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I see the same 6 heroes banned every matchmaking that i do: chronos, zephyr, tempest, jerry, hellbringer, and plague.
If you have the first ban, that means that you get the first pick, so try and keep one of those "OP" heroes unbanned for your team to get. I see a lot of people that don't even bother with this. Its always nice to have a tempest on your team.
How do you do this? Ban 2 of the traditional bans, but ban someone else for your third one. The other team's banner will have to choose between the one that you didnt ban and the one that he was suppose to ban anyways, therefore you get the one that was left over.
Banner 1: jerry
Banner 2: hellbringer
Banner 1: plague
Banner 2: chronos
tempest/zephyr still up
Banner 1: blood hunter? random
Banner 2: zephyr
tempest still up
If opponent is smart they will just ban something random as well. Meaning they will also get a strong pick ^_O
Honestly. Im not trying to bust your balls or anything.
But tempest isn't as great as people make him out to be. his ult is EXTREMELY easy to counter. and he's very easy to gank if he's jungling.
Nevertheless, OP is making a valid point.
Tempest is a strong hero with the right teammates, still, even when easily countered. By no means underpowered, and can definitely be a gamechanger - especially when skilled.
But this is not a tempest discussion. It's a banning discussion.
While I disagree with the bans themselves, this doesnt matter - he's trying to make a point. And the point is good.
This is the very basics of banning - which beginners can make use of. Try to do this - if the other banner is a beginner aswell he will probably not know enough to do as G4M3 suggested.
Well, It's the very basics, but It's a start to make people realize that banning is very strategic.
I've always felt this too. His ult can be 'clutch' in winning a game you aren't doing so well, but personally i just find a niceOriginally Posted by Mercfh
who hangs back a little fixes most of my tempest problems.
@ O.P I see the same thing game after game, people just ban who they think is powerful with no regards towards building a team. Most of my favourite MatchMaking games involve banning the "anti-push" and then picking up the pushers/aoe that are left.
Banning Chronos is wasting a ban.
banning Tempest, Chronos or Zephyr are wasted, none of them are the powerhouses they once were.
are the bans you should be looking for, Corrupted because he is god tier when mid, swiftblade because he is such a versatile carry, polly and slither to prevent the team from pushing hard.
Even :jera: is not banned that often, he is one dimensional and easy to counter with
or :NullfireBlade:,
and
are nearly always chosen over him.
Last edited by Pyrate; 04-19-2010 at 10:04 PM.
Its Hammertime
Yeah, you get your Tempest FP, and oppose Swiftblade Slither - they just won the Game. Bad luck.
E: It's about as "Pro Tip" as "Pro Tip: Buy Regen Items to lane" is. Actually, less. Far less. Nvm.
I remember something like MSI losing swiftblade+plague lane to pesti+dsham lane...
G4M3 has the best comment yetThough if he's smart he won't just ban random heroes, he'll ban the typical I-solo-carry-the-game corrupted disciple or someone like him.
Keep in mind that so-called 'God Tier' or Powerhouse heroes will vary depending on the skill level of the players.
The point of the OP is show that if you have a First Ban, you can ban in such a way to improve your chances of getting a 'Powerhouse' hero.
Ban defiler or accursed instead of the random.
Tempest is an average support at best. Most competitive games neither ban him or pick him, these days.
Most of the time he is dead weight on a team, unless you have the right line up for him.
With the prevalence of Tempest counters, including a cheap available item, Tempest's role is less "blink and win" and more roaming jungle ganker who, in late game, uses his ultimate after some CC has already been spent, ideally catching the remaining CCers and turning a team battle around.
To do the above job properly takes skill, and when you see a good Tempest in a vod you're actually impressed. People underrate him because he's no longer firstpick/ban material, but he's just balanced.
oh also his elementals eat towers if allowed to
Last edited by light_rain; 04-19-2010 at 10:58 PM.
I don't think I've ever seen a Honcast where Slither wasn't banned- who I'd love to see played at a competitive level. Swiftblade, Pollywog, Defiler, Accursed and Hellbringer seem to get the ban the vast majority of the time.
Played a few pubs and was surprised to see Chronos and Tempest always getting the insta ban. I guess they're just more dangerous in Noob play that the standard high level push bans?
I've seen a slither/swiftblade lane on HoNCast. The Swiftblade approximately a bajillion kills and carried his team to victory.
Its often better to leave hereos like tempest and jera unbanned when the enemy team has firstpick and use the bans on other hereos depending on your ideas of a lineup as long as the counters are still in.
Let the other team pick tempest when vindi is on the board, just to get your team better picks that are not that easy to counter.
Those six are frequently banned, but I've really only played against one Chronos that really crushed us. Slither and Swiftblade are also common bans, sometimes Soul Stealer as well. I personally have seen so little of Hellbringer because of bans or people not playing him, but in the game i HAVE seen him in, I don't even know what the big deal is.
Quite simply, you haven't seen a strong Hellbringer.
He shuts down his lane, then stays strong in the midgame and turns fights with his aoe magic armour debuff (-6 means magic damage is slightly better than pure damage against heroes with no additional magic armour) and his huuuuuge aoe, long cast range, superior magic 1 second stun.
Hellbringer is an ideal holder of Puzzlebox, the best item in the game, and a Hellbringer who combos Life Void with Barbed Armour has effectively 32% damage reduction against anyone with the Void on them, while also dealing 80% of damage dealt to him. His stats and attack range are good. He has very few weaknesses outside of purge effects, especially Nullfire Blade which one-shots his ultimate, but usually his 'job' of helping his team win the early game is over with by the time that item becomes a problem for him.
He's a strong first pick because he basically never hurts your lanes, as any lane he is in is a strong lane, and his survivability in large teamfights means he's not likely to be a liability to the team.
Frankly, if my pubbie captain is good enough to make these bans, I consider myself fortunate.
Credit to Devious`, with thanks to AvunaOs for my last signature
How to get rolled in the lane by Slither/Swift and still winMatch 40699431
(Granted the guys playing Slither/Swift were 1750 EM pubstars)
Edit: Lesson here is that it's OK to give up slither/swift when your opponents are terrible. Sometimes you need to ban according to who the best player on the other team is, not just blindly autoban.
Last edited by TreeHorse; 04-21-2010 at 12:54 PM.
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