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Kaelillidan
02-14-2010, 02:20 PM
Step 1: Random each AP game until you have successfully randomned yourself a carry, because you get 250+ more gold when you random.

P.S. :sand: is a TERRIBLE HERO to first pick, because he is completely useless until he is farmed.
Hint: He is a very strong late game hero, and could quite possibly be able to 1v1 any hero.

Step 2: Read each and every of your heroes abilities, so you know for sure what they do now.

P.S. Patches occur regularily and change quite a bunch of things about a hero.
Ex. Chronos no longer stuns at a percentage to stun, but on every 4th strike.This is very helpful to know so that you do not max his stun ability early game; striking a hero and draining 1 additional agility per hit is NOT effective early game, and this skill should not even be levelled until you are about to hit a target more than 3 times.

Step 3: Item Build and Skill Tree
Now that you have looked over your heroes abilities you are ready to synergize them with your item build. Note: Not everything in the recommended build, you should get for your hero.

1 example of an item build to synergize is: Agile shield for :sand::chro:. These 2 heroes have a skill that :sand:; deflects some damage as PURE damage - which is the strongest form of damage in this game, as you can tell he was meant to be a tank carry - :chro:; a chance to replenish the damage taken over time. The agile shield blocks 20 physical damage 100% of the time, this synergizes perfectly with these heroes. As both of these heroes are agile hero, the agile shield is great for them as the helm of black legion is way too costly for poor farmers to spend all of their cash on.
Some basic item builds for melee heroes: :scou::mage::swif: each work exceptionally well with a Runed Axe; preferably beginning with the Sustainer item. Sustainer is an EXCELLENT item choice for 90% of HoN heroes, as it provides +6 Hp regen per second, 125% mana regen per second, and a 10+ surplus in damage (great for carries / DPS heroes), at a low low cost of only 1750. After farming this item, it's ideal that heroes should begin to venture out and support in ganking; :swif: has it easy as he has 2 quick damage dealing nuke abilities, :scou: has it relatively easy as he can be invisible and place a silence ward to negate any incoming stuns, entanglements, or retreat abilities - and he can deal a quick flurry of hits, :mage: has it relatively difficult because he is a single target hitter and his HP pool is very poor. The best bet is to aim for heroes with a small mana pool and drain them *** Highly effective against :pred::swif::scou::dark::phar:, the next thing he can do is attempt to block heroes on their escape as his movement speed is extraordinarily quick, and he can always blink to another location to continue blocking (as I mentioned, quite difficult; magebane is not a hero to pick, but a hero to random)
Runed Axe combined with the flurry of attack speed these heroes were meant to have; it is a good way for them to counter their own lane being pushed in, and virtually one of the best ways to do it. You can trust me on this one thing, the Runed Axe is an excellent investment, is it will gain you more gold than you spent on it.

***Advanced Portion of Item Builds and Skill Tree***
:nigh: - Early Game Codex: Allows Night Hound to have the mana required to constantly Pounce, Cloud Silence, and use his Codex charge; which believe me, gives you a ton of last hits. A level 7 Night Hound deals up to 600-700 damage with this quick build, a force to be reckoned with. This item is not advised to upgrade for this hero.
:moon: - Early Game Whispering Helm: Allows Moon Queen to stack ancients by converting a (strong) creep and keeping him based near the ancients, and kiting them away from their base at the 53-54 second mark, so they are away from it during the 00 second mark. Also allows Moon Queen to farm the jungle with relative ease while waiting for her ult to cool down. While Moon Queen is waiting to get fat, stacking ancients will supply her with a mega-surplus of gold when it is finally taken down (Level 13-17)
This item is only advised to upgrade if you absolutely need the additional HP / Lifesteal. Driving Moon Queens' damage, attack speed, and Shrunken Head / Assassin's Shroud are much more important.
:chro: - Early Game Thunderclaw: Allows Chronos to deal additional magical damage, (on top of his time leap). The game has made it difficult to defend vs. both physical and magical damage; Zephyr has it easy but Jereziah's Charm only defends vs. Spells (which ideally do magical damage), and his Ult (which only defends vs. physical damage).
*This item is absolutely recommended to upgrade.*
The Mjollnir can be placed as a shield on any unit including Chronos to create a Chain Lightning shield to strike enemies that attack.
:sand: - Possibly the most difficult hero to play: I absolutely recommend suiting him to a tanking-auto attacker role by increasing his Block, evasion, and giving him lifesteal. As he is also a very difficult hero to farm well, I recommend farming a Mjollnir on him, as it gives him a magic shield. I recommend spending the initial gold on getting him an Agile shield, although this is possibly a hero where you may want to invest in a helm of black legion only if you can afford to. Whispering Helm is a must for this hero, because 1v1, or 1v2 he will be deflecting pure damage back to other heroes which does a fair bit of hurting, so his ability to keep himself alive during this process is required. Upgrading to a Satanic is definately Ideal. Finally a Geometer's Bane is another excellent item choice; as his passive aura stacks with his illusions (so if they take damage, it reflects back as pure)

This is my quick list of commonly chosen heroes that require the most assistance, I pray that this has been anything useful to you, and please get back to me if you need any additional help, or aid with heroes unlisted.
Thank You.

Mopealot
02-14-2010, 02:32 PM
helm of black legion is way too costly for poor farmers to spend all of their cash on

You shouldnt really play hard carrys if you cant farm properly.

Kaelillidan
02-14-2010, 02:37 PM
You shouldnt really play hard carrys if you cant farm properly.

This is the training grounds, I am setting the bar for those who seek it. Helm of Black Legion requires 2225 some gold, which is equivilant to about 55 creep kills, considering the average player kills 140 creeps, this is a gold-waster.

akitoes
02-14-2010, 02:45 PM
Step 1: Random each AP game until you have successfully randomned yourself a carry, because you get 250+ more gold when you random.


P.S. :sand: is a TERRIBLE HERO to first pick, because he is completely useless until he is farmed.


1 example of an item build to synergize is: Agile shield for :sand:

the agile shield is great for them as the helm of black legion is way too costly for poor farmers to spend all of their cash on.



:nigh: - Early Game Codex: Allows Night Hound to have the mana required to constantly Pounce, Cloud Silence, and use his Codex charge;


Early Game Thunderclaw: Allows Chronos to deal additional magical damage, (on top of his time leap).


:sand: - Possibly the most difficult hero to play. I absolutely recommend suiting him to a tanking-auto attacker role by increasing his Block, evasion, and giving him lifesteal. As he is also a very difficult hero to farm well,I recommend farming a Mjollnir on him as it gives him a magic shield. I recommend spending the initial gold on getting him an Agile shield, although this is possibly a hero where you may want to invest in a helm of black legion only if you can afford to. Whispering Helm is a must for this hero, because 1v1, or 1v2 he will be deflecting pure damage back to other heroes which does a fair bit of hurting, so his ability to keep himself alive during this process is required. Upgrading to a Satanic is definately Ideal.Finally a Geometer's Bane is another excellent item choice; as his passive aura stacks with his illusions (so if they take damage, it reflects back as pure)



We see you trollin
We hatin'

kirbyruled
02-14-2010, 02:45 PM
This is the training grounds, I am setting the bar for those who seek it. Helm of Black Legion requires 2225 some gold, which is equivilant to about 55 creep kills, considering the average player kills 140 creeps, this is a gold-waster.

140 creeps in how much time...??

Time is very releant in relation to farming CKs.

edit: And yea akitoes is right, recommending Codex/Charged Hammer for NH/SW makes you a troll.

Manastrider
02-14-2010, 02:50 PM
"P.S. :sand: is a TERRIBLE HERO to first pick, because he is completely useless until he is farmed"

I should have stopped reading here. If you can't farm well what's the point in carrying? Oh, and there were other places where I thought I should stop reading... " Early Game Codex", "Early Game Thunderclaw", "Step 1"...

Kaelillidan
02-14-2010, 02:52 PM
http://replays.heroesofnewerth.com/match_replay.php?mid=26689593
Codex Night Hound

Kaelillidan
02-14-2010, 02:54 PM
http://replays.heroesofnewerth.com/match_replay.php?mid=26702805
Mjollnir Chronos
The 652 Experience per minute is probably the best one I can show you.
My non-lifesteal Chronos that pulverized, is that trolling?

Or how about a non-portal key Tempest; this is definately trolling... Whom I valiantly played the Mega Support role for my 3 carries.
http://replays.heroesofnewerth.com/match_replay.php?mid=26653851

Tripwyr
02-14-2010, 02:57 PM
Having a single replay showing it doesn't imply that it's good as a core item. I have a replay of myself playing Hellbringer where I farmed Mock as my first item and went 28-2, that doesn't mean Mock is the be-all end-all core item.

iBringer
02-14-2010, 02:58 PM
Cant go wrong with sustainer, duh.

solomonster1
02-14-2010, 03:02 PM
"Step 2: Read each and every of your heroes abilities, so you know for sure what they do now.

P.S. Patches occur regularily and change quite a bunch of things about a hero."

"These 2 heroes have a skill that :sand:; deflects some damage as PURE damage - which is the strongest form of damage in this game,"

SW deflects damage as magic damage now

akitoes
02-14-2010, 03:03 PM
Meh it doesn't look like you're trolling so errrrrrrrrrrr...

Kaelillidan
02-14-2010, 03:10 PM
"Step 2: Read each and every of your heroes abilities, so you know for sure what they do now.

P.S. Patches occur regularily and change quite a bunch of things about a hero."

"These 2 heroes have a skill that :sand:; deflects some damage as PURE damage - which is the strongest form of damage in this game,"

SW deflects damage as magic damage now

Ah, excellent find; this now makes Sand Wraith the most difficult hero to play. The thread was designed as a tool to getting HoN players to stop choosing heroes such as this one. Whom I find has an extraordinarily difficult time laning successfully. Sand Wraith is a weak early game hero, and is very dependent upon his teammates to stand a chance of farming.

Carries such as: I was going to start clicking the icons..but naturally every other carry in the game is a better choice.

Chosing a hero to play as, should always been chosen with intelligence, if you so desire to choose your heros, which I do not. Heroes that are chosen should be chosen with knowledge of lane control, map awareness, survivability, or farm ability.

:zeph::moon::arma::soulr::defi::corr: are examples of solid farmers. Farming is an important aspect of the game, as non-farmers are quickly vanquished.

Kaelillidan
02-14-2010, 03:17 PM
The pro HoN/DotA players should probably be in the Strategies Forum, I am writing this Thread for players still seeking help to playing well. I am making the point, as mentioned above that carrying is not an easy task, and Sand Wraith is a fine example of a hero that has difficulty just being a hero.

An unwritten rule; is such as enemy heroes always aim for carry heroes,so they stay low-level, have as less gold as possible, and predominately - they don't carry. Without map awareness a 3-5 man gank on Sand Wraith will surely kill him before he stands a chance of escaping.

This is why map awareness is important true, that's really an entirely different discussion.
Edit:
This is probably my best (or worst) sand wraith that I can pull up:
http://replays.heroesofnewerth.com/match_replay.php?mid=26283633
I myself, don't play a perfect Sand Wraith - That's mainly why I don't choose him as a hero, this replay was again, a random hero.

Tripwyr
02-14-2010, 03:40 PM
Threads such as this belong in the strategy forums, as item builds are arguable and should not be argued here.