Juked312
09-18-2009, 03:00 AM
The following is a scrub players opinion of how to build Maliken as a carry and the math showing that he can indeed compete and be labeled as a potential carry.
Maliken is definitely not the best carry option. He does not bring the utility other possible carry’s do (madman’s stun, arach’s constant spam slow).
Neither does not have the amazing utility some other carry’s have.
Disclaimer:
1.I am by no means a good player. I did NOT play dota. I just recently started playing hon.
2.This is not a guide on how to play Maliken or what items to get.
3.There is not a TON of math involved, but it’s used.
4. Do not get super excited at numbers posted. All DPS mathematically found could be WRONG. No one checked my math. All DPS is before armor.
Part 1: Maliken can carry?
Now if you’re still reading – let’s start the item build and math.
1.Steamboots (str) – 1,850
2.Insanitarius – 2,850
3.Shrunken Head – 3,900
4.Savage Mace – 5,400
5.Behemoth’s Heart – 5,500
6.Symbol of Rage – 6,150
Total spent: 25,650
Total Health: 4250 Total Mana: 1014
Damage (with Enchanted Flames active): 430-436
Attacks per sec with Ult active: 1.908
DPS: 433 * 1.908 = 826.164 damage per second (full health)
Damage at 2,500 health: (433 * .69 ) + (433 * .31 * 1.8) = 540.4 average damage per hit, including crits.
(2,500 health is 41.18% health missing… which equates to 31% crit)
DPS at 2,500 health: 540.4 * 1.908 = 1031 damage per second
[EDIT in response to MobZombie below I've added the DPS of the same build replacing steamboots (str) for post haste]
New Health: 4050
New Damage (with Enchanted Flames acitive): 420-426 Attacks per second with Ult active: 1.692
DPS: 423 * 1.692 = 715.7 damage per second (full health)
Average Damage with 2,500 health is:
(423 * .7123) + (423 * .2877 * 1.8) = 520.36
(2,500 health is 38.27% health missing = 28.77% crit)
DPS with 2,500 health: (520.36 * 1.692) = 880.45
Part 2: Maliken build differences!
Let’s quickly compare the difference between Glorify Maliken and this version of Maliken:
The purpose of this part is not intended pick on Glorify. His just happened to be the build that came out first, and when I started writing this.
(Aside: As a scrub player – out of all the hon guides out there: Glorify-guide’s have been the biggest help in me learning how to play at a more advanced level – as soon as I learned all the dota name equivalents he uses!)
Nor do I think his item’s are wrong. I think he is building Maliken how in his opinion he should be used. Mock is not a bad item in my opinion. If he can stomp people with it when he gets it at the 30 minute mark… then it’s a good suggestion.
1. Barrier Idol – 3,653
2. Shrunken Head – 3,900
3. Post-Haste – 2,700
4. Demonic Breastplate – 5,550
5. Behemoth’s Heart – 5,500
6. Mock of Brilliance – 5,150
Total: 26,403
Total Life: 3,110 Total Mana: 1,014
Damage (with Enchanted Flames): 290-296
Attack per sec with Ult active: 1.8
DPS: 293 * 1.8 = 527.4 damage per second (full health)
Damage at 2,500 health: (293 * .853 ) + (293 * .147 * 1.8) = 327.47 average damage per hit, including crits.
(2,500 health is 19.61% health missing… which equates to 14.7% crit)
DPS at 2,500 health: 327.47 * 1.8 = 589.4 damage per second
Big differences in builds:
10% more reduction against physical AND magical damage
Demonic breastplate is -5 armor to all enemies.
Mock does 40 AoE TRUE dps. (if your hitting at least 3 people – that’s an extra 120 unmitigated dps)
Vs.
Over 1,000 more max health (which is ignorable if you’re keeping him at 2,500)
Savage Mace mini stun and extra damage (that can crit! That I didn’t include in total dps)
Savage Mace true strike against evasion/wingbow users.
Lifesteal is huge. Get low on health? Pop shrunken, and Symbol and (with armor mitigation included) gain somewhere between 1900-2100 health in 3.5 seconds.
Biggest difference between the two is obviously the fact that the first one does almost double the damage per second assuming 2,500 health.
Final note on difference between Maliken item-builds: EVERY game is different. Never is there the “best” or “cookie-cutter” build you should be building every game. I am not claiming the first set of items are better than the second. Glorify has many many years of experience on a scrub like me. This is just a different perspective.
Part 3: Compared to other Carry’s
I’m going to compare Madman because in my opinion he’s one of the top 3, if not the best. I could compare many others, but I don’t think anyone scales as well as Madman does.
Between his enormous static crit, and ult that raises his attack speed ridiculously high, he’s many people’s definition of carry.
1. Shrunken head – 3,900
2. Steamboots (agil) - 1850
3. Shield Breaker – 4,400
4. Brutalizer – 3,100
5. Wingbow – 6,000
6. Symbol of Rage – 6,150
Total: 25,400
I realize this is not how many people would build him. I based it off a collection of different things and opinion.
Total Life: 2,772 Total Mana: 910
Damage: 327-331 Attack per sec with Ult active: 2.463
Average damage with crit: (329 * .72) + (329 * .28 * 2) = 421.12
DPS: 421.12 * 2.463 = 1037.22
Quickly take note that the DPS is almost identical.
Madman is unarguably the better carry with a better escape, chase, a stun in general… not to mention its AoE. But (1st item-build) Maliken has 1,500 more health. Which is… 50% of Madman’s total health. Pretty much the only thing Maliken has going for him is a little splash and his range.
Feel free to compare other carry’s (or the two above with different item builds!) and post them in the thread. Go to practice. Give yourself 25,000 gold. Buy items. Look at damage. Average it. Look at attacks per second. Multiply.
Not going to keep using this template because I’m lazy and it’s just a $#% load to read to get a point across.
Arachna w/ Flayer, Steamboots, Wingbow, Symbol of Rage, and Savage Mace – I can still put out a ton of damage, just not as much (no worries, I added the crit in). 968 dps, 2.4k health, 25.2k spent if you are wondering.
Thanks for reading
Maliken is definitely not the best carry option. He does not bring the utility other possible carry’s do (madman’s stun, arach’s constant spam slow).
Neither does not have the amazing utility some other carry’s have.
Disclaimer:
1.I am by no means a good player. I did NOT play dota. I just recently started playing hon.
2.This is not a guide on how to play Maliken or what items to get.
3.There is not a TON of math involved, but it’s used.
4. Do not get super excited at numbers posted. All DPS mathematically found could be WRONG. No one checked my math. All DPS is before armor.
Part 1: Maliken can carry?
Now if you’re still reading – let’s start the item build and math.
1.Steamboots (str) – 1,850
2.Insanitarius – 2,850
3.Shrunken Head – 3,900
4.Savage Mace – 5,400
5.Behemoth’s Heart – 5,500
6.Symbol of Rage – 6,150
Total spent: 25,650
Total Health: 4250 Total Mana: 1014
Damage (with Enchanted Flames active): 430-436
Attacks per sec with Ult active: 1.908
DPS: 433 * 1.908 = 826.164 damage per second (full health)
Damage at 2,500 health: (433 * .69 ) + (433 * .31 * 1.8) = 540.4 average damage per hit, including crits.
(2,500 health is 41.18% health missing… which equates to 31% crit)
DPS at 2,500 health: 540.4 * 1.908 = 1031 damage per second
[EDIT in response to MobZombie below I've added the DPS of the same build replacing steamboots (str) for post haste]
New Health: 4050
New Damage (with Enchanted Flames acitive): 420-426 Attacks per second with Ult active: 1.692
DPS: 423 * 1.692 = 715.7 damage per second (full health)
Average Damage with 2,500 health is:
(423 * .7123) + (423 * .2877 * 1.8) = 520.36
(2,500 health is 38.27% health missing = 28.77% crit)
DPS with 2,500 health: (520.36 * 1.692) = 880.45
Part 2: Maliken build differences!
Let’s quickly compare the difference between Glorify Maliken and this version of Maliken:
The purpose of this part is not intended pick on Glorify. His just happened to be the build that came out first, and when I started writing this.
(Aside: As a scrub player – out of all the hon guides out there: Glorify-guide’s have been the biggest help in me learning how to play at a more advanced level – as soon as I learned all the dota name equivalents he uses!)
Nor do I think his item’s are wrong. I think he is building Maliken how in his opinion he should be used. Mock is not a bad item in my opinion. If he can stomp people with it when he gets it at the 30 minute mark… then it’s a good suggestion.
1. Barrier Idol – 3,653
2. Shrunken Head – 3,900
3. Post-Haste – 2,700
4. Demonic Breastplate – 5,550
5. Behemoth’s Heart – 5,500
6. Mock of Brilliance – 5,150
Total: 26,403
Total Life: 3,110 Total Mana: 1,014
Damage (with Enchanted Flames): 290-296
Attack per sec with Ult active: 1.8
DPS: 293 * 1.8 = 527.4 damage per second (full health)
Damage at 2,500 health: (293 * .853 ) + (293 * .147 * 1.8) = 327.47 average damage per hit, including crits.
(2,500 health is 19.61% health missing… which equates to 14.7% crit)
DPS at 2,500 health: 327.47 * 1.8 = 589.4 damage per second
Big differences in builds:
10% more reduction against physical AND magical damage
Demonic breastplate is -5 armor to all enemies.
Mock does 40 AoE TRUE dps. (if your hitting at least 3 people – that’s an extra 120 unmitigated dps)
Vs.
Over 1,000 more max health (which is ignorable if you’re keeping him at 2,500)
Savage Mace mini stun and extra damage (that can crit! That I didn’t include in total dps)
Savage Mace true strike against evasion/wingbow users.
Lifesteal is huge. Get low on health? Pop shrunken, and Symbol and (with armor mitigation included) gain somewhere between 1900-2100 health in 3.5 seconds.
Biggest difference between the two is obviously the fact that the first one does almost double the damage per second assuming 2,500 health.
Final note on difference between Maliken item-builds: EVERY game is different. Never is there the “best” or “cookie-cutter” build you should be building every game. I am not claiming the first set of items are better than the second. Glorify has many many years of experience on a scrub like me. This is just a different perspective.
Part 3: Compared to other Carry’s
I’m going to compare Madman because in my opinion he’s one of the top 3, if not the best. I could compare many others, but I don’t think anyone scales as well as Madman does.
Between his enormous static crit, and ult that raises his attack speed ridiculously high, he’s many people’s definition of carry.
1. Shrunken head – 3,900
2. Steamboots (agil) - 1850
3. Shield Breaker – 4,400
4. Brutalizer – 3,100
5. Wingbow – 6,000
6. Symbol of Rage – 6,150
Total: 25,400
I realize this is not how many people would build him. I based it off a collection of different things and opinion.
Total Life: 2,772 Total Mana: 910
Damage: 327-331 Attack per sec with Ult active: 2.463
Average damage with crit: (329 * .72) + (329 * .28 * 2) = 421.12
DPS: 421.12 * 2.463 = 1037.22
Quickly take note that the DPS is almost identical.
Madman is unarguably the better carry with a better escape, chase, a stun in general… not to mention its AoE. But (1st item-build) Maliken has 1,500 more health. Which is… 50% of Madman’s total health. Pretty much the only thing Maliken has going for him is a little splash and his range.
Feel free to compare other carry’s (or the two above with different item builds!) and post them in the thread. Go to practice. Give yourself 25,000 gold. Buy items. Look at damage. Average it. Look at attacks per second. Multiply.
Not going to keep using this template because I’m lazy and it’s just a $#% load to read to get a point across.
Arachna w/ Flayer, Steamboots, Wingbow, Symbol of Rage, and Savage Mace – I can still put out a ton of damage, just not as much (no worries, I added the crit in). 968 dps, 2.4k health, 25.2k spent if you are wondering.
Thanks for reading