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Good Concept
Bad Concept
Hope Eater
New Name (Old one was Hopeless Echo)
Image from Blizzard Entertainement.
*** Please vote on Concept not Numbers, Thank you.
Hero Model - A blackish/blueish big phantom who doesn't move a bit when standing still. He's expressionless like if he had no purpose (think of Dr.Manathan in The Watchmens). A big one handed axe in his left hand and a big shield on his right arm. When he move, his arms are behind him like if he didn't have any will to carry his weapons and armor, he also slide over the ground like Andromeda, I like to think of him like her counter-part.
Voices - "Why..." "Any purpose?..." "Does it matter?" "It'll happen..." "Won't change things..." "Whois this?" "Why so hasty..." "He's lost..."
Affiliation - Hellbourne
Attributes -
Speed: 300
Strenght: High
Agility: Medium
Intelligence: Low
Hero Skills
All the rage gathered from the numerous battles he fought needs a lot of concentration to be held deep inside the Hope Eater's mind. When attacked, his concentration is lost and he's unable to keep the rage inside eventualy resulting in bursts of Echo.
Description: When attacked, the Hope Eater gather "Charges" and can only handle a maximum. When this maximum is reached, he release a wave of rage towards the last attacker. If the damage received was from an AoE or had no sources, he release multiple lesser waves in a circle around himself.
Level 1 - 10 Charges max, waves deal 40 damage.
Level 2 - 9 Charges max, waves deal 50 damage.
Level 3 - 8 Charges max, waves deal 60 damage.
Level 4 - 7 Charges max, waves deal 70 damage.
Travel range of the Waves - 600
The Hope Eater is haunted by the past battles and can only fall into a deep state of depression when he's not harmed. The pain is so strong that it reflect on enemy heroes reducing their damage and armor depending on his state.
Description: Each X second his aura increase to a maximum of charges which increase the effectivity of his aura. When he's attacked by a creep or an enemy controled unit, he lose 1 charge.
Level 1 - -0.25 armor per charge, -0.5% damage per charge, 6 charges, 4 sec to gain a charge.
Level 2 - -0.5 armor per charge, -1% damage per charge, 8 charges, 3 sec to gain a charge.
Level 3 - -0.75 armor per charge, -1.5% damage per charge, 10 charges, 2 sec to gain a charge.
Level 4 - -1 armor per charge, -2% damage per charge, 12 charges, 1 sec to gain a charge.
Range - 800 all levels.
Upon activation, his echoes blast out of his body damaging nearby units but bouncing back to the to the Hope Eater dealing minor damage to himself. Damage of the outer wave is based on his strenght while the damage of the bounce back is fixed. Units hit by the echoes are briefly disoriented slowing their movement speed. The more bounces, the more the shock is hard thus slowing them down even more.
Description: This is like a normal Shockwave (think of Behemoth) spell but every echoes bounce back to the Hope Eater damaging him (as AoE damage with no source) and slowing units hit by a % multiplied by the number of units hit by the spell.
Level 1 - 175 Range, 0.75x his Strenght in damage and echoes deal 5 bounce back damage and slow 1% per unit hit.
Level 2 - 225 Range, 1x his Strenght in damage and echoes deal 10 bounce back damage and slow for 2% per unit hit.
Level 3 - 275 range, 1.25x his Strenght in damage and echoes deal 15 bounce back damage and slow for 3% per unit hit.
Level 4 - 325 range, 1.5x his Strenght in damage and echoes deal 20 bounce back damage and slow for 4% per unit hit.
ULTIMATE Wandering Echoes
Upon activation, the Hope Eater summon back the echoes of his past. They come back to haunt his enemies on battle. Unfortunatly, each hit dealt by his minions also hurts the Hope Eater.
Description: When activated, spawn echoes on each enemy heroes in a certain range and they start attacking it (think of Arachna's ult). Each hit damage the Hope Eater (triggering his first skill).
Level 1 - 900 Range, 40 Damage per hit, last 6 seconds.
Level 2 - 900 Range, 70 Damage per hit, last 7 seconds.
Level 3 - 900 Range, 90 Damage per hit, last 8 seconds.
Damage to the Hope Eater - 10/15/20
Item Build
Enhanced Marchers, you'll need those for the extra armor and the quick boost of speed it gives. You're a tank afterall, you don't need attack speed.
The Helm of the Black Legion's going to be your favorite item early game for the bonus HP, the damage block and the HP regeneration.
Shaman's Headdress, you won't live without it, period. It's your key to survive and also gives you the nice HP Reg you need early game.
Activate it just before casting Blasting Echoes and you'll be able to handle that damage return.
The extra armor and the HP this item gives is a good thing for you because you'll basicly be receiving a lot of damage. This is an alternative to Insanitarius.
There's no point in explaining why.
The armor reduction aura this item give will be insane once stacked with yours and the attack speed is profitable for your teamates.
Synergies
Soulstealer's aura stacks with the Hope Eater's Haunting Echoes effect and thus providing extreme armor reduction. Also Soulstealer is a "squishy" hero and the enemies will probably focus the Hope Eater early in the fights to remove the aura allowing Soulstealer to deal major damage without being targeted.
Again, his armor reducing ultimate allows other carry or DPS in the team to deal huge amount of damage without being focused.
Jereziah's ability to remove incoming magic damage will help HE (Hope Eater) be unnukable thus obligating enemies to auto attack him to remove his aura and trigger his first skill.
And other ranged auto attack will have enough time and increased damage while HE is being focused, and if he's not then the enemies will lose damage and armor increasing the effectiveness of ranged DPS.
Counters
Fact - He's a bad 1v1 hero because all his skills scale depending on how many units are around.
Pyro has the ability to quickly down a target without much hits using his spells. The aura doesn't really affect him early/mid game as he's more of a nuker at this part.
Zephyr's ability to do damage while not attacking is exterminating HE's core philosophy, get attacked to deal damage.
Cursed ground is again a very good spell agaisnt HE because he loses health very quickly when fighting.
Of course Pollywog's ult is going to trigger his first spell a lot, but his wards are gadgets and doesn't receive any damage from the burst of echoes his first spell could deal and the series of hit his wards can shoot will remove pretty quickly his 2nd skill (Haunted Echoes).
Last edited by CrashLemon; 09-08-2009 at 03:07 PM. Reason: Hope Eater
Reworked a bit on it.
So skill #1 states that being hit is a good thing, while skill #2 states that being hit is a very bad thing? What is this guy supposed to be doing? I mean, in combat his #2 skill is totally useless? Unless he just stays in the back not getting hit?
Well you think of this guy as a tank, but skill #2 is hardly a tanking-skill. Tanking renders skill #2 useless.
The rest is fine though, but he seems kinda boring. No stuns or disables. Reminds me very much of Axe.
Well skill 2 is very good when he's not being hit right? But the only way to remove the aura is to attack the tank thus triggering spell 1.
Also, I added synergies and counters.
Edit: Added a slow on his 3rd spell.
Last edited by CrashLemon; 09-05-2009 at 06:22 PM.
a sound based melee ghost, ok ill listen(lol pun)
1st: ok so being damage makes him reliese charges of damage to enemys. this could work a hole lot better:
Every time he takes damage from physical hits he echos some of the damage to things around him. it could be passive or activateable and more powerfull.
2nd: COMPLETELY contradicts your idea for his first power. i would either change it or first power. as a power it is good but the contradiction kills it.
3rd: interesting but what do you think of this:
at a cost of a lot of mana he sends out a wave of sound. the sound can bounce of units around him to return some of that mana makeing the spell cost less the more you hit. Also for every unit hit the recharge is lowered .5 sec. it would make it a good nuke all the time but the more units he hits the better it is.
ulti: there is a problem in needing a allies hero to die to activate. better idea: a passive power that summons a echo of a allied or enemy hero that has died around you. they only deal 50% damage and take 200% and last a short time. enemy heroes will just auto attack without controll. allied heroes will be controlled by the player who died(if allie/enemy respawns the echo ends). The allies would only be able to auto attack .it would give allies a chance for some revenge damage and you could even make yourself come back for a short time!!
overall i realy only like the theme, the current power do more than not synergise, the anti synergise!! keep working he could be great.
Last edited by Rentaromon; 09-05-2009 at 07:46 PM.
There seems to be a confusion here with the spells, maybe I probably didn't explained them very well.
I'll explain how the synergy of his spells work.
1. Spell 1 release waves (like Pyro's phenix or Hag's ult) when the charges hit the limit and then reset to no charges and so on.
2. Spell 2 is a VERY good aura that can only be disabled by hitting the Hope Eater, obligating your enemies to attack the Hope Eater if they want their damage and armor back. By attacking the HE they unfortunatly (for them) increase charges on his first skill.
3. Spell 3 is mostly a nuke that'll trigger his first skill too as every bounce count as a damage spell so let's say there's 14 units in range (friendly or enemy and including creeps) and you cast the spell, there'll be 14 bounce backs giving him 14 charges for his first skill triggering this one 2 times (loads of damage).
4. 4th skill, the ultimate, will spawn spirits on the enemy heroes like Arachna can spawn a broodling on an enemy hero but here it spawn 1 on every enemy hero around him (it is activated and doesn't require an ally to die, it's just a description of the spell). Each time the spirits attack a target, it also damage the Hope Eater triggering his first skill again.
As you can see, if there's a lot of enemies around you can do loads of damage if you're being focused. If you're not being focused, you disable a lot of the other team's capabilities.
He's very squishy in 1v1 situation around rivers and in the jungle.
I'm sorry if the spells are badly explained but my english isn't perfect.
Edit - Added voices, for the kicks of it :P
Last edited by CrashLemon; 09-05-2009 at 08:51 PM.
err i dont like they way he sounds now(pun again). what do you think of my change ideas?Originally Posted by CrashLemon
There seems to be a confusion here with the spells, maybe I probably didn't explained them very well.
I'll explain how the synergy of his spells work.
1. Spell 1 release waves (like Pyro's phenix or Hag's ult) when the charges hit the limit and then reset to no charges and so on.
2. Spell 2 is a VERY good aura that can only be disabled by hitting the Hope Eater, obligating your enemies to attack the Hope Eater if they want their damage and armor back. By attacking the HE they unfortunatly (for them) increase charges on his first skill.
3. Spell 3 is mostly a nuke that'll trigger his first skill too as every bounce count as a damage spell so let's say there's 14 units in range (friendly or enemy and including creeps) and you cast the spell, there'll be 14 bounce backs giving him 14 charges for his first skill triggering this one 2 times (loads of damage).
4. 4th skill, the ultimate, will spawn spirits on the enemy heroes like Arachna can spawn a broodling on an enemy hero but here it spawn 1 on every enemy hero around him (it is activated and doesn't require an ally to die, it's just a description of the spell). Each time the spirits attack a target, it also damage the Hope Eater triggering his first skill again.
As you can see, if there's a lot of enemies around you can do loads of damage if you're being focused. If you're not being focused, you disable a lot of the other team's capabilities.
He's very squishy in 1v1 situation around rivers and in the jungle.
I'm sorry if the spells are badly explained but my english isn't perfect.
Edit - Added voices, for the kicks of it :P
Well I like the idea you gave for the ult but then he'll only have 1 active spell and 3 passives. I'll try to get your idea to work as an active.
good point, he can have 2 passives at least becouse my idea for 3rd would possibly cost a lot of mana.
tell me what you come up with.
Clarified some spells and added item build, still reworking on some spells. Hope you guys like him!
Interesting, I like the two passives. they may seem counter productive to some, but it builds charges when not in combat, so the first hit can be a release when he enters, not to mention all its benefits when out of combat.
The Third ability is a nice way of getting every opponent with the charges, and synergizes with passive 2 for the opening of a fight, if he opens with this he'll deal the AoE version of pass 1 and slow opponents right away.
The Ult works very similar to the third ability, on a more drastic level. This hero has my vote for yes, although Im sure number crunches and such may happen.
The key to this hero... Movespeed. So you can battle when they run away.
Thanks for the feedback, I really like how you understood the concept behind this char.
i salute you just for giving credit for the image. I like this character's original functionality, gives us something more to consider then blow crap up. but the ult is a little to overpowered at this point, the copies last to long and i think you might just want to keep all ranks to a max range of 900
Polite and usefull, thanks for your comment I'll change the ult's time to 6/7/8 and the range to 900 as it's 300+ than ranged heroes so it's fine.
What if he used his ulti and then used lothar's would it still cause the wave damage and allow him to be invis at the same time? OP!
Omfg, nice thing you found there, well of course it would proc his passive. Didn't even think of it myself.
i see you have made no change to this guy in quite a wile.
There's nothing to correct so far, people that vote bad doesn't give any reasons so I don't have nothing to change until I know why most people don't like the concept.
i actually havent voted either way yet, i dont like him that much as he is and i have said why, but i feel he has great potential. so i wait...
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