Enhanced marchers+wall of mummys

[Kulmis]

The whole idea of pharaoh is lock ur target inside wall mummys now if players just buy phaseboots your mainskill is useless or even deathtrap :(.

Mummys push units off outside of wall, why not in inside too ?

[ElementUser]

Because it doesn't function that way in DotA (yes that's the easiest response).

But Phase Boots didn't phase through cogs in DotA either, so the issue should be fixed soon by the developpers (hopefully)

[LegoPirate]

same with behes fissure.

[ZombieFewd]

I like that Phase Boots can be a counter to some of these things. Cogs wasn't phase-through-able simply because they were "buildings," and buildings can't be walked through no matter what, but this also caused some problems when it came to placement in tight spots.

[Ch1nGFuX]

Hmm...I don't recall Clockwerk in DoTA having this sort of problem(might have been that no one shops for phase boots in DoTA lol) But if I'm correct, It's because the mummies in this game are counted as units. Therefore enchanced marchers allows you to pass thru it like air. In DoTA, the crystal deathtraps he summons are counted as a structure. Behe's fissure is hard to explain...In DoTA, it leaves IMPASSABLE TERRAIN literally. Dunno about HoN...should be the same as above case.

[jack]

sort of problem(might have been that no one shops for phase boots in DoTA lol)

Yeah I noticed that too. I never got phase boots in DotA because really it wasn't worth it and because I don't buy into the new items right away (personal thing), but now everyone gets phase boots in Heroes of Newerth because of how rigged and messed up they are, if I was the developers I'd just remove them until I fixed everything about them.

[LegoPirate]

phase boots are very common on casters/tanks in dota. they are a cheap alternative to boots of travel, and have a good escape mechanism

[Karmashock]

Phase boots should remain a counter creep blocking and other unit/hero based obstruction.

[Pho3nix]

phase boots are the best but i still think phasing out of the wall of mummies is stupid lol

[Tyrando]

Needs fixing to match Clockwerk, this is the only thing that puts me off playing a pro Pharoah, and its a pretty big thing.

[antpwny]

I think they should fix it, because 1 basic item shouldn't be used to negate a skills effect like this unless it was intended to (ie shrunken head/null stone). It basically makes Pharaoh's ult+cogs+skill useless.

[MadPrivate]

Hmm...I don't recall Clockwerk in DoTA having this sort of problem(might have been that no one shops for phase boots in DoTA lol) But if I'm correct, It's because the mummies in this game are counted as units. Therefore enchanced marchers allows you to pass thru it like air. In DoTA, the crystal deathtraps he summons are counted as a structure. Behe's fissure is hard to explain...In DoTA, it leaves IMPASSABLE TERRAIN literally. Dunno about HoN...should be the same as above case.

Fissure in DoTA is actully counted as trees, so u could "phase" thru them or even "cut" them down with Beast Master's axes.

[Fleder]

...But Phase Boots didn't phase through cogs in DotA either, so the issue should be fixed soon by the developpers (hopefully)

definitely
thats really annoying if you play pharaoh

[krucifix]

Fissure in DoTA is actully counted as trees, so u could "phase" thru them or even "cut" them down with Beast Master's axes.

Not any more. I just tested it, while Merc can phase through, BM can't knock the Fissure down (which means I assume they're buildings).

[Overwhelmed]

I think it is fine to leave it like this, although they should add a recipe cost.

[init]

Please fix this, Pharao/Clockwerk doesn't need this nerf. For Behemoth/ES, on the other hand, it's a reasonable nerf for the best team fight hero in DotA.

[Bosmare]

phaseboots are already sick without these small (bugged) buffs. GEt this fixed so pharaoh becomes cool to play.

[EpiX_Whiner]

Indeed! sucks big time when you make a perfect catch and they just run out :&

Enhanced Marchs needs a nerf
90% of players got it every game !!!

[Grimace]

I'm on board with an adjustment to Pharoah's and Behemoth's skills so that you can't pass through them with Enhanced Marchers. But I still think everybody would abuse them.

[Karmashock]

Enhanced Marchs needs a nerf
90% of players got it every game !!!
that doesn't make any sense as an argument.

there are only three types of boots beyond the most basic marchers.

steam boots give you a minor boost to speed beyond marchers, a moderate boost to one of the three stats, and increased attack speed. Generally, steam boots are only appropriate on units that need more attack speed. AGI carries that rely on life steal or some units with attack modifiers with no cool down.

Everyone that doesn't need to get their attack speed as high as possible gets something else.


There are then only TWO options.


Option one is phaseboots which are relatively cheaper then steamboots OR boots of travel. Phase boots are faster then steam boots, allow creepwalking, and offer a little bit of armor.

Option two is boots of travel which are difficult to build because the price if almost entirely in one lump sum for the recipe. This is typically a late game item and is generally good for all heroes that are well farmed and need extra mobility.



Ergo, considering that these are your only choices, why is it in anyway surprising that phase boots are bought repeatedly? If you want more variation in footwear, then provide more options. I think it would be great if there were 8 different types of shoes each with their own properties. For example, some blink boots that included portal key as a component. Or a trample boot that did AoE damage along a path and moved you that way quickly... sort of like Kraken's charge. or some invisibility boots that gave no damage increase like the shroud but instead gave an increased movement speed boost while invisible.

the specifics are things to be worked out in balance. But the point is that we should probably have a wider selection of footwear.

[pedobearpig]

enhanced marchers should not allow you to pass through Mummies and Fissure. makes them ENTIRELY too good.

[noodle0117]

We need more boots

[Karmashock]

enhanced marchers should not allow you to pass through Mummies and Fissure. makes them ENTIRELY too good.
Except for all heroes with blink abilities can do it already. Kraken can get out, magebane can get out, magmus can get out, dark lady can get out, etc.


Fissure has a lot of counters to it and the behemoth is pretty powerful as it is... he doesn't really need a buff... and nerfing marchers would be a buff.


As to the mummies, do you really think that people should be trapped in a mummy wall with no way out? Because if you give them that buff the duration is going to have to be drastically reduced.

[pedobearpig]

it worked perfectly fine in dota. iirc these are known bugs and S2 will fix them sooner or later. so i guess this is a moot point.

[Brad1]

afaik marchers doesn't let you walk through mummies anymore, I tried it a while ago.

[ElementUser]

afaik marchers doesn't let you walk through mummies anymore, I tried it a while ago.

I just played a game today with my allied Pharaoh, and enemies/allies can still phase through it :/

[Brad1]

oh, frig