Gloves of the Wise (Basic item)

[JONI]

Gloves of the Wise
http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/1585/itemglovesofhaste.jpg
Passive Bonuses
+20 cast speed (Does not stack with Gloves of the Wise or Boots of the Wise)

Value: 600

Why?
As this game hasn't got yet any cast speed buffing items besides Behemoth's Heart, Gloves of the Wise could work as the basic component of future recipes and items.


Look at the concept rather than the numbers!

Recipe examples including Gloves of the Wise:

Boots of the Wise (Idea from Sapheron)

Requires:

http://i50.tinypic.com/28uu5bq_th.png+http://i45.tinypic.com/b3mxq9_th.png+http://i49.tinypic.com/fngxf6_th.png=http://i48.tinypic.com/2czycnl_th.png
Total Cost: 1640g
Passive Bonuses
20 Cast Speed
6 Intelligence
6 Agility
6 Strength
70 Movement Speed
Activation
Silences target enemy for 2 seconds

Wisdom
Gives the ability to call the totem of Wisdom to increase or decrease the knowledge of nearby allies and enemies.

Requires:

http://i45.tinypic.com/b3mxq9_th.png+http://i45.tinypic.com/b3mxq9_th.png+http://i49.tinypic.com/fngxf6_th.png+http://i46.tinypic.com/2cerigl.jpg=http://i50.tinypic.com/10fnqlw.jpg

Total Cost: 2680g
Passive Bonuses
20 Cast Speed
300 Mana
10 Intelligence
7 Agility
7 Strength

Activation
Summon Wisdom
Mana Cost: 110
Cooldown: 60 Seconds
Can't be placed near trees
Range: 300
Ground
Duration: 30 seconds
Destroyed after 5 hits
Applies Aura of Knowledge to nearby allies and enemies
Radius: 800
Allies:
20 Cast Speed
+12% Magic Damage
Enemies:
-15 Cast Speed
-8% Magic Damage

Have any ideas according to Gloves of the Wise? Feel free to post them here!

Check also Robes of Combat Sorcery by OJPhoenix (http://forums.heroesofnewerth.com/showthread.php?t=78164)

[PoopyDesires]

Literally fits perfectly with the item I just made.

T-Up since its honestly a neccesary item.

[A`nub`is]

:wret:&:blac: say this is approved.

[Verisi]

You know it.

[OhBob]

Sweet. You should start making a recipe with it, to make things better.

[Blyth]

Dude u totally copied my idea O.O

[PoopyDesires]

Yes because your item is the only item in the forums with cast speed.

Not to mention this is a basic item, it could easily fit in with his.

Btw I made an item recently. Its a glove and it gave +20 cast speed. TOTALLY COPIED YOU YEAH?

[Blyth]

Y maybe ;* But you should state that it does not stack with other gloves of the wise, u shouldn't be able to stack so much castspeed :p

[PoopyDesires]

6 gloves of the swift is 90 aspeed. Thats almost 2 warpclefts for only 3k gold.

[Blyth]

Castspeed =/= Attackspeed

[PoopyDesires]

Castspeed =/= Attackspeed

You're missing the point.

Filling up your entire inventory with cast speed items is probably going to bite you in the ass, and getting your dragonfire off .4 seconds faster is probably not going to be worth it.

[Sapheron]

T-UP. Would be even cooler if it could plug into +castspeed steamboots. :D

[serrath]

Very nice. Just what we needed.

[JONI]

I didn't copy this item from anyone, and it's just a basic component with nothing more and I hope you guys continue on making more recipes with cast speed because I think this game lacks them :)

[OJPhoenix]

:O Sapheron is right! We need cast speed boots! haha

I love this item idea, I'm totally for it! +1

[JONI]

Any comments about having something like those boots?

[OJPhoenix]

haha those boots look awesome! Cept I have 1 problem, Int heroes are the most ability/spell dependant and thus benefit the most from Cast speed, whilst yes they benefit from having more mana and health, and I totally approve of giving Major Totem more love, I can't help but feel it should come with some mana regen, from a Scarab!

[JONI]

Yeah it does sound logical, but I tried to keep the cost somewhat low. Feel free to show your own ideas :)

[OJPhoenix]

Fair enough, I like yours as it is as well.
I've come up with my own suggestion to include your Gloves of the Wise, its the Robes of Combat Sorcery in my signature, you may notice your item missing from the components, thats because I decided to suggest it with the current components, but I mention further down how I would rather have your item in it :)

[JONI]

Lots of votes, I hope to get more discussion about the item and the cast speed-stat overall.

[ma5]

Cast speed is pretty useless compared to other item bonuses you could be going for.

[DarkBullet]

Upped

[JONI]

Bump

[I_am_pudge]

I really really like the idea of a basic item to give cast speed since it can help out heroes like torturer and voodoo jester a ton. However your boots are a little too good perhaps. 70 movement speed, cast speed and perfectly balanced stats are just a bit much.

[DeTalores]

I never really understood the purpose of getting +cast speed.
How does this help, and would 20 cast speed make a noticeable difference?

[fatrend1]

Ahhhh, people who think +cast speed is bad. Let's set up a few scenarios for you to behold the amazingness that is +cast speed.

Take a hero like pyro, possibly the best example. Go in a practise game and DO NOT take fervor. Cast all your spells and see the massive delay. Now, max out fervor and cast all spells very, very quickly.

Play in a match against a magebane as any hero and attempt to cast a spell with his aura maxed. You will notice the difference. Ecspecially as int nukers who need to get casts off, such as TB. (While TB should be far away from the fight, attempt trying to chain chain lightning> lightning blast>ult while magebane is in your face.)

Possibly the most famous example of +cast speed is Torturer. Ever miss his stun? Probably. You've most likely missed it alot just because the enemy simply stepped out of it. But with a behemoths heart (which is sadly his last ultimate luxury item) you'll be stunning people like a pro.

Point of the story, cast speed does not get enough credit for heroes it's worth it on.

[OJPhoenix]

Holy Moly I didn't realise Magebane causes a Negative Cast Speed to his enemies!!!
Don't play him and don't verse him much, thankfully it would seem!
I'll be more aware next time I see one, good to know.

[fatrend1]

Holy Moly I didn't realise Magebane causes a Negative Cast Speed to his enemies!!!
Don't play him and don't verse him much, thankfully it would seem!
I'll be more aware next time I see one, good to know.

Nice troll attempt? I was trying to outline it for the people underestimating cast speed buffs.

[OhBob]

Cast speed is pretty useless compared to other item bonuses you could be going for.

Hell no, Shut up. If :pand:, :valk:, :devo:, :arma: and :souls: read this, they're gonna chase you dude.

[JONI]

I added a new item example, Wisdom. Any comments?

[OJPhoenix]

:eek: But.. Wisdom doesn't give ANY passive Cast Speed, I hate losing effects :(

Ability is quite interesting, I like the idea of it, don't know if numbers are right but I certainly like the idea. I'm thinking that reducing the enemy spell damage might be bad. Theres a number of direct anti caster / magic items as it is I'm not sure another one would be good, that and 1 of these from either team causes them to both cancel out. Still limited in use and unique from the others warrant viability still.

I would be more inclined to do something like (using your numbers)
+25 Cast Speed, +15% Magic Damage to Allies
-15 Cast Speed, -9% Magic Damage to Enemies

This way in the unfortunate even that 2 are placed at the same time, they don't both become worthless for the guys in between, they still give a bit.

Needs a Cast Range on placing Wisdom to determine Cliff/Tree placing.

I like it. I noticed you put my suggestion in your post, I feel honoured :D

[JONI]

Yeah you got some good points there :) I'll do some little tweaking

[DarkBullet]

If this somehow got implemented into Nome's Wisdom...

[docterj208]

Should probably give +15 cast speed to be similar to Gloves of haste, but in terms of concept, YOU WIN!

[Boris_One]

Like the idea alot, really appeals to me. Also the toying of +magic dmg on the "wisdom" item is rather new/rare, and i like it. Enhancing ints in a noticable but easily controllable way balance-wise!
And since S2 already introduced the concept of cast speed buffing themselves, there shouldnt be a conflict of interest there.

[JONI]

Good discussion here, but if you guys have any ideas for possible recipes let me know (or publish them yourself)!

[slocerberus]

T-up

[JONI]

Bump

[OJPhoenix]

pretty certain you don't need to bump when you've already qualified for popular :P

[Silithice]

This would be an amazing item, along with the items you suggested!
T-UP!

[LightofdaY]

Are spellcasting really that slow? i never noticed. +20 wut? I never had delay casting spells. but I guess anything helps those dreadful backswings.

[JONI]

Bump

[Apostate]

Why isn't this in populars yet?

[Orkimond]

^^^this

[Kynes``]

I voted yes because I agree with the initial premise the OP brought up; there are no caster speed items besides BH. While I feel the numbers aren't perfect, I love the idea and feel it would add some depth to item choice early game.

[JONI]

Bump

[Wratchet]

I thought of this item concept a while back (mine was +15 Cast Speed for 500 gold, just like Gloves of Haste). But one, single name stopped me: Magmus

The reason the Cast Speed upgrade only exists in the Behemoth's Heart and ONLY for Int heroes, is because of Magmus, Scout, and other heroes to which the balance of their ability is dependent on the casting time.

Think about what will happen when Magmus picks up 2 of these, and suddenly the cast time for his Ultimate is less than the Stun duration of his first ability. If you were going to have an item like this, it would have to be at least as expensive as the Portal Key, because in the worst-case scenario, that is what this item is replacing.

[JONI]

If cast speed couldn't be stacked, would it remove this problem in your opinion?

[Sapheron]

Castspeed doesn't affect channel time as far as I know.

[JONI]

Where did you get your information?

[Lexxxy]

great idea. t-up

[RushShepard]

This is amazing. I love you and want you inside me.

[Electrician]

I like the item ideas, don't seem to overpowered for their price, and adds more depth, seems good on pyromancer, who has long cast times

Also had an item idea, but when I read your item I replaced glove of the swift with this since it fit better with the idea , hope you don't mind me posting it in your thread :p :


[Glove of the Wise] - 600
[Gloves of the Swift] - 500
[Apprentice's Robe] - 450
[Recipe] - 750
Total - 2300
Creates: Glove of Thunder

+20 Cast speed
+20 Atack speed
+6 Intelligence

Effect:
Whenever the wearer uses a non attack modifier skill (arachna's webshot will not add charges) add a charge, maximum of 5 charges can be stored

When attacking, with 1 or more charges, 100% chance to cast Chain Lightning, dealing 75 Magic damage to your attack target and two additional nearby enemies.

Does not stack with other chance to cast chain lightning items


Cast speed and attack speed synch with its ability, since it gives charges faster and can unload those charges faster, although it works best with low cd heroes, like :pand: :thun: :arma:

[Duey]

item with a cause, ready to see something like this

[SmokeShow]

First item I actually like enough to vote yes on

[Mittsies]

I could see this being extremely powerful on certain heroes. T-UP

[SandroPDa3mn]

I really like the idea and the new recipes. I voted yes. Now we should not make too much of this. Hon should not become LoL, casters shouldnt scale too well..

[GGreenBass]

T-up! Although maybe they should be Wit instead of Wisdom- wisdom doesn't mean you think faster so much as wit does- and you need to think faster to react faster.

[JONI]

I didn't think about that but you are right :) But Wisdom shall it be!

[No]

I thought of this item concept a while back (mine was +15 Cast Speed for 500 gold, just like Gloves of Haste). But one, single name stopped me: Magmus

The reason the Cast Speed upgrade only exists in the Behemoth's Heart and ONLY for Int heroes, is because of Magmus, Scout, and other heroes to which the balance of their ability is dependent on the casting time.

Think about what will happen when Magmus picks up 2 of these, and suddenly the cast time for his Ultimate is less than the Stun duration of his first ability. If you were going to have an item like this, it would have to be at least as expensive as the Portal Key, because in the worst-case scenario, that is what this item is replacing.

Blacksmith's Frenzy gives 28(?) cast speed and doesn't reduce the channel of Magmus' ulti at all afaik. Cast speed = cast animation time, like tort stun, pyro stun, cursed ground, etc.

Edit: T-up except that totem of wisdom item, you obviously don't realize how horribly broken 12% magic damage aura is for 2800g.

[JONI]

I agree and the numbers aren't perfect at all, but what do you think of the idea buffing magic damage?

[DarkBullet]

Why dont you get this moved yo popular? Its met the requirements, has it not?

[Izual]

Why dont you get this moved yo popular? Its met the requirements, has it not?

This

[F34Re]

I voted yes.

btw.. behemoth's heart lowers cast time? when did that happen?

[F34Re]

This meets the requirements to get moved in to the "popular suggestions" forum so do it if you haven't already.

[DerangedCow]

Yup. I agree. This was well thought out. It must be moved now!

[coolmans]

Blacksmith's Frenzy gives 28(?) cast speed and doesn't reduce the channel of Magmus' ulti at all afaik. Cast speed = cast animation time, like tort stun, pyro stun, cursed ground, etc.

Edit: T-up except that totem of wisdom item, you obviously don't realize how horribly broken 12% magic damage aura is for 2800g.


it gives ATTACK SPEEED you twat.

[JONI]

Coolmans it also gives cast speed :)

Edit: So how can I move this to popular suggestions?

[DerangedCow]

Talk to a Mod that controls this part of the forums! :D

[JONI]

I'll do that :)

[Chickenfoo]

With the boots if you had it like this...

Boots (500) + Gloves of the wise (600) + Scarb (325 ) + 75 Recipe = 1500

MS 70
Mana Regen 75%
Cast speed +25
This way the int heroes will have more regen with the boots.
Just a thought.

[JONI]

Not a bad idea at all. But most of the casters need the survivality more than mana regen so I chose the stats instead.

[Saxxy_Beast]

sounds like a fairly good idea.

[MABManZ]

Nice concept, if you stack enough cast speed maybe you won't need :Portalkey: on :magm:

:D

[CheshireCat]

Likin it (y)

[Eskiya]

Sorry, I have to thumbs down. Landing Pyro's stun or any other skill that takes timing might get imbalanced.

[JONI]

Anything can make anything imbalanced, its just how its implemented.

[FiskOgHon]

I really like this. Especially the boots. I really feel there's missing a boot option for int and strength heroes who primarily cast other than the defensive "iron boots".

[Pogona]

S2's been looking for ways to get some magic armor effects into the game (the recent toying around with nome's wisdom for one thing), why don't you think about putting some + or - magic armor effects on the wisdom item instead of the magic damage stuff. I would change the name though, it will never get put in like that.

[JONI]

So the magic damage buff is too much? And Nome's Wisdom is getting the magicarmor aura so I think adding another magicarmor aura would be useless.

[pro_Noun]

the extra magic damage and -magic damage will probably be seen to be quite op, try turning it down a notch...

Concept flies fine with me -but i'm noobish - why would i want cast speed, isnt there better things i could get?

[Shadowedsoul]

I like the idea for the gloves on the whole, but 20% cast speed is a lot. I think they should either be lowered to 15% (just like attack speed gloves), or the price should be raised to 700.

In short, either:

15%/600
20%/700

P.S. I vote for 15%/600

[logosloki]

I like the idea for the gloves on the whole, but 20% cast speed is a lot. I think they should either be lowered to 15% (just like attack speed gloves), or the price should be raised to 700.

In short, either:

15%/600
20%/700

P.S. I vote for 15%/600

If the rating was only to be 15 then why not have it cost 500, just like the AS gloves then? This is most likely why they cost 600.

[JONI]

I like the idea for the gloves on the whole, but 20% cast speed is a lot. I think they should either be lowered to 15% (just like attack speed gloves), or the price should be raised to 700.

In short, either:

15%/600
20%/700

P.S. I vote for 15%/600
It is NOT 15%, its 15 cast speed which is a whole independent stat in game. There is no items besides Behemoth's Heart to buff cast speed which is the reason most of people doesn't know/ignores the whole cast speed stat. :)

[Je5uS]

Awesome, how about an AOE effect item like totem of wisdom that you plant on the ground to activate, but it leaves your inventory while it's planted. Anyone may retrieve it!
If the enemy picks it up they have the item.

Plant it near your tower to aid in defense or plant it when you push, but risk losing it to a hero like Chronos! It will be like having devine rapier again, only more interesting :)

[Cruzada]

This should be implemented. I playerd LoL yesterday and I saw a atribute called magic bonus or whatever, and here in HoN there isnt anything to power up the spell power or cast speed, only behemount and staff of master(that only counts for SOME ults). I think S2 really need to think about something to improve spell power/cast speed (also a cooldown reduce, cuz come'on behemont hearth isnt a cheap item) to make a more fair game to the casters heroes. Im not talking to copy the LoL system, but make a good build up to casters
Sorry for my english @_@

[HappyViet]

Perfect item. I say add it.

[Pineapple]

awesome basic item dude.. gj

[JONI]

Bump:ramp:

[Blyth]

Actually this item isn't very good, if s2 wanted a basic item that gives a minor cast speed increase it would already exist, but it is not needed because cast speed has such a small effect it would be stupid to go for it as an early game item, any mid-late game items which require several components could add cast speed as an additional effect, but a basic item with cast speed is just not needed since it's really not that good a stat and only benefits some heroes. An item with cast speed needs some additional effects and should be a recipe item :p

[JONI]

I agree, but I can count a few heroes (pyro, tortu, bs) to benefit of castspeed at anytime of the game. Maybe the benefits of this single basic item are too low, but considerable at least in recipes as you said.

[failshot]

I think it'll be just what HoN needs. There speed boosts for everything except cast times short of a Behemoth's Heart. Whats even better is all heroes will benefit from this item. I can't think of any that don't.

Do you have any other item concepts that will use Gloves of the Wise ATM?

[JONI]

I have, but would love to hear the critisism due this basic item first.

[MADD411]

Can't believe I never yes'd this item.

[WolveZCodeX]

Concept flies fine with me -but i'm noobish - why would i want cast speed, isnt there better things i could get?

it would be very usefull ESPECIALLY on :tort: since his stun has a long cast animation and he can finally be more appreciated for the awesome team hero that he is. Also heroes like behemoth would need it since his fissure also has a very slow cast animation. the faster we get our stuns the lovely the ganking gets. there are other heroes who can use it aswell.
:defi:faster waves.
:wret:faster ult
:dead:quick punch ult
:souls:no explanations needed why
:blac:faster stuns and slows

[Khane]

Yes, yes, yes, and more yes. Fantastic idea.

[Sacrificulum]

|Seal of |
| :blac: |
|Approval |

[GGreenBass]

Captain Falcon says:
YES

[failshot]

I think if you could make an item concept that maybe boosts your allies' cast speed in an aura. Something like Pyro's Fervor. But it should be on the higher cost since it may be gamebreaking....

[JONI]

failshot, I already have one.

[Charade]

I like it...

I just think its a -bit- too strong for the price

600 for +15 sounds perfecto.

And what if you made the staff reduce cool downs by a little? Or maybe even make it buff spell damage to help int heroes scale :)

[JONI]

The point is not to promote int hero scaling, they aren't supposed to scale to late game.

[RiftShards]

Nice im loving that totem idea. Perfect item idea, S2 needs to add this to the game asap.

[Laky]

rly rly nice idea... we need this item for nonINT casterslike behe with long castime abilities, becase heart provides castspeed only for int heroes

[Connatic]

Perfect, I'd love to see a handful of items that cater to caster classes. It seems right now the only good options is more regen :p

[DJDavyDave]

gimme gimme

[Laky]

how many votes need ad %yes till item will be potential??

[JONI]

It's not about votes if this item would make into the game, it is all about giving the idea of such item to be read, voted and commented by players. S2 makes their decission what is needed and not needed in game.

[Scopey]

Best idea I have seen so far. I still find it strange that this game has the stat 'cast speed', but no base item that gives it.

T-Up from me.

[nahmad]

awesome item in my opinion, i especially like the further types of combos. I feel that more types of boots will really deepen the gameplay

[Angusiasty]

new cast speed item would be great

[N`Hydrolisk]

I still want to see items like this.

[jorge69696]

What about int adding cast speed? just like agi adds attack speed. This would be a great buff to torturer and other heroes.

[Luda]

I was just about to make a thread requesting that boots of this type be made, but I found this first. My only concern is that the gloves shouldn't be able to stack, just like mystic vestiments. Just seems like a recipe for abuse to have +80 cast speed permanently on some heroes.

[JONI]

I made some changes to Gloves of the Wise (gloves are now unstackable) and Boots of the Wise (new activation). Let me hear your opinion and ideas!

[Hox]

i think its a great idea. Just that how do you make those pictures?

[Laky]

i want this iteeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeem asap

[LightofdaY]

I like the idea but how fast is +20 cast speed. and will i be able to notice it when magebane is around?

[Pow3rFr34K]

Please S2, add these items into the game! This is what we need right now and it is AWESOME! This will be made on half the heroes in the game and it is really, REALLY nice!

[Chime]

What about int adding cast speed? just like agi adds attack speed. This would be a great buff to torturer and other heroes.

Int already has both Mana and mana regen. Same goes for Str, where they have Health and health regen and Agi having armor and atspeed. There are only 2 benefits you get from those stats (3 for primary), and adding cast speed to the int tier will make the game completely broken.

[Rosgath]

Int already has both Mana and mana regen. Same goes for Str, where they have Health and health regen and Agi having armor and atspeed. There are only 2 benefits you get from those stats (3 for primary), and adding cast speed to the int tier will make the game completely broken.

Except Mana and mana regen have no direct correlation to survivability which both Health and Armor do. Of course most Int heroes are based around this and as such you typically have more/more powerful disables on Int heroes than you do on any other (notice how both :poll: and :witc: are considered 2 of the strongest disablers in game? No coincidence there)

[Chime]

Except Mana and mana regen have no direct correlation to survivability which both Health and Armor do. Of course most Int heroes are based around this and as such you typically have more/more powerful disables on Int heroes than you do on any other (notice how both :poll: and :witc: are considered 2 of the strongest disablers in game? No coincidence there)

So theres a rule that says that every stat needs to give survivability? And how should casting speed increase survivability by any chance?

[normyp]

The silence on activation on the boots is way over powered. Unless the cooldown is like 100 seconds or something much longer than Vindi's ult.

[Token]

great idea, could merge with items like tablet to give them late game potential also