those items that usually get discarded / sold later. It combines them into Elmy's Lucky Die.

The effects themselves are not game-breaking, but they do help your laning ability. For starters, there is the innate +5 to all stats (increased upon leveling the item to +6 and +7.) Then there is the chance to recover HP, some mana, or to deal more damage on the next hit. If you are struggling, you will be more likely to use it on yourself. If you are having an easy time, you can feel comfortable in using it offensively. The mana cost is such that it can't be abused early game, with a relatively long cooldown. The item eventually outlasts it's usefulness, though it can be lucky / convenient at times.


CHANGE LOG:

- Minor increases in HP & Mana gain from Allied / Self use. Minor increase in Mana burned from enemy use.
- Reduced the base stat increase at level 1 to +3 (Reduced from 5). Removed the level 2 stat upgrade when upgrading the item. (Comparing prices, agreed that this item made basic stat items such as Fortified Bracers and Soulscream Ring almost obsolete.) The total cost of the recipe is significantly more expensive than the aforementioned items, with a slight stat disadvantage, which the activated skill compensates. Level 3 now adds +4 to all stats.

- Improved the slow effect % as a negative roll. (Previously 5%/7.5%/10%, now 15%/25%/35%.) Had previously feared this being abused by repeated casts, which was solved by the "Roll The Dice!" debuff.
- Now castable on allies to have potential as a support item.
- "Roll The Dice!" debuff now no longer applies if used on an allied hero / self.
- Increased the total amount of mana removed as a negative roll to match the mana cost of activating the item. (Previously 40/45/50, now 50/60/70.)
- Changed the recipe cost and ingredients. (Previously: Minor Totem x1; 53g. Pretender's Crown x2; 370g. Recipe; 85g. In agreeance that recipe was too cheap, modified to: Minor Totem x3; 159g. Pretender's Crown x1; 185g. Recipe; 165g.
- Total cost reduced from 512g to 509g.
- Increased HP gained from positive roll for level 3 by 5 HP to match the increments of +15 HP on each upgrade.

[[LoCG]Electrician]

+1 to all stats for only 85 gold seems kinda cheap, comparing it to the +2 to all stats for 185 gold

seems like a neat idea though, i like it

[Elmy]

+1 to all stats for only 85 gold seems kinda cheap, comparing it to the +2 to all stats for 185 gold

seems like a neat idea though, i like it

I wanted to keep the recipe price cheap enough for a tango. It was originally higher and I put more branches instead of 2 circlets, but I didn't want the recipe to cast TOO much for upgrades. This might not be enough though! I would consider making it not add any additional bonuses though, or maybe at level 3 it would bump up to +6 stats and skip the level 2 stat upgrade. It can definitely be tweaked, though.

And thanks!

[[Toho]Batman]

I like that, more than anything, it seems balanced. It's something that, if added, would not become an 'omega power item' or anything of the like, but instead be entirely supplemental like most of the 'trinket' items are. Very, very, very good idea.

Not to mention, the random chance makes it much more enticing and much more fun.

You could, of course, always add a random NEGATIVE effect to those on the self, and a POSITIVE for the enemies, adding to a bit of the chance aspect.

[Thursday1]

Heh. I would hit it.

Erm.. I like it. Would probably get it most games, tbh.

[[HSL]SMACKD0WN]

effects could be reworked but the main concept is interesting

[Thursday1]

Heh. I would hit it.

Twice.

I would probably never use that on an enemy hero, because the slow is so weak.. When I could recover some mana spent nuking, hp, or gain a +damage on my next harass.

[fulgorestyle]

Twice.

I would probably never use that on an enemy hero, because the slow is so weak.. When I could recover some mana spent nuking, hp, or gain a +damage on my next harass.

yea, i like this concept alot.. but like Thursday said, the offensive use isn't worth it

[SyKot]

Meh. I just don't like luck based stuff too much. Blacksmith still makes me rage.

[Elmy]

Thanks for the feedback all! I'm glad you like it.

Batman: That's what I was aiming at with the trinkets. Sort of a replacement, but not 100% reliable so people might still prefer to stick to the good old tangos / clarity potions. Random chance does make it more fun too =) I thought about making a negative effect happen for casting on self, or positive on enemy, and actually originally had thought it out that way, but I did want it to still be viable. The 3 'positives' all aim towards helping lane control. HP, allows you to stay longer. Mana, helps you continue using the die or whatever your skills are to harass. Temp +dmg, helps last hitting or harassing.

Thursday: Actually, now that re-think it, the slow could be made better. Originally, I didn't want people to be able to get this item and everyone spams it on the enemy. But that's why I came up with the debuff part that makes it unusable again on the same target. Since I added that, I can make the slow better. (which I've just edited.) Also, personally, I wouldn't like to use it on myself if I was say near full mana and hp or near. Then I would use it on the enemy, just because. Slow would allow a couple hits of harass, minus mana reduces their lane control, and the damage reduce messes up their next last hit.

[Thursday1]

Heh, yeah, I know a few people who get pisT at the RNG as well.

"DAMN CRITS!" "I never multicast when I play Blacksmith/OM!"

I can see it now..

"If that had healed me instead of given me mana, I would have lived!"

Just don't rely on it and you should be fine. Use it as a supplement.

[Alhanalem]

more clicky items is good

but most of the effects are kinda lame except the slow enemy.

[Elmy]

more clicky items is good

but most of the effects are kinda lame except the slow enemy.

It's too cheap to make it too good for the negative effects =P Look at most of the items which have negative effects, most are very expensive.


A few edits:

- Enemy slow debuff now slows by significantly more.

- Castable on allies. (Makes it more of a support item and a possible save your ally too.)

- Allies do not get a debuff when used by a friendly target.

[Sko1]

how will you know which one of the 3 options is selected ?
p.s. Randomness is a good idea

[SyKot]

Heh, yeah, I know a few people who get pisT at the RNG as well.

"DAMN CRITS!" "I never multicast when I play Blacksmith/OM!"

I can see it now..

"If that had healed me instead of given me mana, I would have lived!"

Just don't rely on it and you should be fine. Use it as a supplement.

What happens when the enemy has it. "If that had given mana instead of healing, I would have killed him!", still out of your control.

[[dngo]Zifle]

Wow, i simply love this item! imo the recipe could be a bit more expensive, but thats about it (and i believe a "Minor totem" is 53g ;P). Anyways, i love playing heroes having some random stuff (Chaos Knight in DotA to mention one), and i would definitely get this one pretty much every single game, especially if I'm support!
Hope it will get implemented, keep it up!

[Elmy]

Thanks for all the support. I hope the Devs like it as much as you guys. I've added a CHANGE LOG at the end of the original post so people can see the tweaks.

@ Zifle, I do agree that the recipe price is too cheap, but for upgrades I didn't want to make it too expensive. I believe I've found a way around this though - check the log!

@ Sko, each buff / debuff could have a unique animation. For example, for the re-gaining mana bit, it could show the graphic of a clarity potion but only for 1-2 seconds to show what you got. Nothing major, but each one would have a small indication of what happened. I think that'd mostly be left to S2, though!

[[dngo]Zifle]

Wow, love the changes, price for the recipe seems allot more reasonable now, considering its upgradeable, and its basically a bit easier to put together.

So i was just thinking, this is really a minor suggestion but you'll get it anyway:
The debuff put on enemies should, imo, extend the time, eg:
Player 1 casts dice lvl 1 on enemy 1, and gets the slow effect. 15% slow for 2 secs.
Within the 2 secs Player 2 casts lvl 3 dice on enemy 1, gets slow. Its now 35% slow for 2 full secs.
Player 3 casts another dice, lvl 2, on enemy 1, gets slow, and then resets the 2 sec for the 35% slow.

So a lower level dice, proccing slow on a target already having the slow, would extend the former debuff, instead of replacing it, resolving in less slow.

I hope i didn't confuse anyone, it's just my $.92
Feel free to flame if it just makes dice omfgwtfbbqopnerfplx.

[Elmy]

Wow, love the changes, price for the recipe seems allot more reasonable now, considering its upgradeable, and its basically a bit easier to put together.

So i was just thinking, this is really a minor suggestion but you'll get it anyway:
The debuff put on enemies should, imo, extend the time, eg:
Player 1 casts dice lvl 1 on enemy 1, and gets the slow effect. 15% slow for 2 secs.
Within the 2 secs Player 2 casts lvl 3 dice on enemy 1, gets slow. Its now 35% slow for 2 full secs.
Player 3 casts another dice, lvl 2, on enemy 1, gets slow, and then resets the 2 sec for the 35% slow.

So a lower level dice, proccing slow on a target already having the slow, would extend the former debuff, instead of replacing it, resolving in less slow.

I hope i didn't confuse anyone, it's just my $.92
Feel free to flame if it just makes dice omfgwtfbbqopnerfplx.

Lol, I see what you mean but I was pretty much trying to avoid that scenario by adding the "Roll The Dice!" debuff after it is used on an enemy hero. In my opinion, the item is too cheap for it to be amazing when used as an offensive cast. Plus, if you get level 1, I really doubt anyone would not upgrade it for how cheap it is. It'd be very rare to run in a scenario like that.

[CavemanDiary]

Meh. I just don't like luck based stuff too much. Blacksmith still makes me rage.

This is different because regardless of what you roll, it has a positive outcome.

Unlike chancebased heroes who rely on slim chance to make/break a game, this is still a useful item. I would however, like to see it limited to two different abilities - restore mana OR health, or deal damage/slow enemy.