HoN Werewolf V4 - Game Over

[Vahn]

Werewolf V4 - OT 3.0
This is the day time discussion thread for Werewolf, during the night I will be locking this thread. I'll send a PM reminder to everyone when each day commences.
For all the rules and Information about the game please refer to the sign-up thread (http://forums.heroesofnewerth.com/showthread.php?t=249047)

In this game we are having an open set up which means everyone knows the roles in the game:

Set up
2 Saplings
2 Predators
1 Scout
1 Jeraziah
1 Imp
1 Puppet Master

Current Player List:

Bwomp (Predator) - Lynched during day 2.
Chuth (Predator) - Lynched during day 1.
Javu (Jeraziah)
Naib (Imp)
NomesWisdom (Sapling) - Killed during night 2.
Ryper7 (Scout) - Killed during night 1.
ShadowExile (Sapling)
TheJoo (Puppet Master)


Votes

Key: Player name (Number of votes against player) - List of players who voted.

Remember to highlight your text in Lime when you are making your vote, day time ends when anyone has (N + 1) / 2 votes. N is number of remaining players.
Current votes required to end day: 3

Links

Night 1
Day 1
Night 2
Day 2
Game Over


Attention all players
No editing posts, if you posted any want to add something then double post. If you see spelling mistakes just leave them unless its so bad people won't understand what you said.

Attention dead players and people not participating
Strictly no posting at all, I do not wish for the game to be side tracked like it was several times last game.
Failure to follow will result in me deleting the post. If you continuously ignore this rule you will receive a spamming infraction.

Reminder to moderators
Please do not close/open the thread, post while it is locked or tamper with other players posts.
While in this thread please act as if you do not have moderation access.

[Vahn]

Night 1
This time we are doing a night start, so it is now night time, night will last until all power roles and the hellbourne have deicide on their actions with a maximum of 48 hours.

If you didn't get the PM with your role send me a message and I'll re-send it.

[Vahn]

Day 1
Night 1 has ended and the villagers wake up to find Ryper7 (Scout) died during the night. (Yes, Scout again!)

Time to find and remove these troublesome hellbourne!

Replacement Player
Chuth is replacing Lucian01 as I accidentally had Lucian01 in both games.

[Octavia]

Well this is a much smaller game than usual, so the activity may be smaller. Jeraziah claiming now might be a good idea to give us a leader for today, but it's up to him if he wants to die tonight.

I'll start off the day by voting: Naib.

[ShadowExile]

The scout legend continues.

[ShadowExile]

Time to throw some Burge into the equation.

Pr(ScoutDyingDayOrNight1EverySingleGameOverASpanOf MultipleGames) =

V4 | 1/4 *
V3 assuming Combo 4 | 1/6 (2 scouts) *
V2 | 1/14 *
V1 | 1/10

-----------

= 0.0002976190476190476

And plus many other games hosted by many other people where the same thing happened frequently.

Scout is therefore cursed.

The name "Javu" reminds me of Voodoo, which is an ancient shamanistic tradition that involves controlling one's fate through dolls. Dolls? Puppet master has dolls. Attacking said doll that is bound to said person kills that person. Sounds incredibly similar to Voodoo.

For that reason, I Vote: Javu.

[Chuth]

What the... now I'm not sure if I want a powerrole for HoN mafia :P

Note to legion: if you read that you are a 'sapling', you may be a 'Predator' and hence if lynched will be revealed as an 'imp'.

Also its 6:2 (now 5:2) L:H

[ShadowExile]

if we MYLO this round, and Jeraziah fails to protect during the night, then it is LYLO the next day.

Bloody hell this setup is rough ;( Not much breathing room.

[Octavia]

We have one mislynch

[Javu]

Nomes not dying makes me kinda suspicous.
Also, I can't see how jereziah claiming is a good idea. Even if he is a 'leader' theres 0 information to go off and a claim will just mean he's dead tonight, giving HB an even bigger edge. The only reason he should claim now is if he's going to die

[Octavia]

Jeraziah is really useless with Scout dead anyway. All he's good for is a clear so it's up to him when he wants to be it.

[Naib]

Jeraziah is really useless with Scout dead anyway. All he's good for is a clear so it's up to him when he wants to be it.
Not really. The pool this time is small. If Jera shields someone and when a day comes noone dies Jera can reveal himself AND who he shielded THUS immediately two legions are known.

Jera needs and needs to stay alive.

[TheJoo]

I laughed when I saw scout dead.
I agree that Jere shouldn't reveal himself, since if he does he will just die tomorrow. Atleast he will make some difference with being able to protect people.
Why is it surprising that NomesWisdom is not dead?

[Chuth]

I kind of agree with the suspicions of Roger not being dead overnight - HB would want to kill leaders

Vote Nomes

[Octavia]

Not really. The pool this time is small. If Jera shields someone and when a day comes noone dies Jera can reveal himself AND who he shielded THUS immediately two legions are known.

Jera needs and needs to stay alive.
Hellbourne are allowed to kill nobody, so nobody dying doesn't necessarily prove innocence.

[Octavia]

I kind of agree with the suspicions of Roger not being dead overnight - HB would want to kill leaders

Vote Nomes
Uh.. that's such a poultry argument. If I'm the highest priority target, then Jeraziah was obviously shielding me last night. Hellbourne would know this and not take the risk of trying to kill someone who is likely to be shielded.

[Chuth]

Not really. The pool this time is small. If Jera shields someone and when a day comes noone dies Jera can reveal himself AND who he shielded THUS immediately two legions are known.

Jera needs and needs to stay alive.

Also, HB can simply claim that they shielded the other one (puppet master claims jerry) and then if we lynch the claimer/claimee the turn up as 'legion' etc

[TheJoo]

Exactly what nomes said. That's why i wasn't surprised when nomes was still alive. Any not braindead HB would not go for nomes.

[Javu]

Exactly what nomes said. That's why i wasn't surprised when nomes was still alive. Any not braindead HB would not go for nomes.
Yeah I know just wanted to see if anyone jumped on it, hence the no vote
vote Chuth

[Chuth]

Uh.. that's such a poultry argument. If I'm the highest priority target, then Jeraziah was obviously shielding me last night. Hellbourne would know this and not take the risk of trying to kill someone who is likely to be shielded.

And what if Jeraziah knew what HB knew and decided to protect someone else?

[Javu]

I'm also suspicious of nomes and shadow for being the first ones to post in this thread. Not so much Nomes as he's an active forumer, but I'm not sure about shadow

[TheJoo]

Pretty sure who posts first makes completely no difference.

Where's Bwomp?

[Naib]

And what if Jeraziah knew what HB knew and decided to protect someone else?
and what if jera knew the hb would think he was thinking that so actually shielded.

either way vote: Bwomp

[Javu]

Generally who posts first would make no difference if the game started during the day, but it started at night meaning the first day would only start once all night actions had been completed. If they were HB and just finishing their night kill they would be online at the time of the first day starting. Its a weak argument I agree as it depends on general forum activity and whether vahn was online or not, but with such a short game and lack of information I see no reason to not take it into account

[TheJoo]

I don't think we should vote people off for inactivity in such a small game, unless they really don't post at all for days.

I see what you mean Javu, but i still disagree with trying to vote them off.

For now, Vote:Chuth. As i see it, a hellbourne player would attempt to jump on Nomes any chance he got, seeing as Nomes is highly experienced and possibly Legion's best asset.

[Chuth]

testing

[Chuth]

And I don't think the first poster makes too big a deal. It's probably someone wanting to get the game started.

[Octavia]

I don't think we should vote people off for inactivity in such a small game, unless they really don't post at all for days.

I see what you mean Javu, but i still disagree with trying to vote them off.

For now, Vote:Chuth. As i see it, a hellbourne player would attempt to jump on Nomes any chance he got, seeing as Nomes is highly experienced and possibly Legion's best asset.
On the contrary, a Hellbourne player wouldn't dare attack me during the day because they would surely fail. Still interested in more discussion and pressure votes, but there is a very small quota for the number of votes to end the day so be cautious with yours.

Unvote.

[ShadowExile]

I'm also suspicious of nomes and shadow for being the first ones to post in this thread. Not so much Nomes as he's an active forumer, but I'm not sure about shadow

If you want to know why that is, as far as I'm aware, me and Roger both live in Australia. I was checking out the Wolf V3 when I went back to Forum Games and saw that V4 said it was now Day 1 and it had a post from Roger, so I went in and checked it. I have no idea how you see anything suspicious in this. It's like when you and Ryper post at the same time, oh damn I wonder how that happens, oh wait, you're siblings and probably live in the same house.

[ShadowExile]

Generally who posts first would make no difference if the game started during the day, but it started at night meaning the first day would only start once all night actions had been completed. If they were HB and just finishing their night kill they would be online at the time of the first day starting. Its a weak argument I agree as it depends on general forum activity and whether vahn was online or not, but with such a short game and lack of information I see no reason to not take it into account

Also, just so you know, the time between Roger's and Vahn's posts are about 30 minutes. Unless you are suggesting that he/we purposely waited for 30 minutes before posting in this thread just to avoid your line of thought? But wait, if we realised that you were going to realise it, and therefore should have waited even longer, why didn't we? You DO realise that if everyone eventually stumbles upon this thread, whoever posts first according to your line of reasoning makes them suspicious. Perhaps we just found the thread unlocked and decided to get some good discussion going, like good active players.

Think about your arguments before you say things. By your line of reasoning, if someone had posted first after 2 days of this thread being opened, we should all attack them.

[Octavia]

Vahn extends the night sometimes so that people can't deduce roles by activity.

[Vahn]

Vahn extends the night sometimes so that people can't deduce roles by activity.

This is true :)

[ShadowExile]

This is true :)

That explains a lot :S I was wondering in Game 2 why our night took so long to end when we had all voted.

[Javu]

Also, just so you know, the time between Roger's and Vahn's posts are about 30 minutes. Unless you are suggesting that he/we purposely waited for 30 minutes before posting in this thread just to avoid your line of thought? But wait, if we realised that you were going to realise it, and therefore should have waited even longer, why didn't we? You DO realise that if everyone eventually stumbles upon this thread, whoever posts first according to your line of reasoning makes them suspicious. Perhaps we just found the thread unlocked and decided to get some good discussion going, like good active players.

Think about your arguments before you say things. By your line of reasoning, if someone had posted first after 2 days of this thread being opened, we should all attack them.
I even said myself it wasn't a good argument and nothing to base a vote off. But being such a small game in one mislynch we're down to MYLO/LYLO, and it at least gives us something to go by rather than possibly taking a blind stab in the dark. Don't see why you felt the need to get so defensive :|

[Javu]

Also by the incredible rate this game is chugging along any information seems like good information

[ShadowExile]

I even said myself it wasn't a good argument and nothing to base a vote off. But being such a small game in one mislynch we're down to MYLO/LYLO, and it at least gives us something to go by rather than possibly taking a blind stab in the dark. Don't see why you felt the need to get so defensive :|

I wasn't getting defensive, I was just emphasizing how stupid that is. And yeah, I actually believe the biggest reason why in Setup 2 that Burge correctly identified all the Hellbourne was because 3 of them were extremely active at the same time. So if I was Hellbourne again, do you really think I'd make the same mistake? As I said, it's a stupid argument.

[Bwomp]

ahhhhhh...

so. now im finally here.

i am SO SORRY for my delayed arrival but i had no internet for the last days.

NOW i am reading the previous posts. then i will continue.

for now the only thing i can say is:
"lolz at the scout-curse"

[Bwomp]

okay.
the ONLY powerrole left in the whole game now is jereziah, am i correct?

and right now Legion have a 5 man team and HB are 2.

to ME, my opinion is that
Chuth and Javu/TheJoo might be the two Hellbourne.

Why?
This game started with a night.
This made HB able to discuss their moves during the first day.
The first day in the previous games was very interesting. To me it looks like this game it is completely different since no HB are rushing out there enjoying the fact that the game started and make posts without being able to communicate with their fellows.

If you think of Chuth and Javu/TheJoo as HB it would make sense.

By killing Ryper7 off in the first night they had a safe kill since he wasnt likely protected.

(assuming that Jereziah would either protect himself, or as many ppl suggest: had protected NomesWisdom. The chance that Ryper7 (who has also participated in other Werewolf games already) is Jere. isnt higher then any other player, making him an almost ideal candidate for killing.

By now their tactic seems to be: miscredit one of us (which is Roger in this situation), blaming him HB, because he still lives.
I dont think so. (that the fact that he still lives is any sign for his HB affiliation)

So this day i will vote CHUTH (despite the fact that it is bandwagoning.)

Why have i always posted Javu/TheJoo?
i simply cant decide, but i think that one of them is HB.

[TheJoo]

I just voted Chuth because he was the most suspicious at the time - Javu pointed out his post, and i agreed that it wasn't right - under any circumstance, i find that Nomes would have survived the night. If Nomes is Hellbourne, he would of course survived the night. If he is Legion, he would have still survived the night because of reasons given, even if is Jereziah himself.

i think bandwagoning is the stupidest idea possible in a game like this where if we can only lynch incorrectly twice, so i now change my vote to Bwomp.

[TheJoo]

meant to say even if "he" is Jereziah himself. Whoops.

[Javu]

I wasn't getting defensive, I was just emphasizing how stupid that is. And yeah, I actually believe the biggest reason why in Setup 2 that Burge correctly identified all the Hellbourne was because 3 of them were extremely active at the same time. So if I was Hellbourne again, do you really think I'd make the same mistake? As I said, it's a stupid argument.
That's a pretty pointless WIFOM argument. Considering you were never even voted your trying really hard to defend urself

[Javu]

Bwomp I don't understand your argument, I don't see the part where you pointed out what me or TheJoo did to appear scummy. Also the only time roger was 'mis-credited' was by me to see if anyone would bite on it

[ShadowExile]

That's a pretty pointless WIFOM argument. Considering you were never even voted your trying really hard to defend urself

Wow, are you an idiot? Since when did calling another person's argument stupid equal to myself being defensive? It is not at all the case. If after the 3 or so posts I've made to reinforce to you that your argument is completely ****ing moronic, and you still don't get the fact that pointing out flaws in one's argument != defensive, then you really shouldn't be playing this game.

Regardless, we need to get this going. Random votes is the best way to vote when we have near to no information.

Vote: TheJoo

(Since no-one voted on my Voodoo lynch :P)

[Javu]

This game is basically dead, if your going to random vote you should probably put it on chuth or bwomp considering they have the most votes. In fact vote Bwomp in the interest of keeping this game moving

[Octavia]

Looking more-so at town tells than scum tells is what I'm going for right now. Unfortunately, most people I'm getting mix-reads on.

I think Javu is very likely to be town, because I don't think he'd kill his brother Night 1. His actions all also seem rather pro-town so far.

ShadowExile seems jumpy at being called out for acting defensive. I definitely know myself that I wouldn't react so defensively to any attacks from another person. As Legion, I always maintain the idea that my life is not comparably worth as much as a Hellbourne, and attacking back is always the most applicable option.

Naib is very likely Jeraziah.

Bwomp acts suspicious but his character is similar to that of how he always plays independent of role, so this is mixed as well. Nothing strikes me as too odd with his posts. I would say though that he'd be worth lyncing as he's a rather inactive player.

I feel like Chuth is more scummy than Bwomp however, and I doubt they're both Hellbourne as bussing this early would be a pretty poor move. His reaction to Scout dying was typical of a Hellbourne player, Vote Chuth. The second Hellbourne I believe is either ShadowExile or TheJoo.

TheJoo has not really contributed anything and has only actively lurked agreeing with what other's have said. This is pretty atypical for a Legion player to do as Legion players don't feel as much of a compulsion to talk when they have nothing to say as Hellbourne do.

[ShadowExile]

Meh, I wasn't jumpy, just annoyed, based firstly on prior experiences and secondly on the fact of him repeatedly trying to give an argument that has no meaning in this kind of game, which pissed me off slightly, I don't know why.

Anyway, as per this post,
"This game is basically dead, if your going to random vote you should probably put it on chuth or bwomp considering they have the most votes. In fact vote Bwomp in the interest of keeping this game moving" it's because this is Day 1 and random bandwagoning on someone isn't good. Of all the posts I've seen, I have the feeling that Chuth and TheJoo are most likely to be Hellbourne, but not wanting to vote wrongly and be able to allow a Hellbourne to bandwagon on it and therefore end Day 1 with a Legion down, I wanted to vote off my next suspicious target to not give the chance of a bandwagon. But I don't know whether I should just switch to Chuth if everyone is also getting the same scum tell off of Chuth.

[Bwomp]

a "random" bandwagon would be if i hadnt given any reason for my vote on chuth.
in my eyes my vote is justified and i would had voted him even if there is 0 or just 1 vote on him.

The only "evidence" i had at this time is the dialogue that has was there when i first came.

With the reactions towards my accusation i think i am right about chuth but wrong about Javu.
In my eyes, Chuth's reaction was this old "i vote you because you voted me" behavior.

[Naib]

a "random" bandwagon would be if i hadnt given any reason for my vote on chuth.
in my eyes my vote is justified and i would had voted him even if there is 0 or just 1 vote on him.

The only "evidence" i had at this time is the dialogue that has was there when i first came.

With the reactions towards my accusation i think i am right about chuth but wrong about Javu.
In my eyes, Chuth's reaction was this old "i vote you because you voted me" behavior.

Did Chuth pull the "I vote you because you voted me" ?
Its day1 so all we have to go on is people responses to what is essencially nothing (can't really see any cause&effect yet to people stance)

Reading over the posts to try to gain some feel of what people perceive is going on didn't throw up any such voting style from Chuth, he threw a "I vote nome because it would make sense" & other mechanics stuff

We are going to have to lynch someone or we are staying in day forever (which has its advantages :D)

[Javu]

I'm happy to go back to my original vote on Chuth. Nice to see some more activiteh

vote Chuth

[Chuth]

a "random" bandwagon would be if i hadnt given any reason for my vote on chuth.
in my eyes my vote is justified and i would had voted him even if there is 0 or just 1 vote on him.

The only "evidence" i had at this time is the dialogue that has was there when i first came.

With the reactions towards my accusation i think i am right about chuth but wrong about Javu.
In my eyes, Chuth's reaction was this old "i vote you because you voted me" behavior.

Not at all, read page one. He hadn't even said anything against me, let alone voted against me. I voted nomes based on my own reasons, not because he voted me.

[Bwomp]

Not at all, read page one. He hadn't even said anything against me, let alone voted against me. I voted nomes based on my own reasons, not because he voted me.

no. you all got it wrong.
i am talking about Chuth's reaction, after he saw i voted him.

[Bwomp]

OMG OMG OMG OMG. i mistook, chtuh for TheJoo -.-

i dont know how i mixed that up but i was thinking the whole time that this post was Chuth's one.
>_<


I just voted Chuth because he was the most suspicious at the time - Javu pointed out his post, and i agreed that it wasn't right - under any circumstance, i find that Nomes would have survived the night. If Nomes is Hellbourne, he would of course survived the night. If he is Legion, he would have still survived the night because of reasons given, even if is Jereziah himself.

i think bandwagoning is the stupidest idea possible in a game like this where if we can only lynch incorrectly twice, so i now change my vote to Bwomp.

[ShadowExile]

I'm happy to keep voting TheJoo, just sayin'.

[ShadowExile]

Nothing against you TheJoo, well, except that I am half German.

*DUN DUN DUN*

[Naib]

Someone has to go
Change vote:

vote Chuth

[Vahn]

Votes

Key: Player name (Number of votes against player) - List of players who voted.

Chuth (4) - Bwomp, Javu, Naib, NomesWisdom
Bwomp (1) - TheJoo
NomesWisdom (1) - Chuth
TheJoo (1) - ShadowExile

Players who haven't voted yet:

With 4 votes Chuth (Imp) has been lynched!

Night
It is now night time, night will last until all power roles have made their actions and the hellbourne killed someone or 48 hours passes.

[Vahn]

Day 2
Night has ended and the villagers wake up to find NomesWisdom (Sapling) has died during the night.

[ShadowExile]

Well ****, Jeraziah failed.

[TheJoo]

Guys, we are possibly MYLO. Chuth seemed HB but we cannot be sure with only a 1/3 chance of him being the actual imp. we must vote correctly or risk losing.

[Bwomp]

Before anything else we need a Jereziah claim.
(and hopefully no counterclaim.)

I'm either Sapling or Predator.

Chuth was either Imp or Predator.

Nomes was a sure Sapling.

Before i can make more suspicions i need the Jereziah claim.

[Naib]

Before anything else we need a Jereziah claim.
(and hopefully no counterclaim.)

I'm either Sapling or Predator.

Chuth was either Imp or Predator.

Nomes was a sure Sapling.

Before i can make more suspicions i need the Jereziah claim.

You sure that is a good idea? Had Jera successfully protected Nome (or Ryper7 on day1) I would agree now would be a great time for him to be revealed, but now?


Best case:
Legion:Hellborne
4:1
jera,pred,pred,sapling: Puppet
This is the best odds and Legion can win this especially if Jera comes forward the legion can afford to fail-lynch and still win

IF puppet counter-claimed to be jera then Legion have to gank one of these two and they either win or they know who is puppet by the next day (win via attrition)



Worst case:
3:2
jera,pred,sapling : puppet, imp
Very bad. If Jera comes forward he is sure to die in the night. The odds are better to get a hellborn but at a very high cost putting the hellborne in a stronger position

[Naib]

Basically should we take the gamble that Chuth as hellborne and have jera come forward

[Javu]

Wow fail by jere. I honestly don't see any reason for him to come forward unless he's being threatened. There's not much point having a clear if he's not going to die during the day and he's going to end up dead at night

[Bwomp]

Imo. Chuth was a real HB.

ShadowExile or Javu is Puppetmaster.

Cant tell (yet) why. will explain later.

[ShadowExile]

Sounds like useless garbage you're spewing out there Bwomp. Chuth had nothing indicating he was a real HB, but we lynched him because it was a Day 1 lynch. But furthermore, you admitted your own mistake on Chuth and that it was actually TheJoo who said the "suspicious" thing to you. I agreed, TheJoo was suspicious, and Chuth/Javu came in second as who I believed the Hellbourne were, but then before we could have more discussion about it, Chuth was hammered and killed.

There were 6 players I believe, scout, jera, 2x saps and 2x preds, which means there is a 1/2 chance of voting off a Predator who believes himself to be a Sapling, and get the Imp down. So treating all predators like imps, it is a 1/3 chance of hitting a real imp, but we will believe we definitely got it straight away. I think it is probably actually the case that we got Chuth as a Predator, so we need to treat this like LYLO, and be careful.

Something said this round arouses my suspicious a bit though:

"I'm either Sapling or Predator." - said by Bwomp

Are you kidding me mate? Everyone is going to be saying this at this point. Jeraziah is going to be saying this in case we are in the worse case scenario as he has failed to protect anybody and we might not actually have killed a Hellbourne with Chuth. The Hellbourne (possibly 2 of them) will say this, as they have no other claims available to them, and if they claimed Jeraziah, we'd have a 1/2 chance of lynching a Hellbourne once Jeraziah came out, not a 1/5 chance. Then of course, everyone who got the role of being Sapling knows that they are either Saplings or Predators.

So let's put it in the worst case scenario. There are 5 players left, and 2 positions for people to try and group into. (This is assuming Chuth is pred, as Nome the other sapling is already dead).

5 people are trying to convince everyone they are either Sapling or Predator, though we could probably narrow that down to 4, as Jeraziah can always just claim Jeraziah reasonably trying to hide who he was. This is why it is pointless to do claims, we can just assume that the claims is how they are. You pointing out, "I'm a sapling or predator" just makes it clear that you're trying to appeal to everyone where it's not necessary about what you are. That sounds to me like something a Hellbourne would try, and to be honest, the whole game you've been trying to control it and (explain why) later.

This is 66.6% chance a LYLO game. Right now, this IS the last day. All information that people have should be laid out on the table right now so we can hurry the **** up and win this game. Not doing so makes you immediately scummy in my eyes. Bwomp, I'm watching you.

[TheJoo]

My opinions:

Javu - I have mixed reads. Now, on the first day, he initiated the vote on Chuth, but did it in a suspicious way - Making a suspicious post and then waiting for people to jump on it. surely, this is the best way to avoid suspicion but cause a bandwagon on a person a hellbourne would obviously know to be legion. If Chuth was a normal sapling/Jereziah, i would vote you in an instant, but with the possibilty of chuth being the real imp, I will only vote him if given extra info.

Naib - has seemed legion other than his final vote on Chuth. He's pretty hard to read, since although his posts have been helpful, they haven't been specifically useful. I don't know about him. Possibly Jereziah, seeing that he has said nothing much to turn heads -at the same time, a possibilty of being HB. Voted Bwomp yesterday because he was inactive at first.

Bwomp - Jereziah or HB. He hasn't said much, and he had that suspicious bandwagoning on the first day. He could just be a simple HB, saying "i know it's bandwagoning" to make his vote seem somewhat justified. As i said earlier, i find this scummy. Other than that, he hasn't said much, leading me to believe he is the possible Jere. I am happy to vote him.

ShadowExile - Constantly making big posts and seems like a Legion. However, originally tried to start a random bandwagon on me saying he had "no information". The second Nomes suggested i was HB, he changed his mind on having "no information" and followed Nome's opinion. I had said nothing else between that post and my first one on day 2, giving not much reason to change his mind other than blindly following nomes. Nomes has now been proven legion because of his death, but i find following a player blindly with no assurance of that person being Legion is typical for a hellbourne - choose most influential player, follow blindly. Possibly Jereziah, being the first one to say anything about his fail.

IMO, i find Bwomp & Shadow to be the most likely Hellbourne, but i find everyone atleast slightly likely.

[Bwomp]

The problem which i just noticed with ShadowExile is:

He insisted (in post #65) that he didnt want the lynch on Chuth and wanted more discussion, but the kill was hammered.
If you look back at the final post on Day 1, it was Naib who finished it, but: ShadowExile had just stated before that, that he is happy to keep voting "TheJoo".

If you had really wanted to keep this discussion alive, you would have told.

a.) Chuth was Predator and Shadow is Hellbourne, happy that a Legion member was killed.

b.) Chuth was Imp and Shadow is Legion
c.) Chuth was Imp and Shadow is Puppet. In this case he wouldnt want to arouse suspicion on him by asking us to stop voting him (his ally). If we had still voted him it would seem quite obvious that he was defending his ally.

[ShadowExile]

My opinions:

Javu - I have mixed reads. Now, on the first day, he initiated the vote on Chuth, but did it in a suspicious way - Making a suspicious post and then waiting for people to jump on it. surely, this is the best way to avoid suspicion but cause a bandwagon on a person a hellbourne would obviously know to be legion. If Chuth was a normal sapling/Jereziah, i would vote you in an instant, but with the possibilty of chuth being the real imp, I will only vote him if given extra info.

Naib - has seemed legion other than his final vote on Chuth. He's pretty hard to read, since although his posts have been helpful, they haven't been specifically useful. I don't know about him. Possibly Jereziah, seeing that he has said nothing much to turn heads -at the same time, a possibilty of being HB. Voted Bwomp yesterday because he was inactive at first.

Bwomp - Jereziah or HB. He hasn't said much, and he had that suspicious bandwagoning on the first day. He could just be a simple HB, saying "i know it's bandwagoning" to make his vote seem somewhat justified. As i said earlier, i find this scummy. Other than that, he hasn't said much, leading me to believe he is the possible Jere. I am happy to vote him.

ShadowExile - Constantly making big posts and seems like a Legion. However, originally tried to start a random bandwagon on me saying he had "no information". The second Nomes suggested i was HB, he changed his mind on having "no information" and followed Nome's opinion. I had said nothing else between that post and my first one on day 2, giving not much reason to change his mind other than blindly following nomes. Nomes has now been proven legion because of his death, but i find following a player blindly with no assurance of that person being Legion is typical for a hellbourne - choose most influential player, follow blindly. Possibly Jereziah, being the first one to say anything about his fail.

IMO, i find Bwomp & Shadow to be the most likely Hellbourne, but i find everyone atleast slightly likely.

To be honest it was Day 1, random votes and seeing how people react to things is one of the only scum hunting devices people have. That is why I did random vote you. Now I'm still suspicious of you, but lately Bwomp has been really been tickling my scum-senses, so I agree with you on that one. Here's what I'm going to do, I shall vote Bwomp and please people, let's not bandwagon on this one before he gets a chance to explain about everything he's not told us about yet but "will explain later".

Now's the time for the information to come out Bwomp, and only if your excuse is good will I think about changing this vote. Don't really have much else to go on since nobody really knows who anyone is at the moment and everyone is claiming Sapling/Pred since this would be a terrible time for Jeraziah to come out.

[Bwomp]

i think it is really remarkable, that you still accuse without even THINKING of justifying yourself.

if you dare to ask a concrete question i will answer it as honestly as possible.

[Bwomp]

care:
I will not be able to reply to anything in the next time. (24h +/- 7h)
i'm not dodging anything, but got to go party :)

dont do anything stupid while im away!!!!!!!!!

[TheJoo]

This is going nowhere.

I'm going to place my vote on Bwomp because everyone seems to be lurking, so i will go with the first of my two suspects as i have already stated.

Vote:Bwomp

[Javu]

i think it is really remarkable, that you still accuse without even THINKING of justifying yourself.

if you dare to ask a concrete question i will answer it as honestly as possible.
He's just pressuring you for information, nothing wrong with that.
As far as concrete questions, you said me or shadow was puppet but couldn't explain why now. An explanation now would be quite useful

[Naib]

My opinions:

...

Naib - has seemed legion other than his final vote on Chuth. He's pretty hard to read, since although his posts have been helpful, they haven't been specifically useful. I don't know about him. Possibly Jereziah, seeing that he has said nothing much to turn heads -at the same time, a possibilty of being HB. Voted Bwomp yesterday because he was inactive at first.

..


Day1 was a random vote to get a feel for what people were doing (its day one not alot can be read), I changed my vote as it seemed the general concensus was something was up with Chuth & the Day phase was stalling. We may have been right or he may have been a pred so only time will tell.

Yes I have been more technical rather than more analytical in peoples responses but thats only because I am trying to figure out who is telling half-truths to sway general opinion one way or another.


As a result I am vote Bwomp
Why? He is calling for a Jera reveal when that would only serve Hellborne (had Jera sucessfully protected someone I would agree Jera coming forward would be a good idea).
Likewise he went off on one against Chuth a couple of pages back (drumming up support for a lynch against him) when it was a case of mistaken identity in posting, a bit too convenient

[Vahn]

Votes

Key: Player name (Number of votes against player) - List of players who voted.

Bwomp (3) - Naib, ShadowExile, TheJoo

Players who haven't voted yet: Bwomp, Javu

With 3 votes on Bwomp (Imp) day 2 ends.

Game Over!
Since both Bwomp and Chuth are Predator this brings us to 2 legion; Javu (Jeraziah), ShadowExile (Sapling), and 2 hellbourne; TheJoo (Puppet Master), Naib (Imp), left which means Hellbourne wins!.

Well done to all players, When werewolf V3 ends I'll be hosting again for more games.

Hellbourne chat
For anyone who wants to read it, here is the hellbourne chat topic.
http://www.quicktopic.com/46/H/w824esfraNmS

Power Role Actions
Ryper7 (Scout): Find players affiliation.

Night #|Player used on
1|NomesWisdom

Javu (Jeraziah): Protect player

Night #|Player used on
1|NomesWisdom
2|Naib

[Javu]

Urgh, well it was a quick fun game everyone.

To explain my play, night 1 I was very very close to protecting Ryper but decided to go the 'safe' option and protect Nomes. I figured that HB would most likely not target Nomes as he would obviously be protected by Jereziah, and out of the playing list I would personally take out Ryper 2nd all bias aside. However I didn't want to take any risks and decided last minute to go for Nomes.

Night 2 I figured that HB were taking the conservative option and were too worried to go for Nomes, so I decided to take a gamble and protect Naib based on

Naib is very likely Jeraziah
the fact Nomes said he was likely to be Jere. I was hoping the HB would listen to this and go for Naib. Obviously in hind sight that wouldn't happen as Naib was scum.

Looking back that should've rang some alarm bells in my head, but I simply figured HB thought Nomes was Jere and thats why they targeted him.

Anyway GG well played

[TheJoo]

I would have never gone for Naib in this case even if he wasn't scum.

You see, even if you did protect nomes - it made basicaly no difference other than the help Nomes gives to legion. you would have been LYLO whatever.

[Lucian01]

Jeeze that was fast.

[Bwomp]

...
and i said dont do anything stupid while im gone...
Q.q
gg wp :)

[Ryper7]

ugh, it sucked so much getting lynched night 1. I was going to claim day 1, giving legion a free clear with a constantly protected scout. would have been a pretty good setup for us, although given the circumstances scout wouldnt have been too effective. The chips would have had to fall into place well for us to pull out a win with this setup.

anyway GG guys, wp, and lets hope to god this scout curse doesnt continue.

When i opened that PM and saw 'your role is Scout', i was like oh sh**.

[ElementUser]

Legion so pro in a 6-member game.

[TheJoo]

Bad luck Ryper, you were second in terms of skill and experience in this game, so you died.

[ShadowExile]

And you guys yelled at me for suspecting TheJoo

Next time just let me do my German thing and kill him :P

[Bwomp]

but if you are "half" german, im even better with my full-german heritage :P

[ShadowExile]

but if you are "half" german, im even better with my full-german heritage :P

Then why didn't we band together and take out the son of a *****? :scou:

[Bwomp]

Zur Hölle, woher soll ich das wissen!?

nicht desto trotz werde ich im nächsten spiel NICHT darauf bauen. Is einfach viel zu leicht das als HB auszunutzen ;)

[ShadowExile]

Yes, a setup with this many players sucks, it's far too easy for the HB to win. Though it's not like I won't play entirely, I do plan to get into V5 which I'm thinking will be the main game with like 19 players, which should still be good :)

[Octavia]

This set up is normally more town sided, but HB's night kills were pretty lucky.

[Naib]

This set up is normally more town sided, but HB's night kills were pretty lucky.

yup, with scout taken out early and mis-shielding by jera the adv was very quickly switch to HB.

[TheJoo]

Javu's misplay pretty much cost you the game, I really don't think we would have won without having nomes dead, he's far too valuable as a Legion.