Why short term

[Chickenfoo]

As a player i hate getting short term items. If i buy and item i will use it tell game is over, that is how i play. Ex i play madman alot and i go...

-enhanced matcher
-whispering helm
-Savage mace
-shield braker
-runed axe
-rage symbol
-windbow

is it bad that i play like this? never getting short term(for me that is selling and item)

[Master0Puppe]

So you never get any stat boosters to start with? just farm till you get boots?

[noodle0117]

short term items help you stay alive and get your long term items.
and besides... you have 6 inventory slots. You gotta fill them with something.

[Chickenfoo]

short term items help you stay alive and get your long term items.
and besides... you have 6 inventory slots. You gotta fill them with something.

well the weird thing is i dont... should i get boots + 2x minor totems?

P.S who do you add the picture under your comment?

[kharaa]

if my hero has low health i always go for a fort brac

for the 6str.

it can give you like 160-240 hp

[Kietharr]

I know someone like you. If his team is doing great in their respective lanes and his team outskills the enemy team he generally does fine. If he's put in a poor position he gets ganked over and over and always dies because he has no HP whatsoever.

The game is usually decided before the lategame and those little stat items like bracelets are extremely useful early-mid. Hell, look at what the pros do, they buy 1-3 of them on almost every hero. Also, having empty slots is bad, always have every slot full after early game. If you have no items for them just buy a minor totem or two, 3 stats for 50g and sells back for like 25g, you're only taking a loss of a few gold when you dump them for better items and that extra HP/MP/armor makes a big difference. Hell, if you had an unlimited inventory the most cost effective item in the game is a minor totem. 3 stats for 53g can't be beat. You could get the same STR as a behemoth heart plus 25 agi and 25 int for 1,350g.

[Chickenfoo]

Well what do you guys recommend i get? if you could make a small little list that would be really awsome ^^

[noodle0117]

Highly recommend that you don't get boots first, unless you're playing swiftblade.
Unless you plan to hang around the back where its safe, but don't get much gold or experience, you should at least get a runes of the blight or health potion so that you can heal from enemy attacks.
Stats early game can make a big difference.
Most agility characters can gain about an extra 25% hp and hp regen with the right items.
Strength characters can throw in an extra spell or two if you get them enough intellect.
Intellect characters get a little of each, not to mention that they can hit harder with extra early game stats.
I'm not a pro or anything, so it's usually better to look at one of those hero guides to decide what to get.

P.S the pic under my comment is my signature. You can make your own by going to this site.
http://forums.heroesofnewerth.com/profile.php?do=editsignature

[tonybus]

For a new player i strongly recommend this initial item build for nearly every hero, no matter what lane or if you are str, agi, or int:

2 crushing claws
2 runes of blight
1 Minor totem

trust me.

[DenyTheTruth]

For a new player i strongly recommend this initial item build for nearly every hero, no matter what lane or if you are str, agi, or int:

2 crushing claws
2 runes of blight
1 Minor totem

trust me.

I see why you've selected this and other people might be able to tell as well, but for the new people, explain why this is a good selection.

Also: pretenders crowns > crushing claws.

[Ubuntu]

I usually just get 5 minor totems and 3 hp pots as my starting items, no matter what character i'm on. Late game/mid i use minor totems to fill empty inventory slots. They are an amazing deal.

[Mordiggian]

I generally get 2 Blight stacks, 2 Mana pots, 1 Health pot, and 3 minor totems.

[NeoKnight]

A lot of times I start with a health bottle and a pair of boots. It usually works well. Gaining back 400 hp when your down to say 59hp helps ALOT in the beginning. Not only does it help you survive an early gank that would normally set you back, but also, it saves you time since you wouldn't have to travel all the way back to continue fighting.

[Pyrate]

runes of blight work better than potions. Not only do you not have to risk going down to low hp to use it for full effect, it isnt cancelled if you get hit. You can also share one or two to an ally if they run out, you cant do that with a potion and still have hp restore for yourself

[tonybus]

alright i will elaborate on my post:

Get:
2 crushing claws
2 runes of blight
1 Minor totem

Why?
two crushing claws will give you the hp necessary to counteract your slow reflexes and will keep you alive the first few levels during lane skirmishes. Get two runes of blight which will keep you from having to go heal at the fountain while getting harassed in lane. You dont need any fancy mana pots as you will probably waste mana in lane anyway. This way you learn quicker to conserve mana and only use it on sure kills.

Interestingly enough, this beginning item build is what you will find a lot of pro HoN players following (basically) too, but replacing the minor totem with a mana pot. But like I said, you should learn to only use mana when necessary and rely on your characters melee or ranged harass to do the majority of damage in lane. The difference between good players and bad players is that good players do not use their mana in lane unless it will quite immediately lead to a kill. Even with thunderbringer, you should use your last hitting skills to get creep kills, denies and occasionally harass the enemy heros, very rarely using your chain lightning.

[crayze]

In the above build you can get a second Minor Totem, so do so. Furthermore, on many heroes Crushing Claws are not as good a deal as you think -- a minor totem gives you +1 all stats for 50 gold while a claw gives you +3 one stat for 150 gold. On heroes that don't intend on making 2 Bracers, it is much more efficient to just get more minor totems.

Furthermore on a lot of agi heroes the base damage is simply too low to creep well with a 40-some damage autoattack. 2 agi boots (later to turn into wraith bands), 2 branches, and 2 tangos is often a good choice for those, or even 1 agi boot + minor totems + tangos.

[Chickenfoo]

I see why you've selected this and other people might be able to tell as well, but for the new people, explain why this is a good selection.

Also: pretenders crowns > crushing claws.

Well, im not that new to the game. I think im just under mid skill, and im just looking for better skill. when i get the money i plan on buying this game. maybe for x-mis. But i want to Thank all of you this help when i get back from school today i plan on trying all of this out.

[Templar42]

Another thing you should try out, OP, is never EVER playing -em ever again. :/

Even if you insist on playing bastardized HoN, small items are essential to success, since if you build straight for power items with an empty inventory in between you're likely to get ganked into oblivion because of your lack of stats.

First, at the start of the game, DO NOT GET BOOTS UNLESS YOU ARE SWIFTBLADE!!! Swiftblade benefits from them because they allow him to stay next to an enemy for the entire duration of his spin, every other hero needs stats and regen FAR more.

For bare-boned basic items, start with 2 pretenders crowns, 2 runes of the blight and a minor totem. That will use up all 603 of your starting gold, but it leaves out mana regen, so change it up if you are playing a spellcaster or mana-dependent strength hero like behemoth.

[Tripwyr]

if my hero has low health i always go for a fort brac

for the 6str.

it can give you like 160-240 hp

114 health. 6 * 19 isn't hard to do.

On another note, short term items are important for most heroes. Never get marchers as your first items when you're starting out.

Get 1x Runes of Blight, 1x Health Potion, 2x Mana Potion, 1x Pretender's Crown, 2x Minor Totem.

OR 2x Pretender's Crown, 2x Runes of Blight, 1x Minor Totem/1x Mana totem.

OR 1x Logger's Hatchet, 1x Iron Buckler, 1x Runes of Blight, then get 2x Duck Boots from the side shop ASAP

There are a lot of starting builds, but they are all extremely important.

[Chickenfoo]

Thanks guys again. I tryed some of these starter guides out! THEY WERE AWSOME! I was mad man my friend succ, At level 2 we both got a kill( one form the two heros in our lane)

P.S it was a noob game so yeh....(also how do you add pics to the signature?)

[Your__Mother]

2 x Pretender's Crowns
2 x Runes of blight
1 x Minor Totem.

It's what I rock nearly all the time, granted I'm not bottling.

[Tripwyr]

P.S it was a noob game so yeh....(also how do you add pics to the signature?)

First go to User CP, found here:

http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l199/Shadowalkerdk/Forumcap.png

Then find the vertical menu bar on the left side of that page. About half way down is "edit signature" click on that.

Once you're there, you can type your image code into the box. Generally the image code is <image location>

The image MUST be located on the internet, you can not host it from your computer. To find the internet location of an image, you can right click on it and click "copy image URL." The URL you just copied is the image location, which you can then put in your signature using the
<image location URL> format.

[Verix]

Hey OP.

I used to not buy ANYTHING, even in league games. I would save my money to buy a lifetube for +4 regen (875g) and it was smooth sailing from there. However, I had to be very careful until I got that money. This is when I played non-nukers.

Then I decided to give stats a try and started getting the items to form a bracer like crushing claws and pretender crown. I tried out runes of blight as well and I loved having a beefier hero but I still preferred lifetube to runes of blight.

One day, I tried getting the 53g item that gives you +1 to all stats. My hero got even stronger for less gold. I was able to buy a courrier every game and do just as well as before (better with the courrier)

Then one fateful day I discovered that I didn't hate consumables. I got my 53g items, some runes of blight, a health potion and couple of mana potions. Let me tell you what happened to my hero... I became a ganking MACHINE. Instead of hanging back and playing safe until I got my life tube, I took advantage of the extra hp I get from my items to stay closer to the line and last hit a lot more often. I started making money from creep hits and getting my lifetube sooner. On top of that, I had the mana and regen to stay in my lane all day long and gank the hell out of the enemy. Suddenly, hero kills were adding up to my early game funds. I didn't need lifetube anymore because I wasn't the one being harassed. My lanemate and I could try to snake a kill in every time the enemy got too close. They started suffering much much more.

Today I can confidently tell you that the gold you lose from the items you resell is worth a creep kill or two. Over time, these items let you get many more creep kills than without. This helps you get to your better items faster, and then again to your core items even faster. It's a snowball effect. Even if you measured just the first 5 minutes of the game, they would pay for themselves plenty of times over. You level up more, you get more kills and you can fight heroes and use spells more often. The benefits are huge. Don't forget that they make you beefier and dissuade your opponents from trying ti kill you. That is one of the many "silent benefits" that this provides.

This is just one of the many revelations Dota/Hon provide. Just wait until you place your first ward in the enemy forest and discover the miracles of what 100g can do silently for 6 minutes.

[Chickenfoo]

Hey OP.

I used to not buy ANYTHING, even in league games. I would save my money to buy a lifetube for +4 regen (875g) and it was smooth sailing from there. However, I had to be very careful until I got that money. This is when I played non-nukers.

Then I decided to give stats a try and started getting the items to form a bracer like crushing claws and pretender crown. I tried out runes of blight as well and I loved having a beefier hero but I still preferred lifetube to runes of blight.

One day, I tried getting the 53g item that gives you +1 to all stats. My hero got even stronger for less gold. I was able to buy a courrier every game and do just as well as before (better with the courrier)

Then one fateful day I discovered that I didn't hate consumables. I got my 53g items, some runes of blight, a health potion and couple of mana potions. Let me tell you what happened to my hero... I became a ganking MACHINE. Instead of hanging back and playing safe until I got my life tube, I took advantage of the extra hp I get from my items to stay closer to the line and last hit a lot more often. I started making money from creep hits and getting my lifetube sooner. On top of that, I had the mana and regen to stay in my lane all day long and gank the hell out of the enemy. Suddenly, hero kills were adding up to my early game funds. I didn't need lifetube anymore because I wasn't the one being harassed. My lanemate and I could try to snake a kill in every time the enemy got too close. They started suffering much much more.

Today I can confidently tell you that the gold you lose from the items you resell is worth a creep kill or two. Over time, these items let you get many more creep kills than without. This helps you get to your better items faster, and then again to your core items even faster. It's a snowball effect. Even if you measured just the first 5 minutes of the game, they would pay for themselves plenty of times over. You level up more, you get more kills and you can fight heroes and use spells more often. The benefits are huge. Don't forget that they make you beefier and dissuade your opponents from trying ti kill you. That is one of the many "silent benefits" that this provides.

This is just one of the many revelations Dota/Hon provide. Just wait until you place your first ward in the enemy forest and discover the miracles of what 100g can do silently for 6 minutes.

Well i play alot of agi heros so what do you recommend i go?

[nakke]

HEALTH early on. myself i love to go with 3x minor totems since its so powerful early game

[Kennedy]

Another thing you should try out, OP, is never EVER playing -em ever again. :/




This.


Also, Swiftblade does better early game without boots. Just have him lane with a stunner - which is what you should be doing anyway.

[SteveNick]

I don't ever buy items that I plan to throw away either, but I still try to spend all my gold on useful early game things.

For example, as Jereziah I will buy the +2 armour ring that goes in the ring of sorcery recipe, an iron shield, 1x runes of blight, 1x mana potion.

175 + 250 + 50 + 90 = 565

This allows for easy upgrade. I get the ring of sorcery as my first item(before even boots), costing 525 + 1000. The +2 armour may not be as worthwhile as some other item, but it's 175 gold towards a ring of sorcery, which Jereziah absolutely needs to be useful to the team or himself. The Iron Shield is always useful, and goes for helm of the black legion if you want to get it, but even if you don't, it's still a good item for 250 gold. Runes of blight and a mana potion are a no brainer.

If you didn't want to get Iron Shield, you could get some of the items for a fortified bracelet. You can never go wrong by buying a foritified braclet on basically any character.

Boots first is generally a bad plan on most characters. The exception is Swiftblade, where you buy boots + runes of blight, or boots + health potion. Swiftblade doesn't have to get boots, but it's OK on him.

Other popular starter items that aren't useless later are things like ring of the teacher, and etc.

I know a lot of good players like spamming minor totems or pretender's crowns or whatever else at the start of the game, but I don't really understand it, nor think that I get the benefit of having slightly higher stats for the first 5 minutes, in exchange for having less gold towards your real items.

[Darkstrand]

As a player i hate getting short term items. If i buy and item i will use it tell game is over, that is how i play. Ex i play madman alot and i go...

-enhanced matcher
-whispering helm
-Savage mace
-shield braker
-runed axe
-rage symbol
-windbow

is it bad that i play like this? never getting short term(for me that is selling and item)

Yeah, it is actually.

With that kind of setup, you only want to be effective lategame, instead of being effective all game.

[Whalecore]

Never leave base with unoccupied inventory spots unless you go for ring of the teacher or other expansive starting item!

Always try to get at least 3 minor totems, they are so cost effective. I used to go 2 crowns, but I realized it was more cost-effective to buy more totems.. you get more stats! Crushing claws are not a good idea, they are not cost effective at all! HoN (like all RTS games) is all about getting the most out of your gold. Don't waste your precious starting-gold on expansive items.

[LightRain]

I know a lot of good players like spamming minor totems or pretender's crowns or whatever else at the start of the game, but I don't really understand it, nor think that I get the benefit of having slightly higher stats for the first 5 minutes, in exchange for having less gold towards your real items.
When you sell the minor totems back, you get 26 gold. (Sometimes you build them into that thing that makes Astrolabe or Barrier Idol, or build them into Power Supply!). 26 gold is less than one last-hit. If the extra damage makes your guy just that bit better at last hitting to get 2 last hits, then 2 minor totems have more than paid for themselves.

[HighlifeTTU]

For the most part, starting items are a better bang for the buck than higher tier items. However, since you have 6 inventory slots, you only get a couple so you have space for your mid to high tier items.

An example:

Minor Totem: 1 AGI, 1 STR, 1 INT for 50GP
That's 16.66 gold per stat

Major Totem: 4 AGI, 4 STR, 4 INT for 540GP
That's 45 gold per stat

Blessed Orb: 10 AGI, 10 STR, 10 INT for 2100GP
That's 70 gold per stat

As you can see, the lower tier item gives the better stats per gold spent. This is the case on most items, and is the reason you always pickup the starting items for a quick and cost effective boost.

[Toryama]

I tend to get one set of blights, courier, 2 sets of minor totems and have some $ left over until I see the enemy heroes in my lane, or mana battery and 1 mana pot. Can't stand playing without courier.

[Kennedy]

For the most part, starting items are a better bang for the buck than higher tier items. However, since you have 6 inventory slots, you only get a couple so you have space for your mid to high tier items.



Wrong.
You should fill all 6 slots before leaving base 95% of the time.

[Fenald]

if my hero has low health i always go for a fort brac

for the 6str.

it can give you like 160-240 hp

I just had to tell you how hard I laughed at this post.

Thanks for that.

[Travakh]

Cheap items are more cost effective but less space effective.

You're not hurting for inventory space early on, but failing to field cost effective early game items will severely hamper your early game activity.

[Drasha]

114 health. 6 * 19 isn't hard to do.

On another note, short term items are important for most heroes. Never get marchers as your first items when you're starting out.

Get 1x Runes of Blight, 1x Health Potion, 2x Mana Potion, 1x Pretender's Crown, 2x Minor Totem.

OR 2x Pretender's Crown, 2x Runes of Blight, 1x Minor Totem/1x Mana totem.

OR 1x Logger's Hatchet, 1x Iron Buckler, 1x Runes of Blight, then get 2x Duck Boots from the side shop ASAP

There are a lot of starting builds, but they are all extremely important.

you don't need to do 6 * 19 just do (6 * 20) -6 much faster way to figure out how much health you will get.

You buy stats items and regen items at the start you do not buy logger's hatchet or the shield. Reason being that you can get these items from the outpost later on in your lane but you can't get stat items or healing items from the out post.

[IshmaelJobic]

Hey so, I usually like to buy a bottle for lane superiority because for some reason any game without a scout (improbable) or one on the opposite team, no one ever checks the rune spots beginning game.

I regularly check the spots every 2 minutes and jump right back into harrassing the hell out of the person laning against me. Though I guess this is because I like playing moon queen.

So the first item I get most definitely is the bottle if I'm going middle. Is this a good choice? I'm kind of a mediocre player and want tips.

[Clavain]

Unless I'm going for something very specific (boots on swiftblade, ect.) I'll go 2x Pretender's Crown, 2x Runes, and 1x Mana pot (or totem).

This way, depending on how the game is going, I can upgrade the Crown's to whatever stat booster I need later on. Especially if i'm playing an Agi hero, I want the option to go with +Str or +Agi once I see how the game is shaping up.

I find this build is pretty balanced, and lets me upgrade how I want later on.

[edit] If i'm soloing mid, I'll almost always get a bottle, so I can farm runes.

[noodle0117]

Hey so, I usually like to buy a bottle for lane superiority because for some reason any game without a scout (improbable) or one on the opposite team, no one ever checks the rune spots beginning game.

I regularly check the spots every 2 minutes and jump right back into harrassing the hell out of the person laning against me. Though I guess this is because I like playing moon queen.

So the first item I get most definitely is the bottle if I'm going middle. Is this a good choice? I'm kind of a mediocre player and want tips.

Against noobs with a scout or keeper of forest on your team, bottle first, maybe...
but in higher tier games, or even just average tier games, bottle first doesn't work very well.
kinda forgot the math for bottle, but you can get the same amount of healing power as a bottle with just 1 health pot and a handful of mana pots, all which cost less than half of what a bottle would cost. And besides, bottle heals become obselete later on.