Demented Shaman's Heal/Nuke

[kuru1]

Dazzle's (Demented Shaman's counterpart from DotA) heal did AT MOST 140 heal to 5 separate targets and hurt enemies nearby for AT MOST 140 damage to a single unit.

In HoN, Demented Shaman's heal will heal allies/nuke enemies around the healed unit for 140*5 = 700 damage as long as there are 5 creeps nearby.

PLEASE FIX. This guy gets a healing AoE Laguna for 110 mana with 6 second cooldown at level 7.

[Vanilla]

Pretty tough to have that scenario happen every 6 seconds

[kuru1]

Pretty tough to have that scenario happen every 6 seconds


Does it matter? Having it happen even once is ridiculous. A 700 AoE nonultimate heal/nuke with low manacost and low CD in any scenario is ridiculous. And how is having 5 creeps/allied units nearby a tough scenario to have happen?

[Vanilla]

The aoe on the damage is very small

[RenoFox]

Working as intended. That's the way it was in DotA too. You can be hit 5 times, but really, unless your doing something wrong you should not be hit.

[kuru1]

I tested this in DotA, no matter the positioning I could never get more than 140 damage to hit a single target.

[LegoPirate]

with dazzle its max 140 damage to any target.

imo this is a good thing, makes demented a decent hero.

[Halo1]

Its definitely not 140 max to any target in dota... it was easy to push with dazzle if you wanted just by using that heal once a wave as it would almost entirely knockout the oposing one. it was also amazing for baiting because you just had to let yourself get low and allow a melee hero to come and try and get you while he gets surrounded by creeps and then dies because of how much damage it does.... but honestly, a half decent player will almost never have this happen

[ChaosAxess]

don't stand by the creeps then. The more friendly units around for him to heal, the harder he can nuke you

l2p

[Mellow]

Nobody here understand the reason why this works in HoN but not in Dota.

In Dota, enemies surrounding the people you heal will only get as much damage as they will be healed. For example, if you heal a solo creep missing only 32 health, all enemies surrounding him will lose 32 health.
However, in HoN they will always lose 140 health (at max level, naturally). This means that using it on a creep wave will have far more effect, since creeps are usually at near full health when you want to nuke with it.

[kuru1]

Nobody here understand the reason why this works in HoN but not in Dota.

In Dota, enemies surrounding the people you heal will only get as much damage as they will be healed. For example, if you heal a solo creep missing only 32 health, all enemies surrounding him will lose 32 health.
However, in HoN they will always lose 140 health (at max level, naturally). This means that using it on a creep wave will have far more effect, since creeps are usually at near full health when you want to nuke with it.


Hmm, I think this sounds like the cause. Even if all 5 creeps are at full health, enemy will take the full brunt of the nuke, whereas in DotA the 5 creeps all need to be down at least 140 health?

[noi_nai_tan]

Hmm, I think this sounds like the cause. Even if all 5 creeps are at full health, enemy will take the full brunt of the nuke, whereas in DotA the 5 creeps all need to be down at least 140 health?

That's the correct interpretation.

[kuru1]

That's the correct interpretation.

Ah, well fix please. I was wondering why Dazzle never seemed to assrape me in lane the way Demented Shaman does.

[Llama]

I agree with Archedgar, while his lane presence early game can be good, the heal quickly becomes useless lvl15+, entangle is more or less a mediocre stun, and the arcane hide is near useless with its newer changes

[kuru1]

don't stand by the creeps then. The more friendly units around for him to heal, the harder he can nuke you

l2p

And lol @ 0.8:1 46% winning talking trash.

[kuru1]

I agree with Archedgar, while his lane presence early game can be good, the heal quickly becomes useless lvl15+, entangle is more or less a mediocre stun, and the arcane hide is near useless with its newer changes

His lane presence is borderline ridiculous though...I got stunned by a Mag at level 7 and he started his ult, I did entangle -> heal and he died instantly...

A Demented Shaman in a lane right now pretty much guarantees that any melee hero there is going to get his **** rocked.

[Animal`]

His lane presence is borderline ridiculous though...I got stunned by a Mag at level 7 and he started his ult, I did entangle -> heal and he died instantly...

A Demented Shaman in a lane right now pretty much guarantees that any melee hero there is going to get his **** rocked.

That's the same for jereziah, accursed, and magmas...
Except their skills are passives and don't even cost mana.
Shaman is Broken?
No.

[LiquorQ]

Demented Shaman is actually one of the weaker heroes, he stands in the shadow of Jereziah.

If anything, he needs buffs, not nerfs.



...
That's not true, him and Jereziah play 2 different roles all together. Sure they're both support, but Demented Shaman is the superior babysitter/supportive healer. While Jereziah is more of an immortal...thing?

[Grigden]

And lol @ 0.8:1 46% winning talking trash.

its the people with scores like .8:1 who get that score playing support, and we're the ones who make lamers that only play carries, like you, able to get your kills. people like us are the ones playing demented shaman too, so next time you target gets slowed, then stunned, send some gold and candy to the 'noob' with the low k:d who just gave you a kill

as some other ugy said, the aoe on the heals dmg is quite small, the enemy has to be standing on the wave to get hit by it, and thats not so common middle to late game.

it seems like sometimes it does a lot more damamge to creepwaves than others, but anytime a support disabler can farm better, thats a good day

[Vodka]

140x5=700

Yep, that sounds about right. Unless you're in a cluster**** of creeps (i.e. doing it wrong), only enemy creeps should be worrying about that. But since the aoe is so small on the damage, you can't even take out a creepwave from full all the time.

[Daaadom]

Demented is fine atm .... only thing he needs is a buff to "arcan hide" !!!

If you stupid enough to go into a full 5 man creepwave when being a melee and facing demented, then you deserve a "first blood" !!!

It is like going into a dog fight with Axe/Legionair when you play a low HP fast attacking hero and get owned by blades !!!

3.......2.......1........ your fault !!!

Demented is very nice to play and needs his early lane dominance !!!

I am asking myself often, what all the HoN players will say when they
implement "Nerub, Ench, Necro, Viper .... and his friends" with a real
Lane Dominance !!! ???

My 2 cents

PLZ CLOSE

[kingcomrade]

His skill is buffed from DotA and this is a good thing. In DotA is was a very situational nuke.

[_Archangel_]

That's not true, him and Jereziah play 2 different roles all together. Sure they're both support, but Demented Shaman is the superior babysitter/supportive healer. While Jereziah is more of an immortal...thing?

They are both supportive healers. Jereziah is in fact better at it, while Demented Shaman is the better babysitter due to his more spammable heal and ranged harassment capabilities. Also Jereziah is not immortal, because if you're casting Shield on yourself you're doing it wrong.

So at the start, Demented Shaman is more of a babysitter while Jereziah is good at complementing a strong offensive lane partner, and mid-late they both are support-healers.

[Cloudywolf]

I like him the way he is now, lots more fun.

[Verbati]

as many people said, keep the heal as it is now, actually possible to do dmg with demented, not just standing giving a heal that is "crap" (low) :)

[Watever]

The nuke itself works exactly the same as in DotA, if anything has changed, it's the AoE (no surprise there since AoE and collision sizes sure as Hell are, at least, slightly different from DotA).