Emerald Sceptre (Make use of Void Talisman!)

[Nome]

http://i35.tinypic.com/172r06.jpg Nome's Wisdom (2300)
http://i38.tinypic.com/nnml3n.jpg Void Talisman (1500)
http://i38.tinypic.com/ofvxad.jpg Recipe (1200)
=
http://i49.tinypic.com/2nghpnp.png Emerald Sceptre (5000)



+23 INT
+13 STR/AGI
+10 damage
+100% mana regen
Nome's Superior Wisdom Aura (Passive)

+4 armor
+3 mana/s
25% of mana used converted to HP


Emerald Rift (Active)

Physical immunity
Disarmed
All spells have 50% mana cost
100% of mana used converted to HP (does not stack with aura gain)
25 cooldown, 4 duration



Recipe Benefits


Superior aura
Emerald Rift

Utility
The ultimate intel survivalist item. Emerald Rift allows for high mana cost heroes to get insane heals while using their spells. A 600 mana spell would cost 300 mana (50%), and would equate to a 300 HP heal if Emerald Rift is activated.

Balance
High gold cost and unconventional items make this useful largely for fighting late game carries. Makes use of the underused Void Talisman and also buffs Nome's Wisdom by giving it a powerful late-game upgrade. Shares a cooldown with Void Talisman.

[Vanarchy]

Pure awesomeness! :)

P.S. Does activation lowers bearer's magic armor by 6.9?

[Nome]

Pure awesomeness! :)

P.S. Does activation lowers bearer's magic armor by 6.9?

Nope. The current Void Talisman doesn't, so this does not either.

[Vanarchy]

Well, I am 110% sure that we will see this ingame soon :P

P.S. The 100% mana -> health conversion affects only the bearer for the duration? Bearer won't get 135% total from aura + this effect, it will be just set to 100% for him for 4 seconds, right?

[Nome]

It only affects bearer, and yes, he gets 100% total.

[ouTPut`]

Really like the concept of the item Nome.

It gives great survivability to casters, but very unesseccary stats along with it. Void Talisman is very good as it is. 4 seconds of complete psycical immunity is more than enough to avoid casters/fragile heroes of getting harmed.

Also this will cause Lion to massively own every single thing in the game, making him more imba than he is.

I'll hold the vote, as I like the idea a lot, but the stats are too wicked, and some of the bonus are OP aswell.

[Skyve]

I don't like that you lose the +75% mana regen and the +21 damage from the original item.
The bonus cast speed might be unnecessary as this is supposed to be a survivability item.

Apart from that I like it.

[Vanarchy]

I don't like that you lose the +75% mana regen and the +21 damage from the original item.

Well 2 mana/sec aura is a good source by itself. About damage - well, mb it should be added, but this item gives many costant bonuses already - improved Attack Speed bonus makes up for lost damage IMO.


The bonus cast speed might be unnecessary as this is supposed to be a survivability item.

This is not just a survivability item. 100% of spent mana are healing you during this 4 seconds, so you will spam spells during it. Additional cast speed lets you do it faster, this is a straight synergy.

[ouTPut`]

This is not just a survivability item. 100% of spent mana are healing you during this 4 seconds, so you will spam spells during it. Additional cast speed lets you do it faster, this is a straight synergy.




Utility
The ultimate intel survivalist item



Yes, it is a survivability item. Please stop answering questions to Nome's Item if you have no clue at all what the hell your talking about.

Kiss mods ass less, thank you.

[Skyve]

This is not just a survivability item. 100% of spent mana are healing you during this 4 seconds, so you will spam spells during it. Additional cast speed lets you do it faster, this is a straight synergy.

But even if a hero has 4 active skills 4 seconds will always be enough to use all his skills. Cast Speed just doesn't seem that great imo.

[LindsayLoha1]

makes a alright item useful now nice job

[sieneh]

Hm, this seems pretty good, though if it becomes too powerful, would you consider changing the benefit from 100% to 60-75%?

In any case thumbs up.

[Skyve]

Hm, this seems pretty good, though if it becomes too powerful, would you consider changing the benefit from 100% to 60-75%?

In any case thumbs up.

Hm... with 100% heal per manacost Pyro could heal himself for ~800 health. That's quite a bit.

[sieneh]

Hm... with 100% heal per manacost Pyro could heal himself for ~800 health. That's quite a bit.

Thats exactly why I asked.
Hell, even 50% of that could be pretty powerful.

[Nome]

I don't like that you lose the +75% mana regen and the +21 damage from the original item.
The bonus cast speed might be unnecessary as this is supposed to be a survivability item.

Apart from that I like it.

My mistake--forgot to add it.


Hm... with 100% heal per manacost Pyro could heal himself for ~800 health. That's quite a bit.

This is only a concern in non-competitive games though. In competitive games, heroes like Pyro and Witch Slayer always use their ults at the beginning of a fight in order to take an opposing hero (usually the carry) out of the equation right away. Nevertheless, I will consider nerfing it.

Winner.

Seconded to lowering % on active ability though. That or make the skills cost 10% less mana while keeping it 100%. It still lowers healing as planned, but costs less mana.

Edit: Alright, cool, you understood through my typo

[Nome]

Winner.

Seconded to lowering % on active ability though. That or make the skills cost 10% less mana while keeping it 100%. It still lowers output damage as planned, but costs less mana.

Amazing idea! Thanks :)

[Isin]

Haha, another epic item. I love this one though.

To prevent any errors: You may want to reword "100% of mana used converted to HP" to "+65% additional mana used converted to HP" or something like that, because, reading it as is, makes me want to think that you'd have ((1.35*mana cost)*.75) used goes to HP.

1.35*100=135
135*.75=102.75
102.75>100. This is healing the user for more than 75%, let alone more than 100%, of their spell's mana cost.

Theoretically, as I do this equation for this post, I expect my result to be 75.
1.0*100=100
100*.75=75
75<100. This is 75% of mana used.
My theory is proven correct.

You may want to consider rewriting from 100 to an additional 65 to avoid people who think this before scrolling down and click "no for overpowered", despite voting on concept.

[J3T_Tlag]

lol at the passive cast speed bonus idea

great idea, though the superior aura isn't superior enough, especially for a 1k recipe cost, maybe increase armor bonus by 1 or 2 and HP gain on spellcast by 5% (40%).

also, curious if it will not share a cooldown with Void Talisman, since it seems 8 seconds of physical immunity but your spells are spammable within those 8 seconds seem... ouch... I can imagine Armadon abusing it well, charge in a tower or fountain, keep spraying and spraying :D

[Nome]

Nerfed aura HP gain to 25%. Buffed mana/s to 3/s.
Cooldown shared with Void Talisman.

[Nome]

Justicebamp

[Mittsies]

This is an absolutely awesome idea. I've been looking for reasons to get Void Talisman on certain heroes, and it seems like Support roles are the only viable choices. This would be an incredible item to get on heroes like Nymphora, Witch Slayer, Pyromancer, Wretched Hag, etc. as it will allow you to quickly recover from getting focused by the enemy team simply by using your abilities and continue supporting your team.

T-UP

[Medieve]

Oh man, I'd hate to have Nome get two items into the game in a row but this is actually a pretty good item.

[MsPudding]

Oh man, I'd hate to have Nome get two items into the game in a row but this is actually a pretty good item.

Of course it is =)... You should get his wisdom by the way, it'll make you a better player or so I've heard.

[Godmode_]

Oh my ******* god.
Best idea i have seen last time :]
Add THIS ****.
Just if its balanced finally. But for real balance u have to add

[Debbye]

Yes,I like the idea, although it seems just a little bit overpowered.Make the recipe more expensive, and 100% of mana used converted to HP seems too much.

Nonetheless,the idea is great, the item looks nice,and it would be quite useful for most casters.

-> move to popular suggestions IMO.

[Gorb]

I'm seriously trying to come up with a well-thought post, but my brain is defaulting to "omg want".

Good work on the recipe, Nome :)

[flibble]

By far the best suggestion so far

I WANTS

I'm seriously trying to come up with a well-thought post, but my brain is defaulting to "omg want".

Good work on the recipe, Nome :)

Well, the thing is.. is that if something's already well written and has no errors, why would someone post about changes? ;)

This is where things orientate to BUMPS and "good idea" posts until it becomes approved and implemented.

I've only read one post that still disagrees with the concept, and the other two have either not stated why, or has been fixed into the item.

[magojun]

Well just a simple though... why not making the +cast time in the aura... if it's overpower then make it like Daemonic.... something like +10% cast speed and another +10% in the aura.

Good Item, Nice idea.:)

and Nome is there any plan of implementing Tinker or Meepo soon? especially the meepo with your upgrades... i'm the 1st fan of meepo and i just loved your ideas.

:cool:

[NarAyaN`]

Remake Nome's Wisdom (great arcana simply doesn't give any benefits to a support caster who's rushing a Nome's Wisdom, and it costs a lot too...) and then import this =)

[quirknessity]

Just curious. How will this item interact with Harkon's Blade?

[zircon]

This seems extremely overpowered even conceptually... almost no caster would NOT want this item, since it's like a Shrunken Head for physical damage but on an even shorter cooldown and with way, WAY more utility. I think removing all the Nome's stuff entirely (sorry!) would make it more viable. Being able to trigger 4 second physical immunity + -25% mana cost every 25 seconds is unbelievable in and of itself, not to mention some decent stats.

[Banned269545]

This is an awesome idea but I think it needs to be balanced. But I like the idea that casters wouldn't have to buy hp items.

[SpEks]

I think the item needs a few tweaks (not sure where, though) but I would really like to see Void Talisman used in something and this gives it a interesting use in a nice survivability item for casters.

[Delvil]

I'm thinking of an item that's better than this one, and will prevent it from being bought by any intelligent intelligence players during late game. Hints:

It costs a total of $5675
It adds to all stats meaning mana, health, armor, the like.
Its active ability is superb control vs. a strong late carry and provides more than just protection from the int hero holding the item, stopping the obvious counter to void stone's effect late game (ignoring the user)

You guessed it... with sheep stick priced at only 675 gold more, nobody in their right mind will be buying this. If the game is late enough that you already have your core, a sheep stick, and you have the option of spending 5,000 gold, the game has progressed far enough that there shouldn't be new items added for your playstyle/game.

This doesn't seem to fill any niche... just more unnecessary junk in the game.

[Banned269545]

Witch slayer already has hex, a lot of ints has some form of disable, the item would be for a 5v5 survival fight where dmg would hit you no matter what and you spam spells constantly to kill your enemies and at the same time you would rejuvenate yourself.

Argument fail
please try again

[Aleste]

This would be overpowered in Pubs, and like it or hate it that is what most of HoN community plays.

You still have time to adjust it.

[Banned269545]

This would be overpowered in Pubs, and like it or hate it that is what most of HoN community plays.

You still have time to adjust it.

The item needs a nerf of course but it's not like INT heroes are going to go out and make this their first item I mean If I play a hero that can boost it's ulti like pyro or witch it's basically the first item I get. After that I start thinking of survivability (getting sheepstick, heart, or whatever..) it would be at this point that people buy the scepter and it would definitely be lategame. Buying it earlygame would not only be stupid as it has a huge cost it would just not give you any more killing power and since INT is at it's peak earlygame you are just screwing yourself over.

A bit of balance and this item would definitely be viable to put in..

[Delvil]

Witch slayer already has hex, a lot of ints has some form of disable, the item would be for a 5v5 survival fight where dmg would hit you no matter what and you spam spells constantly to kill your enemies and at the same time you would rejuvenate yourself.

Argument fail
please try again

Witch slayer with 2 hexes, "a lot of ints" with their disables + an extra hex.

It doesn't matter what your hero does, an extra hex is still an extra disable and can still be gamebreaking. As opposed to what? 4 seconds during which the super scary late game hero (i assume late game, because there is no other reason you would ever spend 5k gold on such a superfluous item) CAN'T kill you physically? Believe it or not, most teams have disable too. What are you going to do during that 4 seconds that is so important that you don't get dps'd down by a physical attacker, one that is most likely (here's the kicker) hexable?

[Banned269545]

If you find the item to be so crappy why do you resist it?

As an int late game in some games you just plain out die even though you can hex, for instance predator jumping you with his iron hide on, 40% slow means you can't run unless you got a port key, if you have a homecoming stone you should be able to draw your emerald scepter and tp home.

Don't know if this works but I see no reason why it wouldn't.

[shen01long]

what do you mean by physical immunity??? invulnerable?

or not immune to spells?

[SinsofSanity]

Physical immunity obviously means that you're immune to physical attacks. That's what it says.













So no, you wouldn't be immune to spells <.<

[DarkBullet]

I hate you Nome, with all of my heart...
You made another good suggestion...
T-Up...

[nszero]

bloody brilliant :). I feel that the intel supports could really use a small item boost for late game and this fills that niche quite well

[TrollPolice]

considering i get both these items in most games i play as support, this would save a slot and make it a bit easier to play :)

[ElementUser]

Omg, no self-Disarm?

So you can attack while being Physically Immune?

No wonder Nome makes items like these. :D :P

[Nome]

Omg, no self-Disarm?

So you can attack while being Physically Immune?

No wonder Nome makes items like these. :D :P

Oh, there is. I just forgot about it.

[FiNGERS]

I like.

[Fol]

it is very powerful item indeed but it costs 5000 gold so it balance it out

the only thing that is left undecided is , do we really want to make casters that in
there essence should be fragile due to there long disable and quick damage abilities
so strong

lets take an example

Chronos jumps on Pyro and uses Chronoshpere takes him down from 2000 to 600 while he got 1800 ,
in a normal game pyro would have to stun and spam all his skill and run for it until cd is done and then fight back
but with this item you can bring your hp from 600 to 1600 and in the process leave Chronos with 500 hp which leaves him
with no chance to fight back

i really like the item REALLY like it !
but i dont think its what the game needs int heroes got more the enough survival items

you can heal 3000 hp with this item in late game with refresh orb and have it ready again
i dont think casters can have that much powered when a caster can rape a agi hero
then there is something wrong with the game and with this item i really see that
happens

so with many sorrys i will have say no on this one

but good luck i really like your ideas

[whistle]

It's like the caster version of lifesteal lol

love it 100%

[TheWh0]

I like the idea of putting Void Talisman into a recipe that is extremely useful.
T-UP!

[balsafresh]

Yesss give void talisman some love

[Stagmo]

t-freakin-up. finally a good suggestion for void talisman that fits well with the game!

[Thysios]

wow, I've always liked Nomes wisdom and thought void talisman should be used in an item. This does that and makes Nomes even better.

Its like giving me what I wanted before I really new exactly what I wanted :D

[BMC`]

I will hold my vote for a while ;D I just think it's a little imba to have a 100% of mana cost to heal you... Soul Reaper will own big time with this ;D

[War_Mech]

Nice, either this or that other item that increases spell damage would be a nice void talisman upgrade (or both!).

[Slardar]

seems reasonable to be able to allow intel to be useful late game which is something not seen in Dota/Hon so far

[GODLY]

Badass.

[Svendetta]

Great item. Needs to keep the damage as well.

[Instop]

I wish it will be added!

[jykke]

Im not sure if this is a good idea, end game carries should be good in the end game. That's why you should not let them farm.

[dandylion]

Thoroughly useful item. Amazing for int survivability. Nothing more to say, it's just too legit for words.

[Ajhacket]

Great item for low hp casters that get focused fired by the oposite team's high physical dps carries.

Secondly the cast speed is actually nice as it removes some of the void between casting again and wandering around like a useless idiot auto attacking as an intel caster.

Great concept although 8 second duration is a little over kill maybe 6 would be a better choice.

The cooldown should also be increased slightly IMO.

[pakoito]

Renders Nullsone useless plus it has a cheaper easier buildup. (Love it)

[Xozzen]

love the icon, t-up

[Nome]

Dual nerf/buff to 50% mana cost (and thus 50% heal).

[Amour]

Love this idea.

[Megha]

If I may..

damn S2 should just hire Nome to create concepts such as that they are good.

and its true. Item is a great idea. :)

[Duey]

Nome did make it so ill be expecting it implemented soon :P

[Tupimus]

This is win. Want!

(And not only because I end up buying Void Talisman at least every other game because of the imba carries.)

[OhBob]

T-Up, but you must think over and over again if this should decrease mana cost, heal when casting or a small piece of both. It is really good the way it is, but thinking is never a bad thing.

But it really needs to share cooldown with Void.

By the way, once you seem to be the only one with a chance to put your ideas inside the game, I wish you could see my hero suggestion =o, some support would be nice.

[OhBob]

Im not sure if this is a good idea, end game carries should be good in the end game. That's why you should not let them farm.

You can still buy void talisman. Physical immunity duration remains the same, if you don't buy Void Talisman, I'm sorry for you.

[ma5]

There's a reason this fails...

if this is meant to be a core survivability item on casters then you would think multiple heroes on a team might want to go this. But since the aura won't stack, you have to burn 2500 gold for nothing if someone else already has it on your team.

[OhBob]

So this fails...Because everyone wants to buy it? Your post fails =s

That's why people should communicate, something like "hey, I'm getting sceptre, allright?" "Ok, I won't make one for me then."

This might happens ocasionally.

[ma5]

So this fails...Because everyone wants to buy it? Your post fails =s

That's why people should communicate, something like "hey, I'm getting sceptre, allright?" "Ok, I won't make one for me then."

This might happens ocasionally.
The ultimate intel survivalist item.

Single effect survival items don't have team effects, so multiple heroes can get them.

That 2500 wasted gold is better off going towards a sheep.

[Owlbi]

I think it's a good idea to add a few more late-game options for casters and this is a decent one. The only thing I don't agree with is the 50% mana cost reduction, it comes out of nowhere and seems a bit counter-intuitive; like you're slapping on extra utility just to make it seem cooler, or because other people have proposed cool items that reduce mana cost. I would ditch that and make the heal a straight 50% of mana cost, same amount healed but the full mana cost of the ability spent. Late game when this becomes feasible mana isn't that much of a problem anwyay. The recipe cost is still justified because of the inventory space saved late game when it begins to really matter.

[sal]

I'm all for giving int heroes something for late game, but this is too strong for certain heroes - and these are heroes that really don't need the help.

Ex: Soul Reaper. Already incredible in the late game, he'll be waltzing around with +23 int and +13 str (and agi!), and 4 seconds of physical invulnerability in which he has enough time to heal himself for 93 + 130 (judgment) + 250 (execute) = 473. This doesn't even mention the armor and mana regen, either, or the fact that he just spent half mana to do all of that.

The biggest problem with this, that I see, is that the 25s cd means you'll be able to use the active during most of your casts - this effectively doubles your mana pool. The item already has fantastic stats, too. You can't go back to 100% healing, though, as you're looking at some ridiculously overpowered healing on nearly any int hero. You've got three options if you want to keep it roughly the way it is:

1) Go with the above poster and return the mana cost to 100% but reduce the healing to 50%

This is almost a necessity regardless. Mana is not an issue for int heroes in the late game, and it makes the item too powerful in the early game.

2) Add a significant mana cost (150ish) to the active

If you have any kind of bonus healing during the active, I believe this is necessary.

3) My preferred solution: remove the bonus healing and mana cost reduction during the active, but boost the passive aura to 35%

This transforms the item into less of a selfish survivability acquisition, and into an even better support item, while also providing excellent stats and aids survivability issues. The aura is already amazing with the additional 2 m/s over normal Nome's - this just makes it even more so.

[Destoryer]

i think this item is little OP for some heroes, but like the concept =)

[RhinoTime]

pure awsome

[PunchinKirby]

awesome item, i would SO totally get it on witch, nymph or demented after i have my core support build

[Okuu]

100% support the idea, like the item will support my team in some weeks

[Benregelt]

Does the item also reduce the mana cost of other items (during the effect)?
Because for Tempest or Hellbringer it would be pure awesomeness if the Refresher activation costs half the mana, especially as Hellbringer where a ult costs 500 i think, or as a Polly where a lvl3 staff boosted ult costs 600.
Another point would be an ultimate like Torturer, does the 50% mana reduce count on this one too, if yes :activated in or before the effect?

If this has been asked before im sry, didnt have time to read all the posts.

[EustaceBagge]

The mana reduction factor should be removed, 50% reduced mana costs = less healing benefits, you're better off just making it so when Activated, it grants you 50% of mana converted -> hp, and increases cast speed by 50 or something. Would be a great counter against Carries eating you up. War Beast is chasing you in his ulti, use this item and unleash all of your spells almost instantly, restoring a lot of hp and easily killing/getting away. In it's current form, it gains too many benefits imo. The 4 second duration is perfectly balanced, not too long, not too short.


Just my idea, take it anyway you please:



Emerald Rift (Active)

Physical immunity
Disarmed
50% of mana used converted to HP (does not stack with aura gain)
+50 Cast Speed
25 cooldown, 4 duration
Just a suggestion, 50% mana reduction should be removed if anything. Hardly synergizes and is extremely OP IMO. No need for mana gear anymore with that reduction. OR atleast lower it to like 25%.

[Xarix50]

Spells sould cost 100% in your active.

[Melto]

+1 ! Add It !!!

[vikhik]

Please for the love of everything worth loving put this in the game already.

I <3 nomes, and on occasion I use void... but seriously, void is less used than doom bringer? Bring up this awesome item into the limelight S2!

[Otolia]

Why only the mighty Nome has such great ideas !
That's unfair !

" Si j'avais su, j'aurais pas venu " <- not translatable !

Otherwise very good suggestion, AGREED !

[Indie]

This needs to be implemented soon.

[Porpoise_God]

Now that Nome's is no longer crazy imba (it's gone from crap to imba to crap to more or less balanced in the time since this thread was started), this would be interesting to see. Two underused items into one late game lolstick.

[Lagoondragon]

Shouldnt it be 200% of mana used as it passively reduces cost by 50%.
As 100% of mana used would still be only 50% heal of basic cost.

[Electroid]

Really like the concept of the item Nome.

It gives great survivability to casters, but very unesseccary stats along with it. Void Talisman is very good as it is. 4 seconds of complete psycical immunity is more than enough to avoid casters/fragile heroes of getting harmed.

Also this will cause Lion to massively own every single thing in the game, making him more imba than he is.

I'll hold the vote, as I like the idea a lot, but the stats are too wicked, and some of the bonus are OP aswell.

for an item that costs 5k? no thx. I think that this will be amazing. anyways the components should add up to and go beyond what that original stats were, if it didn't why combine them?

[Milkshake_]

Honestly, a really good concept. Something for quick regen late game for support/non-dps heroes. A good opposite of Satanic (or w/e HoN calls it).

[KalurO]

All spells have 50% mana cost
100% of mana used converted to HP (does not stack with aura gain)

Wouldn't this be considered anti-synergy?
You are healed for 100% of mana used, yet.. you're going to end up using 50% less mana. So you're effectively healed for only half of what you would have without the 50% manacost attribute.

[bakaxy]

Wouldn't this be considered anti-synergy?
You are healed for 100% of mana used, yet.. you're going to end up using 50% less mana. So you're effectively healed for only half of what you would have without the 50% manacost attribute.

Anti-synergy?

It's a balancing component so you don't have heals of 600hp with ultimates...

[KalurO]

Anti-synergy?

It's a balancing component so you don't have heals of 600hp with ultimates...

You seem to forget ultimates are situational and cannot be spammed.

[GauntElakor]

Still, if you read and understand the OP you will see that it is supposed to be that way.
If you want reasons play some random int hero and use every spell at activation... You start with 200ish HP and end with 800ish hp. and thats only during the 4 sec activation. Now you must think about the 35% without activation. Its slightly imba, but also sucks if used wrong. I LOVE IT

[itwasntmeo_O]

Nome, I think this item has excellent potential, but is overpowered as stated.

Instead of having 50% mana cost / 100% heal rate, swap it to normal mana cost and 50% heal rate with 5 second duration, or 75%/75%. Simply providing a buff to Nome's Wisdom and Void Talismen is strong already. Consider a hero with refresher. This item would make a combo that takes impossible amounts of mana into an easily achievable feat.

For Ex: level 16 Polly with refresher and talismen (10k gold, easily achievable in a standard game via pushes and stacked ancients):
600 mana for wards x2
200 mana for hex x2
170 mana for nuke x2
350 mana for refresher
= 2290 mana
With staff = 1320 with 970 hp healed

The concept is excellent, and I gave you my thumbs-up. The balance just needs a bit of tweaking in a test patch!

[Amgoz1STGS]

Lol @ Nome's Superior Wisdom Aura
Item idea is great, I really hope this gets implemented.