Ward Guide [Image Heavy]

[Nome]

PLEASE READ THE ENTIRE TOPIC.
There have been many helpful comments regarding ward placement that I didn't have the time/insight to put into this guide, especially regarding middle ward placement.



http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v169/snagg3r/HoNItems/supplies/wardofsight.jpg

Wards of Sight
200 gold
6 minutes
2 charges

Priceless intelligence.

Wards of Sight are the single most powerful and cost-effective item in the game. If uncountered, they are the equivalent of hacking. No other item is as strong as this. As of right now, there is no limit to the number you can buy--in addition, they will not be revealed by players with Bound Eye.

This guide is meant specifically for Wards of Sight. However, you can do similar things with Scout's Electric Eye and Keeper of the Forest's Tree Sight.

Each ward position will be shown on the main map (look for the orange doodad). Its approximate sight range will be shown on the minimap, though line-of-sight blockers are not considered.

Bottom River
One of the most common ward placement spots, this position will allow you to have sight of the bottom rune, the area outside Kongor, and nearby ramps. It is a well-balanced position for both teams, though Legion may want to use one of the more defensive positions depending on the game flow. Due to trees, it will not allow for vision of the Hellbourne red neutral camp. Compared to Top River, this is the inferior placement spot for middle defensive players, as it is more difficult to gank middle from bottom than top due to tower placement (invisible heroes enter tower reveal range if approaching from high ground).

http://i27.tinypic.com/2e6bfrn.jpg


Top River
Another common ward placement spot. This is the counterpart to Bottom River. It is the superior placement for middle defensive players, as it's much easier to gank from top than bottom. However, middle players can check top rune much easier than they can bot, so the rune reveal is not as useful.

http://i27.tinypic.com/k385d5.jpg


Legion Neutral Block
Most useful if performed before the 0:30 mark, this position will block neutral creeps from spawning for 6 minutes. This will prevent neutral pulling and nullify a major Legion advantage in bottom lane. I'm aware that putting a ward behind trees in DotA will provide superior intel and block creeps in two camps, but I've yet to try this in HoN.

http://i29.tinypic.com/2u977cx.jpg


Hellbourne Neutral Block
Identical in role to Legion neutral block. Same notes as before.
http://i25.tinypic.com/2cyo6ld.jpg


Legion Plateau
One of the best late-game placements, this will reveal Legion's most defensive neutral camp. Excellent placement for blink heroes or Devourer. Useful for ganking.

http://i28.tinypic.com/2gvmre9.jpg


Hellbourne Plateau
Ward is at top-right of picture. Partially reveals green neutral camp, but you can see any jungling players moving around the area. Great for ganking.

http://i26.tinypic.com/8vwyf7.jpg


Legion Ultradefensive
Powerful ward spot for defensive play. Shows river-to-Legion ramp and Legion tri-directional ramp for near-complete incoming-gank coverage. Great for mid-late game jungle heroes.

http://i31.tinypic.com/n6rof4.jpg

Legion Bottom Defensive
Great spot for early play. Reveals bottom rune as well as area behind Legion trees bottom. Great for Hellbourne bottom lane players who wish to avoid middle or jungle ganks.

http://i27.tinypic.com/ouzhbl.jpg


Hellbourne Ultradefensive
Should be used in conjunction with Top River in order to cover the most common gank routes to Hellbourne Jungle. Useful for pushing and ganking late game.

http://i27.tinypic.com/oirtjr.jpg


Middle Ramps
The discerning mid-solo player who doesn't mind spending gold in order to obtain a completely unfair advantage should place a ward on his opponent's ramp. This allows for complete avoidance of enemy teleport ganks, high ground surprises, and missed denies.

http://i32.tinypic.com/2j18wg5.jpg

[Tr1cKSt3R]

Very good.
And very needed.
Although i think someone posted a similar thread a while back... not sure about that. Or at least had a post with a warding guide link in it.

Sadly, I doubt the people who actually need this guide will use it :(

[Voldo1]

Was wondering - what tree do you use for Keeper's Tree Sight to paint the bottom runespot? I can't seem to be able to paint it :(

[Tryptophan]

Never place the ward where it is shown in "Bottom River" (first picture). You also want it on the side closer to the Legion?

Why? Because no matter what side you're on, you'll be able to see the rune. If you're playing Legion then you'll be able to see who is coming up in your jungle and if you're Hellbourne you'll be able to see who moving around in the jungle on the Legion side and if they're coming to gank or not while you're in the river.

You can also place a ward below the Legion's middle neutral camp where it's parallel to the pull camp (one closest to the lane) to watch the jungle if you're on Hellbourne in order to set up ganks.

There's no tree that you can use in order for Keeper's Tree Sight can watch the bottom rune.

Good work on the guide anyways.

[j00sh]

There's no tree that you can use in order for Keeper's Tree Sight can watch the bottom rune.


bro...

http://i32.tinypic.com/ad0s8y.jpg

don't mind the battlefury

[Tryptophan]

Really? That works? That never worked in DotA for me :(

Battlefury :D

[Electrician]

you need to have tree leveled though, a level 1 tree wont cut it

[Tryptophan]

Ah that's probably why :). It never worked for me because I tried to set it at level 1 -.-

[j00sh]

you're right, that is a level 4 tree sight

but I just tested it and level 3 will still give full vision of the rune, 1 and 2 will not

which is fine by me, I almost always have that at level 5 on keeper

[Vadi]

I saw a keeper enchant the tree in the marsh before Kongor. Ugh :(

Great guide though, tyvm. Will make use of it :)

[ThatDaxGuy]

Many thanks for this guide. Do you suggest getting sight wards whenever any hero has extra cash or should one person on the team be responsible for sighting?

[cios]

Many thanks for this guide. Do you suggest getting sight wards whenever any hero has extra cash or should one person on the team be responsible for sighting?

Support buys the wards (or roamers like pyromancer/lina). You never want your carry burning his money on this.

[Glorify1]

Middle ramps are really bad spots to place wards.

You can ward sentinel side ancient area to give vision of sent mid lane+top rune.

You can ward near the little dip in the first ramp leading up to scourge mid lane, from the river near where rune is, for scourge mid lane+top rune.

No need to waste wards in areas where they can be used to multitask.

[Tr1cKSt3R]

Middle ramps are really bad spots to place wards.

I've won so many 1v1's because i ward the ramp.

[Glorify1]

I've won so many 1v1's because i ward the ramp.

Edit to my post explained why.

[Tr1cKSt3R]

Edit to my post explained why.

yes but the mid ramp is easier. you don't have to expose your self to put the ward down. in a heated mid you just wanna throw the wards down right there.

[Nome]

Never place the ward where it is shown in "Bottom River" (first picture). You also want it on the side closer to the Legion?

Why? Because no matter what side you're on, you'll be able to see the rune. If you're playing Legion then you'll be able to see who is coming up in your jungle and if you're Hellbourne you'll be able to see who moving around in the jungle on the Legion side and if they're coming to gank or not while you're in the river.

You can also place a ward below the Legion's middle neutral camp where it's parallel to the pull camp (one closest to the lane) to watch the jungle if you're on Hellbourne in order to set up ganks.

There's no tree that you can use in order for Keeper's Tree Sight can watch the bottom rune.

Good work on the guide anyways.

That's the only spot that covers rune and Kongor though, which is why I left it there, unless I'm misunderstanding you.


Middle ramps are really bad spots to place wards.

You can ward sentinel side ancient area to give vision of sent mid lane+top rune.

You can ward near the little dip in the first ramp leading up to scourge mid lane, from the river near where rune is, for scourge mid lane+top rune.

No need to waste wards in areas where they can be used to multitask.

Completely forgot about the Legion red neutral ramp. Will add sometime. The middle ramps still aren't terrible choices though for truly defensive play in mid. I did it in DotA with Tinker and a few other heroes that needed an expensive item early.

[Tryptophan]

It's actually not the only spot. A better spot is to place it on the ramp leading up to the Hellbourne middle lane from the right side. In DotA the spot was easy to tell because there was a torch. I don't know what "landmark" HoN has for it but you can still place it in the same spot and watch the rune,Hellbourne movement, and Kongor.

[Nome]

It's actually not the only spot. A better spot is to place it on the ramp leading up to the Hellbourne middle lane from the right side. In DotA the spot was easy to tell because there was a torch. I don't know what "landmark" HoN has for it but you can still place it in the same spot and watch the rune,Hellbourne movement, and Kongor.

Ah, yes. Will add that, and Glorify's, later.

[Voldo1]

Is there a way you can eye the rune with the skill at level 1? I knew you could do it at level 4 :P

[j00sh]

Is there a way you can eye the rune with the skill at level 1? I knew you could do it at level 4 :P

like I said before, you can do it at tree sight level 3, 1 and 2 won't work

just level it up anyways it's very beneficial

[Lethe]

Very nice guide Nome. I will link it to my guide with your permission.

[livmew]

Nooooome. You forgot that you can ward along the ledges of the enemy's main base in order to gain vision of the top level. Handy when you're pushing. There's a few spots where you can place wards without tower taking the wards out.

[ThatDaxGuy]

Quick question, when playing in pubs, should you still rely on the support heroes to ward or should you ward no matter what you role for map advantage in this case?

I'm guessing its slightly better to maybe do your own wards as they can prevent a death which pays for itself? and maybe have you practice being independent?

[Nome]

Nooooome. You forgot that you can ward along the ledges of the enemy's main base in order to gain vision of the top level. Handy when you're pushing. There's a few spots where you can place wards without tower taking the wards out.

I didn't forget... I was just too lazy to do them = /

[ShadowReaper]

Really? That works? That never worked in DotA for me :(

Battlefury :D

Yeah, this game's line of sight is way too large, I believe it needs to be limited. It limits the ability to juke by a lot.

[livmew]

Quick question, when playing in pubs, should you still rely on the support heroes to ward or should you ward no matter what you role for map advantage in this case?

I'm guessing its slightly better to maybe do your own wards as they can prevent a death which pays for itself? and maybe have you practice being independent?

As I told you in the game mate, you can not rely on anyone to do anything in pubs. If the support says he will ward, lean back and let him do that. But I've had 1 out of 75 games where that happened, so if you die a lot/do not have good map awareness, then yeah, go get your own wards. It'll pay off, trust me. You'll also learn to check the map more often, and eventually you can stop warding; you'll get a "feel" for when you need to run back.

Wards still help you confirm your feelings (you don't want to waste XP on a bad gut feeling), and they will absolutely spice your pub game up (gogo kill:death ratio gogo), but very few teams will consider it a "necessity". I would still recommend it, at least one in the river on your side of the map. 200g/12 min of map control cannot be topped. There's just no cheaper way to stay alive and have a good control over the map, and since very few enemy teams ward, you can completely dominate the woods/lanes by knowing where they are. Just don't expect to automatically live, you still need to know who you are laning against and what they can do.

On a side note, warding yourself means you can have them where you want them. If you are a roamer (A hero which moves around the map ganking - Wildsoul is a decent roamer), you can put one or two wards in the enemy forest, and run in to get some 1on1 kills vs an uncareful enemy. Just make sure you ward the entrance AND exit, so you cannot be jumped, and be quick about it. It's a nice way to use wards offensively instead of covering your own ass.

[Voldo1]

like I said before, you can do it at tree sight level 3, 1 and 2 won't work

just level it up anyways it's very beneficial

Ok thanks - I normally level it high quickly anyway :P

[FuzzyWuzzy]

Very good screens and general knowledge of ward spots.

Please also add warding the actual lanes. It was frequently done by some teams at the late phases of the game (for example warding at the second Hellbourne top or bottom tower when it's destroyed). I'm at work atm, so I can't screen, but I hope you understood me.

P.S. Just remembered, some people like to ward BEHIND the first towers on the sides, where people generally like to creep pull, rather than actually block the spawn.

[ElementUser]

For neutral creep block wards, you should place them just outside of the creep area entrance so you'll get some external vision too

[Uludayen]

There's one near the top legion ramp that works in dota, im testing it now.

http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/3453/runebotrune.png
http://img31.imageshack.us/img31/2177/runebotward.png
http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/6163/runetoprune.png
http://img35.imageshack.us/img35/7992/runetopward.png

[Uludayen]

accident

[Nome]

Yeah, those are actually superior spots for mid defense play. I completely forgot about 'em.

[Uludayen]

the top one is harder to pull off than it is in dota, but thats usually where i ward if im zeus solo mid or anyone solo mid really

[Qwernakus]

So, wards are invisible?

[Uludayen]

Yes, they're invisible until revealed.

[ReijiMaigo]

Well, it's better to place a ward slightly to the side of the tree on your Top River spot. That way, you get vision into Hellbourne jungle as well while still seeing the rune and such.

[kingcomrade]

You should mention that for supporting a solo mid runewhore you really only need a single ward up on the bottom rune spot. Due to the much larger sight radius heroes have in HoN you can practically see the top rune spot from the mid lane.

[Damage]

Awesome guide.

[KnightDavion]

Can you add, or at least mention, where to put the wards if you are using Scout wards? The range on the scout wards is different and it wont let me place them up 2 levels lik eyou show in the picture. I can go up 1 level np.

Does it make a diff? Do high elevation wards have better line of sight?

[livmew]

Go up one level instead of two, and yes, high elevation is better. You can see downards, but not up. For example, try placing an eye right next to a cliff, then try placing it on the cliff.

Trees will block the LoS aswell, as will slopes.

[Rippsy]

Very nice guide :)

[Viole]

Yes yes, I should probably have read every post, but I'm pretty tired and just finished a game with a friend. I wasn't finished with my own ward guide (busy irl) and went to check if there was a completed one, and found this (with pictures, yay!). My friend's ward placement was just horrible, so I had to have him share control to do it right (it was stuff like warding the corner of the Legion secret shop that had no vision, not placing it on higher ground, etc). So, here's a location I didn't think I saw on the list before I head off to bed, so I don't forget to do it later and yeah yeah. Great work on the guide, though :).

Near the Legion's super creep spawn (Predasaurs and Dragon spawn) above the ramp, and on the 2nd tier right there. The correct placement gives view of the camp itself, the better part of the upper middle river, the rune itself (at the very edge of vision, not visable at night), and all of the surrounding areas. It's great early game, when no one is going to be needed the super creeps respawning, and late game when farming isn't as prominent, it's great to deny their creeps (as Hellborne) as well as scout a huge area of ganks and defenses. I'm sure you can simplify all of this into your own words much better, but I'm just tossing this out there while I'm awake.

[Milbenator]

Great guide, used it, placed 4 eyes early, got 5 totems 9 TREE EATERS then bottle/boots/codex 1/Treads/codex 5/Whispering helm/TP scroll , with the crazy Intel from wards we were able to dominate them mid game. It was a bit harsh early game but struggled through it till codex.

They kept buying wards and I would put an eye out to see it and destroy it, then at about the 30 min mark I started carrying my own gem around for their Night hound and Slither with assassin cloak.

The player who kept buying eyes I would just ult then codex then finish them and destroy the eye.

Very fun times. But as people have mentioned LOTS of counters.

But if you play careful, use your eyes to help team, actually scout, and help INITIATE with your ult (Not kill steal) scout can be worthwhile.

[Nome]

@Viole: Yeah, one day, I'll update this guide with those spots >.>
@Milbenator: I think you got lost! My Scout guide is that-a-way!

[Disposition9]

Would it be possible to get placement of other maps also? It would be greatly appreciated.

-D96

[CandIeJack]

The mid wards allow for targeted casting uphill on ranged heroes also.
With heroes such as Succubus it's invaluable to have the wards there because you don't have to get into tower range to see your target to cast.

Yes, they're invisible until revealed.
What reveals them?

[MrHaze]

What reveals them?
True Sight of any sort.
Dusts of Revelation
Wards of Revelation
Bound Eye
Scout's Electric Eyes
etc.

[ElementUser]

Update the first photo :(

Photobucket fails

[Ehbrus]

True Sight of any sort.
Dusts of Revelation
Wards of Revelation
Bound Eye
Scout's Electric Eyes
etc.
I will have to test bound eye but afaik it did not reveal wards.

[Warchamp7]

I will have to test bound eye but afaik it did not reveal wards.

It is supposed to now, they patched it

[HonStinks]

You can place a ward on the top rune area so that it will block the mid level creep camp as well as show the rune area. Just place it on the highest cliff close enough to the creep camp and you are set. It won't see into the camp but it does block spawns.

This probably works on the bottom rune as well to block the nearby mid level creeps and showing the rune area.

[Alamandaros]

I was sad that I didn't see my favorite warding spot. On the Legion side, place a ward at the top of the ramp north of the middle lane, on the right 'corner'. If done properly this gives you vision of the top rune (barely), and the entire area above mid (and a good portion of mid on the Legion side later in the game when towers are gone).

Also didn't see my favorite bottom spot. Just place a ward on the 'plateau' directly south of the ward, and to the right of the ramp.

One question about the "Legion Ultradefensive" ward spot. I know for a fact that in DotA the two trees above it blocked vision of part of the river which really hurt that spot. Do those trees block vision in HoN?

[Kralnor]

Terrific guide. I rarely use wards, so that needs to change ;)

[xelente]

sadface, can't load the pictures :<

[Vnc_G]

I'm still new to the whole game, but I've been playing its ancestor game for quite a while and I want to ask: In Hellbourne jungle, will dropping a ward behind the trees in the easiest creep pull camp allow creepspawn blockage or does it only work in DotA?

I'm pertaining to this:
http://i25.tinypic.com/2cyo6ld.jpg

There's also a situational ward spot for Legion Kongor-hunters. Sometimes, you need to ward the entrance to Hellbourne secret shop from their base before proceeding to Kongor in anything more than useless pub games. It's the easiest way to counter ones that try to outflank you while you kill Kongor, esp. ones that warded outside the lair and have full knowledge of your whereabouts.

P.S. You also need to state that while Hellbourne river (top rune cliff area) has a tree on it just like in DotA, the ward is not to be placed behind the tree. For some reason warding behind the tree does not always give proper vision (in fact, strategically speaking it gives next to no advantage). You have to ward in front this time.

wow. Thank you for the guide.

I always wanted to put wards but I didn't know where to put it effectively.

I do now. :)

[Qwernakus]

Nice guide, Nome! By now i lol at my "Are wards invisible" comments earlier in this thread.

I made a link to this guide in my scout guide, i hope that is okay?

[uno]

thank you for the guide

[Doggan]

My favorite ward spot:

http://img97.imageshack.us/img97/584/runespot.jpg

[Griddler]

For ganking woods isnt there something to be said for not putting it on the creeps? If they see the creeps not respawn they will know its warded and be more cautious - or they'll buy a ward and know right where to place it.

Understand blocking to prevent jungling, but if your goal is simply to gank you need to place somewhere other than on top of creeps :/

[Miyataa]

The most 2 common ward placements are always one at the rune spot and another one precisly upon the hill beside the middle.. (the entrance to the jungle from middle).

[Miyataa]

One thing that needs to be added is that there cant be more than 4 wards active at a time / team.

[FlamePhoenix]

Excellent guide I must say. I wish I could give you bonus rep points or something.
One question though, I can never buy more than 2 wards at one time. I think that the line is wrong:

As of right now, there is no limit to the number you can buy

There is. One team can only have 2 sight wards placed at 1 time.
If you have scout or tree you can use their wards, else you can't.

Hope it helps.

Another useful place for a ward.
2038

Basically with only 2 wards you can have a complete vision of the half part of the river that leads to your lane. This way there is no way you can be surprised.

[magz]

The only spot that I can contribute:
http://frozenheat.net/images/legion-shop-2.jpg - Full 360 vision including part of the legion top lane, secret shop bottom entrance and the sneak lane connected to it.

The red dot indicates the spot you should place the ward. Has some leeway.

Probably wasn't intended due to the fact that it's barely on the ledge, but whatever works.

[Senfei]

a lot of wards missing and legion ultradefensive is set wrong


http://frozenheat.net/images/legion-shop-2.jpg

same possbile at hellbourne side

[magz]

same possbile at hellbourne side
Not nearly as effective unfortunately.

[Amajed]

http://i31.tinypic.com/n6rof4.jpg


first of all what this pic is showing isnt right ,,, u cant see whats behind the trees , it will be a blind spot for this ward ,, its normal I just wanted to say that

thats how it looks when there are no ally units at the rune:
http://img267.imageshack.us/img267/9750/oldspot.jpg

the other immportant thing is this one must be edit to another place

look at the pic :
http://img31.imageshack.us/img31/3728/newspot1.jpg

http://img31.imageshack.us/img31/1972/newspot2.jpg



ok as u can see u can see the rune + u can see whos coming from mid to the rune ,, half of the blind spot is clear and u can see throw

[Fritsc]

Few really important spots are missing.

You need to put the ward the the most right side, or else the tree facing will block your ward's sight.
http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/1577/screenshot20091219at417.png (http://img17.imageshack.us/i/screenshot20091219at417.png/)

http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/5195/screenshot20091219at417f.png (http://img17.imageshack.us/i/screenshot20091219at417f.png/)

http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/6962/screenshot20091219at417s.png (http://img17.imageshack.us/i/screenshot20091219at417s.png/)






Another spot
http://img690.imageshack.us/img690/2442/screenshot20091219at420.png (http://img690.imageshack.us/i/screenshot20091219at420.png/)

http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/2442/screenshot20091219at420.png (http://img403.imageshack.us/i/screenshot20091219at420.png/)

http://img706.imageshack.us/img706/2442/screenshot20091219at420.png (http://img706.imageshack.us/i/screenshot20091219at420.png/)




And the last one that everybody mentions, but forgot something.
http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/9686/screenshot20091219at423.png (http://img403.imageshack.us/i/screenshot20091219at423.png/)

http://img31.imageshack.us/img31/9686/screenshot20091219at423.png (http://img31.imageshack.us/i/screenshot20091219at423.png/)
Destroy the 2 trees using Hatchet or Runes.
EDIT: Sorry for the huge images. I did resized, but clearly it's not in here.

[Fernseher]

i have 2 questions:

first, can you place a ward in a way that it blocks 2 of your opponent's creepcamps ?
What came to my mind would maybe be the position left to the minor creepcamp on the hellbourne side to maybe block the creepspawn below at the ramp ( the ramp near the rune) aswell.

second, do keepers eyes which were already placed become better when you lvl up the skill?

sry to not check that out by myself but i'm at work and totally bored since its the time between christmas and new year.

Thx in advance

[pieRRe]

Thanks for the useful guide. It has definitely improved my playing.

[Kirbyski]

you should post the ward down the far bottom left ontop of the statue near the secret shop

[hughjas1]

great! thanks a ton

[krucifix]

How about teaching players about the 2 outer lane 'defensive' ward locations.

For Legion, you place it at the river entrance bottom, allowing you to see any TP's in from the tower, and vice versa for Hellbourne top, placing it again at the river entrance.

These can save people in those lanes as if you also ward your corresponding rune spot, you can have vision of all entrances in to your neuts and corresponding lane.

Pretty much the same as the 'above ramp' wards in mid, for the outer lanes.

[OTRobin]

why would anyone play HoN on a modem

[Zoro]

Thanks so much for the guide ^^ i usually never get wards cause i don't know where to put them. haha! so thanks a bunch XD now i'll start getting them

[XxXPolacoXxX]

:smile:

[JellyFishJay]

Nice Guide, maybe they should make tutorial's for new players, and make them read this. >:[

[tanKza]

great guide! thanks :-)

[Kekoticmyth]

I saw in a game someone put a ward between the 2 legion neutral camps near the entrance towards bottom rune spawn If that makes sense....
They said it stops the 2 camps from spawning, is that a strategy and can someone post where to put it exacty?

[masterbait69]

can elec eye of scout be place in higher grounds like the legion or hellbourne platue...f so can u show me how??

..........and yes im a noob..

I haven't seen a graphical representation of exactly how close a ward needs to be to a creep spawn in order to block it. I'd particularly like to ensure I'm blocking the creep spawn (the one that commonly gets pulled to lane), but maximize my ward by also having that ward see as far out as possible and get some information on the surrounding jungle and/or the lane.

Does anyone know of some pictures that show the creep blocking range?

I'm curious if there is some way to block the legion northwest-most neutral spawn and see the bottom rune at the same time.

I'm also curious if it's possible to block the legion green neutral camp and their most defensive neutral camp, with one ward. (Those two camps seem to be extremely close together, in terms of the 'as the crow flies' distance.)

I'm also curious if it's possible to block the legion green neutral camp and their most defensive neutral camp, with one ward. (Those two camps seem to be extremely close together, in terms of the 'as the crow flies' distance.)

Nope. Very fail. I was really surprised this didn't block the snotters at least. I'm wondering if the 'neutral spawn decision calculation point' is different than the location the creeps actually spawn at?

http://img96.imageshack.us/img96/676/wardfail.th.jpg (http://img96.imageshack.us/i/wardfail.jpg/)

[Avi1231]

Nome, how come you don't have any nice pushing ward spots mentioned? By "pushing ward spots" I mean wards in between enemy towers to spot incoming TPs from the enemy team while you're team is pushing. Best example I can think of is the one behind Hellbourn's top outermost tower to spot them TPing in and setting up the initiation onto the Legion team from the jungle while the Legion's pushing.

Also, the ward spots that are out in front of the outermost Legion tower top and the outermost Hellbourne tower bottom that can help protect your team from jungle ganks and spot incoming enemy TPs.

(Oops, should have said northeast.)

I'm curious if there is some way to block the legion northeast-most neutral spawn and see the bottom rune at the same time.
This, on the other hand, is easy to accomplish. I'm surprised I don't see it in the various ward guides I've seen around these forums. Instead of the "Legion Bottom Defensive" location, move the ward slightly west to the other side of the tree on the clearing directly above the neutral camp. You'll block the creep spawn, see the rune, and also have a tiny sliver of line-of-sight down into the jungle (to ever-so-briefly see incoming ganks that happen to cross above the easyily-pullable camp). I suppose the "Legion Bottom Defensive" is better for most purposes since it gives two-way vision in the river and more jungle vision, but if they have an Ophelia or a Zephyr that absolutely needs to be shut down, I think I might prefer to block the spawn.

That said, if Legion has a jungler that absolutely needs to be shut down, I'd probably instead place a ward near the easily-pullable legion camp. But instead of putting a ward inside the camp itself, or even on the edge of the camp at the green torghlight (which gives meh visibility into the jungle and zero visibility into the lane), I'd put the ward just above it on the opposite side of the tree. A ward there still blocks it from spawning, and gives very good visibility of anyone neutralling either the camp northwest of it, or the camp northeast of it, making them very gankable.

[Avi1231]

Is Nome even paying attention to this thread anymore or am I crazy?

[Avi1231]

Nome, you ever gonna update this thing or will someone else have to make another guide to expand on what you started?

[FlamePhoenix]

I think it is obvious that he left this guide long time ago ...

[Drasha]

don't think i linked here yet since nome will most likely not update this
ward spots (http://www.hondb.com/?wards)
counter ward spots (http://www.hondb.com/?wards2)

[Avi1231]

Not bad Drasha, but it's still missing some of the really great wards that people don't know about. I mentioned a couple of them a bit further up this page.

[izzmad]

you missed out some. 1) legion ancient camp (which shows camp, river and also top rune), and 2) river on hellbourne side left next to kongor. shows bot rune, river and partly legion shore. 3) hellbourne woods between middle camps (closest to runespot top and the one next to it), makes both of them visible. 4) on LEFT hill of hellbourne toprune.. makes toprune visible + up to 3 camps + river, if you kill 2,3 trees .

[HauZa]

Chose the upper left tree on the Legion side of the river.
You will be able to see the rune when Keepers ability is lvl 3.

[wala]

can elec eye of scout be place in higher grounds like the legion or hellbourne platue...f so can u show me how??

..........and yes im a noob..

Keep spamming it on the edge until it gets placed.

[KADOONK]

very nice, these guides are the ones needed for the new players... so they can actually gank and not be sitting ducks waiting for the gankers to kill them

10/10

[Angor]

I've been looking for something like this, thanks!

[Foo]

http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/7431/goodwardspot.th.jpg (http://img215.imageshack.us/i/goodwardspot.jpg/)



These are very good spots early game as either one of them give sight up the mid ramp and sight of the top rune. These need to be used more often as i find I'm the only ones who uses them in game for some reason.

[Mikstrup]

I think you need a few considerable spots, mind if I chime in with them and some pictures at some point when I have time? :)

[sog]

you missed that plateau in the top river

[plaq]

hey there!

two things bother me lately ward related:


placement on the pillar south of the legion secret shop is really tricky. sight from wards there vary from 360? all around view to very limited angles, I'd love to see some kind of visual guide on the placement there. replay 1640860 at 45:50 shows the best case scenario.
tournament casts often show a very popular ward to block the hellborn pullspot top, it is placed at the cliff near the river and provides some view over that entrance. im having trouble with that ward, everytime i try it the spawn is not blocked.

any insight?

[Chaosje]

these ward guides were also alrdy present in the Dota age,

I was wondering, do you have a guide for the smaller map too ? darkwood vale map?

thx in advance

[wYnDoN]

You could also cover lane warding.
As in, placing a rune behind the enemy towers on both side lanes, if your team is going to push (when playing hellbourne, placing a ward in front of the top tower is also very useful, because it shows tp-ganks - same goes for playing legion and the bottom lane).

[`Static]

I'm looking for soe pictures on the best spots for Top Lane Hellbourne creep pull spot. I hear there is a spot in the trees that blocks but also grants partial vision? (ie not just setting it in the center of the spawn to get countered)

[xiME_`]

S2 staff posting ward spots = godly
you are now my favorite.

[Daft]

Anyone else having trouble seeing the pics?

(tried chrome and ie.. got nothing...) :(

[Nyeron]

Nice guide but it needs to be updated,

Bound Eye, Scout Ward, Tree Ward, All See WOS now.
Also there are many other great spots left out. But that should be for the user to find out.

[wala]

Going to try to list all the ward placements I can think of.

Edge means on THAT level, just near where levels change. (cliffs/ramps)

Top rune:
1) Hellbourne highest cliff, at the east/southeast edge. Sees the rune and path between two hellbourne neutral camps.
2) Hellbourne 'middle' cliff, one of the most common ward spots. Variation can be made to block the neutral camp. Sees the rune, a bit of the neutral camp and the river area.
3) Legion highest cliff, sees the rune and a big area surrounding it, including the two legion ramps.
4) Hellbourne mid-top rune ramp, near the southwest edge. Sees the rune and mid west mid area on hellbourne. Situational.
5) Legion ancients, must be at the northeast edge, sees legion ancients and rune, and west mid area on legion.

Bottom rune:
1) Hellbourne mid-bot rune ramp, sees the rune and surrounding area, DOES see entrance to kongor.
2) Hellbourne ancients cliff, I think this is the worst ward of the bot rune ones, but it DOES see entrance to Kongor.
3) Legion cliff (east one), most common ward spot for bot rune, right above the medium legion camp. Sees the river path from bottom to bot rune, may (does?) NOT see Kongor entrance.
4) Legion cliff (west one), sees the rune AND the west path that leads to easy camp. Very useful as this + vision of hellbourne's bot tower means your jungle is very safe. Does NOT see Kongor entrance. Most likely to have a blind spot in hellbourne mid ramp and river area.
5) Legion ledge near river. This is mostly used in competitive matches due do the reason that #4 legion bot rune ward gets counterwarded along with #3 by placing near the legion bot rune ramp. It's located a bit left from the two trees near legion bot rune ramp, and sees the rune along with mid hellbourne ramp. I only used this ward placement once, but I think it does see Kongor Entrance as well hellbourne mid.

Wards can be placed behind and in front of tier 1 side towers for tps and ganks. Examples are: running a trilane top as legion with swiftblade, glacius and andromeda. You put a ward behind hellbourne top tower, gain vision of the hellbourne hero running with the creeps, and get first blood. Of course, when pushing and/or planning to gank, this ward becomes useful.

Wards in FRONT of a tower can be useful for the same purpose, but it also sees the river path AND one of the entrances to each side jungle.

Wards to block pull camps are straightforward - I haven't had much experience but I just put it in the creep spawn usually or if I suspect counterwards (ie scout) then I place it in the trees near the camp. It should be noted that people try to counterward still with a winged courier, as it gives vision and ward of revelation's revealing range is clearsight (not obstructed by anything).

However, there is one notable pull ward that I know, and that is at the ledge behind woods in hellbourne creep camp. This ward, above the ramp leading from river to hellbourne's hard camp, allows the legion players to see the ramp and the hellbourne hard camp, as well as block the pull camp. It should be noted that it has a blindspot from the pullcamp to the 'intersection' where that one lone tree stands.

Wards in mid gives vision - nothing more.

Wards in Kongor I have only seen once.

Other wards:
Hellbourne:
plateau above right hard neutral
around the tomb-thing above ramp from mid
above ramp from middle medium neutral west of easy camp (useful, but limited)
small plateau above hellbourne bot tier 2 tower
above ramp leading to secret shop from mid tower
above ramp from ancients to secret shop (very very rare, and not that useful)

Legion:
around bottom of middle neutral camp (hard one). Variations for seeing the top area or bottom area (basically sight to the top east neutral or bottom east neutral)
plateau near legion west hard camp
plateau near top tier 2 legion tower (rarely used)
above ramp from mid lane to secret shop/ancients/top tier 2 tower. I haven't experimented with this enough.

Also, when pushing into enemy base (final towers/raxes) you can put a ward above ledge between towers to gather information. This is fairly common.
Once tier 3 towers are killed, somtimes wards are placed around the raxes.

When you counterward rune wards, put it between common ward spots to possibly counterward 2+ ward places. HOWEVER, you may need to have blink, etc to provide vision to the highest cliffs, if which you may not have, then you must counterward up there. So if you were counterwarding top rune, I would place the ward in the river near the left legion ramp to see possible wards (aforementioned #2 and #3) IF I have vision of both cliffs. Slither wards are very useful for counterwarding for this purpose.

One of the reason to ward constantly that people forget is to counterward efficiently. By having a ward at bot rune #4 one, you have vision to 4 bottom rune locations, making counterwarding extremely easy and cost efficient, as well as having general safety when doing so. Also, you can 'deduce' where wards are by monitoring enemy hero movements, etc.

Know that when warding/counterwarding, the hero makes a noticeble movement, which can lead to easy counterwarding. And it costs 5 mana.
Going to try to list all the ward placements I can think of.

Edge means on THAT level, just near where levels change. (cliffs/ramps)

Top rune:
1) Hellbourne highest cliff, at the east/southeast edge. Sees the rune and path between two hellbourne neutral camps.
2) Hellbourne 'middle' cliff, one of the most common ward spots. Variation can be made to block the neutral camp. Sees the rune, a bit of the neutral camp and the river area.
3) Legion highest cliff, sees the rune and a big area surrounding it, including the two legion ramps.
4) Hellbourne mid-top rune ramp, near the southwest edge. Sees the rune and mid west mid area on hellbourne. Situational.
5) Legion ancients, must be at the northeast edge, sees legion ancients and rune, and west mid area on legion.

Bottom rune:
1) Hellbourne mid-bot rune ramp, sees the rune and surrounding area, DOES see entrance to kongor.
2) Hellbourne ancients cliff, I think this is the worst ward of the bot rune ones, but it DOES see entrance to Kongor.
3) Legion cliff (east one), most common ward spot for bot rune, right above the medium legion camp. Sees the river path from bottom to bot rune, may (does?) NOT see Kongor entrance.
4) Legion cliff (west one), sees the rune AND the west path that leads to easy camp. Very useful as this + vision of hellbourne's bot tower means your jungle is very safe. Does NOT see Kongor entrance. Most likely to have a blind spot in hellbourne mid ramp and river area.
5) Legion ledge near river. This is mostly used in competitive matches due do the reason that #4 legion bot rune ward gets counterwarded along with #3 by placing near the legion bot rune ramp. It's located a bit left from the two trees near legion bot rune ramp, and sees the rune along with mid hellbourne ramp. I only used this ward placement once, but I think it does see Kongor Entrance as well hellbourne mid.

Wards can be placed behind and in front of tier 1 side towers for tps and ganks. Examples are: running a trilane top as legion with swiftblade, glacius and andromeda. You put a ward behind hellbourne top tower, gain vision of the hellbourne hero running with the creeps, and get first blood. Of course, when pushing and/or planning to gank, this ward becomes useful.

Wards in FRONT of a tower can be useful for the same purpose, but it also sees the river path AND one of the entrances to each side jungle.

Wards to block pull camps are straightforward - I haven't had much experience but I just put it in the creep spawn usually or if I suspect counterwards (ie scout) then I place it in the trees near the camp. It should be noted that people try to counterward still with a winged courier, as it gives vision and ward of revelation's revealing range is clearsight (not obstructed by anything).

However, there is one notable pull ward that I know, and that is at the ledge behind woods in hellbourne creep camp. This ward, above the ramp leading from river to hellbourne's hard camp, allows the legion players to see the ramp and the hellbourne hard camp, as well as block the pull camp. It should be noted that it has a blindspot from the pullcamp to the 'intersection' where that one lone tree stands.

Wards in mid gives vision - nothing more.

Wards in Kongor I have only seen once.

Other wards:
Hellbourne:
plateau above right hard neutral
around the tomb-thing above ramp from mid
above ramp from middle medium neutral west of easy camp (useful, but limited)
small plateau above hellbourne bot tier 2 tower
above ramp leading to secret shop from mid tower
above ramp from ancients to secret shop (very very rare, and not that useful)

Legion:
around bottom of middle neutral camp (hard one). Variations for seeing the top area or bottom area (basically sight to the top east neutral or bottom east neutral)
plateau near legion west hard camp
plateau near top tier 2 legion tower (rarely used)
above ramp from mid lane to secret shop/ancients/top tier 2 tower. I haven't experimented with this enough.

Also, when pushing into enemy base (final towers/raxes) you can put a ward above ledge between towers to gather information. This is fairly common.
Once tier 3 towers are killed, somtimes wards are placed around the raxes.

When you counterward rune wards, put it between common ward spots to possibly counterward 2+ ward places. HOWEVER, you may need to have blink, etc to provide vision to the highest cliffs, if which you may not have, then you must counterward up there. So if you were counterwarding top rune, I would place the ward in the river near the left legion ramp to see possible wards (aforementioned #2 and #3) IF I have vision of both cliffs. Slither wards are very useful for counterwarding for this purpose.

One of the reason to ward constantly that people forget is to counterward efficiently. By having a ward at bot rune #4 one, you have vision to 4 bottom rune locations, making counterwarding extremely easy and cost efficient, as well as having general safety when doing so. Also, you can 'deduce' where wards are by monitoring enemy hero movements, etc.

Know that when warding/counterwarding, the hero makes a noticeble movement, which can lead to easy counterwarding. And it costs 5 mana.

[Naxemal]

If you could find time to make screenshots of those spots, that would be excellent.

[DeBaron]

This allows for complete avoidance of enemy teleport ganks, high ground surprises, and missed denies.



Doubt it, that's just the hilladvantage the other player will have

[Drasha]

retired in place of http://forums.heroesofnewerth.com/showthread.php?p=12331508

[Drasha]

moved back to premium because photo bucket sucks!

[Azura]

The neutral creep block is not a good example of a good placement

The best placement would be just to place it outside the neutral camp where it just reveals the creeps so they don't spawn. This is so that you can see the path of the neutral creep and block at the same time